Stiff 2nd Gear actuation when cold on manual 6 Speed of FRS/BRZ? There's a reason!

[brad fischer]

Originally Posted by radroach

My shifter requires more throw force than I'd like, going 1st to 2nd to 3rd is too notchy, where it used to feel sweet and smooth; seamless; it's notchy, clicks into place. I'm at 5000 miles.

However, my friend at 18,000 miles in his FR-S has the smoothest action on his stick shifter. He hasn't changed the trans fluid.

Most 86's I've seen have a clicky, notchy feel; But a few I've seen have smooth buttery action. What might the case be for causing the difference in feel?.

Is there some maintenance that I could perform to fix this, perhaps the linkage or fluids? I'm bringing the issue to my dealership, and I'd like any researched opinions from the engineers on how to make the shift feel better, like it was new.

Moto-P, Thank you for all the info you have provided in this thread. But like radroach I would like to know what the transmission engineers would suggest regarding gear oil selection to improve cold shifting. I would expect Subaru/Toyota Canada to issue a TSB that would state something to the effect that due to the colder climate in Canada to improve cold shift quality for customers that complain we suggest a thinner synthetic Manual Transmission Fluid of a 70W85 for example and we found brand x to be the best. (Insert Pentosin or Redline MTL etc.) I would expect this to be covered under warranty, but if not at least a directive from Toyobaru that a new fluid is an option for colder climates, and or as a break in oil. The weather in Canada or Alaska can be a lot different than Florida or Hawaii.

[Thrilled]

Originally Posted by jdcorbitt3

Mazda started using this Gear box in the 1999 anniversary edition. It was the same. I also had the RX-8. As a second generation, it felt the same. The FT could be the third generation already. I don't think it is going to change. It takes longer to warm up the transmision and differential than the engine. Cold metal is brittle. I use the stiffness as an indicator of when the transmision is warmed up. I sheared a tooth off my pinion gear in my 1985 RX-7 being aggressive when it was cold. I have not had a gearbox issue in over 25 years using this proceedure. Almost all of my time is in Japco and Aisen transmissions with a little in Porsche, Allison, and Getrag.

John

I appreciate your seasoned input along with the "egg shell" technique you explained earlier. I have been focusing on learning anything that will improve my technique for the sake of efficiency and longevity.

Over this past (unusually wicked) winter, I've had trouble with moving the shift lever into both first and second. It always happens below freezing, but often happens when air temperatures are even 40F or 50F. It doesn't always clear up even when the engine temp reaches operating range (approx. middle of the temp gauge). It does clear up after about 15 to 20 minutes of driving regardless of outside air temp.

A related problem: I've had a few occasions where the clutch pedal was pressed to the floor board, but second (and sometimes third) would buzz when moving the shift lever. I had to press the clutch fully into the carpet and try again, successfully. However, most of the time, I find that I don't have to press the clutch that deep into the floor board to open the clutch long enough to make a shift. In fact, my father in law (who has a lifetime of MT driving experience and helped me make quantum leaps in my shifting technique) had taught me to find the point in the clutch travel where the clutch opens so that I loose less time (and less RPM drop) making the shift transition. So, can the trans temp lead to the buzzing I experienced or do I need to look into adjusting the clutch. Note, I have about 7,800 miles on it.

BTW, I have fond memories from living in Ocala. It was nice to dive any day I wanted.

[stock]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

For those who are wondering if it was normal for the FR-S/BRZ 6 speed manual's 2nd gear to be at times, stiff on a cold morning start-up...


They thought of everything! And didn't cater to people who aren't into sports cars.

Thank you my man. This is WHY I waited and waited for this ride. A car than made few compromises.

[jdcorbitt3]

Originally Posted by Thrilled

I appreciate your seasoned input along with the "egg shell" technique you explained earlier. I have been focusing on learning anything that will improve my technique for the sake of efficiency and longevity.

Over this past (unusually wicked) winter, I've had trouble with moving the shift lever into both first and second. It always happens below freezing, but often happens when air temperatures are even 40F or 50F. It doesn't always clear up even when the engine temp reaches operating range (approx. middle of the temp gauge). It does clear up after about 15 to 20 minutes of driving regardless of outside air temp.

A related problem: I've had a few occasions where the clutch pedal was pressed to the floor board, but second (and sometimes third) would buzz when moving the shift lever. I had to press the clutch fully into the carpet and try again, successfully. However, most of the time, I find that I don't have to press the clutch that deep into the floor board to open the clutch long enough to make a shift. In fact, my father in law (who has a lifetime of MT driving experience and helped me make quantum leaps in my shifting technique) had taught me to find the point in the clutch travel where the clutch opens so that I loose less time (and less RPM drop) making the shift transition. So, can the trans temp lead to the