Autoblog.com Review - 2013 Subaru BRZ

[powertrip]

Originally Posted by Double4Free

I doubt itll be 280 hp :| even if they do come out with it itll be like 250 hp max. And thats in like 2 - 3 years. Not waiting for that :[

It's not the numbers im searching for, its the engine from the factory with FI in mind. Even if it just had 240 I'll take a factory boosted motor over having to deal with NA to FI conversions. It's a lot more fun (IMO) modding a car that came with FI, than tuning NA cars in my experience. And generally that first extra bit of HP comes a lot cheaper than they do in NA as well.

It's not the paper numbers I want out of this car. Its the opportunity for it to grow later on into a nice solid platform I want to keep. Unfortunately I end up getting bored with my cars after a few years and love to tinker a bit and kick them up a notch in the performance category in the garage.

[Subaruwrxfan]

Interesting that the lead engineer specified that the front tires have to stay 215 but that the rears can fit up to 235...
Also, the way he was talking about 280hp was before they even started talking about the turbo. There's gotta be a bunch of potential in this motor N/A. Hoping the aftermarket figures it out sooner rather than later. I'm fine with 200, but I would certainly welcome 250-280 as well.

[86'd]

This has been said but:

It sounds like they'll just put the next WRX engine in it.

And I'm sure it'll be way into the $30's when it does come out. They'll have to put wider wheels, stickier rubber, bigger brakes, at the very least. A Limited BRZ with 280hp could easily be $35k+.

Again, I don't need to have more power, but it's nice to know that Subaru is thinking about it and that the FA platform is there and compatible with the other models. Though I'm sure the new WRX engine is going to be strengthened compared to the BRZ's engine.

But I don't want to get caught up in that. N/A is what I'd prefer and this is just another review that suggests that the BRZ does what it's supposed to do.

[ashtray]

There was talk last year that the Subaru version would have "less than 300hp", and Toyota's would have about 200hp. The numbers themselves aren't as telling as the suggestion that they would be different. It's very possible that a 280hp Subaru version has already been worked out, but maybe they felt to hold that back a bit - or that if the Subaru was so much more powerful than the Toyota, it would kill Toyota's sales.

I'm sure there were price point discussions as well, and maybe Toyota is thinking to go in a different direction than Subaru for more power and they decided to just both start with identical cars, then develop them on their own moving forwards. Maybe Subaru will increase redline and/or displacement while Toyota will add FI.

Very interesting to hear the 280hp figure thrown out and to look back to the "less than 300hp" quoted last year. Really sounds to me they're holding back, and a hotter version is on the way. (18" wheels, upgraded/lowered suspension, more hp, mechanical diff, etc). That said - if the Limited costs $28k now, any performance pkg would push that well over $30k. Everyone is crying for turbo, etc - but who's willing to pay for it?

[Khyron686]

Originally Posted by Subaruwrxfan

Interesting that the lead engineer specified that the front tires have to stay 215 but that the rears can fit up to 235...
Also, the way he was talking about 280hp was before they even started talking about the turbo. There's gotta be a bunch of potential in this motor N/A. Hoping the aftermarket figures it out sooner rather than later. I'm fine with 200, but I would certainly welcome 250-280 as well.

I found this REALLY interesting, as I thought the 215s were more for squeezing a bit more mpg for the EPA test and that 225 would be the more realistic setup.

The Mustang ran into the same problem where the fronts needed to be quite skinny (relative) to maintain decent steering feel. Definitely don't want to screw that up.

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by ashtray

Very interesting to hear the 280hp figure thrown out and to look back to the "less than 300hp" quoted last year. Really sounds to me they're holding back, and a hotter version is on the way. (18" wheels, upgraded/lowered suspension, more hp, mechanical diff, etc). That said - if the Limited costs $28k now, any performance pkg would push that well over $30k. Everyone is crying for turbo, etc - but who's willing to pay for it?

Could offer the performance pkg on top of the premium version and drop the heated seats, fog lights, ACC, spoiler, leather seats...etc. If the Premium starts at $25k, I wonder if they could do a performance package for ~+$7k? The current WRX has a $7k premium over a similarly spec'd Impreza Premium. Subtract out the $1500-2000 for the premium to limited upgrade and I think you could potentially get one around $30k? Or is that too much mental masturbation?

[tachi1247]

Originally Posted by ashtray

There was talk last year that the Subaru version would have "less than 300hp", and Toyota's would have about 200hp. The numbers themselves aren't as telling as the suggestion that they would be different. It's very possible that a 280hp Subaru version has already been worked out, but maybe they felt to hold that back a bit - or that if the Subaru was so much more powerful than the Toyota, it would kill Toyota's sales.

I'm sure there were price point discussions as well, and maybe Toyota is thinking to go in a different direction than Subaru for more power and they decided to just both start with identical cars, then develop them on their own moving forwards. Maybe Subaru will increase redline and/or displacement while Toyota will add FI.

Very interesting to hear the 280hp figure thrown out and to look back to the "less than 300hp" quoted last year. Really sounds to me they're holding back, and a hotter version is on the way. (18" wheels, upgraded/lowered suspension, more hp, mechanical diff, etc). That said - if the Limited costs $28k now, any performance pkg would push that well over $30k. Everyone is crying for turbo, etc - but who's willing to pay for it?

I would definitely be willing to pay for it. I'm looking for a 370Z competitor with 4 seats so this would be perfect.

lots of signs point to a turbo version eventually....hopefully it comes out with the next model year and they don't make us wait for a refresh.

[Turbowned]

It's like beating a dead horse:

[poormans_LFA]

Originally Posted by Turbowned

It's like beating a dead horse:

inevitable truth for humans: enough is never enough. i'm just glad the car is here. turbo no turbo.

[JohnnyR]

Originally Posted by Subaruwrxfan

Interesting that the lead engineer specified that the front tires have to stay 215 but that the rears can fit up to 235...
Also, the way he was talking about 280hp was before they even started talking about the turbo. There's gotta be a bunch of potential in this motor N/A. Hoping the aftermarket figures it out sooner rather than later. I'm fine with 200, but I would certainly welcome 250-280 as well.

Doubt it. It was a tie in. I highly doubt that there will be a 280hp NA motor for this car as it's already pushing the limits of CR, and for the power to get up that high it would have to become even higher revving, with a far narrower powerband, and it's DD capability will have gone to squat.

That 280hp figure is a direct guesstimate what the new WRX would clock in at using this motor in Turbo form.

Subaru took it to heart when people dogged them on power. That's great and all with it's handling, it's much appreciated, but it lacks power to be competitive with other cars on the tracks/courses, and I'm sure the "shootouts" will show this easily.

People here bought the "fun to drive, who needs power" marketing Toybaru put out there. They'll sell every car they can make, some to the fanboys, some to those in the know who want a non-boring daily beater with good MPG, while many will go to the window shoppers based on looks alone.

I'm sure this car was planned from Subaru to be FI from the get go actually, and that they made a gentleman's agreement with Toyota not to do a proper STI at launch.

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by JohnnyR

Doubt it. It was a tie in. I highly doubt that there will be a 280hp NA motor for this car as it's already pushing the limits of CR, and for the power to get up that high it would have to become even higher revving, with a far narrower powerband, and it's DD capability will have gone to squat.

That 280hp figure is a direct guesstimate what the new WRX would clock in at using this motor in Turbo form.

Subaru took it to heart when people dogged them on power. That's great and all with it's handling, it's much appreciated, but it lacks power to be competitive with other cars on the tracks/courses, and I'm sure the "shootouts" will show this easily.

People here bought the "fun to drive, who needs power" marketing Toybaru put out there. They'll sell every car they can make, some to the fanboys, some to those in the know who want a non-boring daily beater with good MPG, while many will go to the window shoppers based on looks alone.

I'm sure this car was planned from Subaru to be FI from the get go actually, and that they made a gentleman's agreement with Toyota not to do a proper STI at launch.

Wasn't this the issue. Tada/Toyoda disagreed with AWD and turbo. Wanted to go back to the basics. I.e. RWD and NA. As a result what we have is what we have. SOA has always said no turbo at launch.

[Spaceywilly]

I don't understand why every review of the car so far has been overwhelmingly positive, and yet people choose to dwell on the power and tires, which every reviewer has said is adequate. You would think the reviews so far had trashed on the car, when so far there has not been a single negative review. I guess people missed this part:

Long story short – and to all doubters who have only numbers on paper or computer to go by – the Subaru BRZ is one hell of a real sports car and, on roads like these, will beat the tar out of all legitimate comers selling for anywhere near the Subie's estimated $25,500, and many selling on up to $45,000. I was actually spotted shaking my head in disbelief while talking one-on-one with the BRZ's senior project manager, Toshio Masuda, following the drive. I felt as though I'd just driven a Porsche Cayman at less than half the price.

Shut up about the turbo already.

[brillo]

so the stock rims can only handle 215 in the front? I have a hard time believing that 225/45/17s wouldn't also fit. Has anyone else commented on this in a review?

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Spaceywilly

I don't understand why every review of the car so far has been overwhelmingly positive, and yet people choose to dwell on the power and tires, which every reviewer has said is adequate. You would think the reviews so far had trashed on the car, when so far there has not been a single negative review. I guess people missed this part:

Shut up about the turbo already.

I don't get it either. I want wider, stickier tires for competition use. I have zero interest in a turbo version of the car. The worst thing Subaru could do IMO is make the STI a turbo car instead of a lighter NA car with a slight bump in power, suspension and brakes. It would also cost STI money which I doubt I'm willing to pay for a BRZ anyways.

Then again I want the car for exactly what it is, not because of some numbers printed on a sheet of paper.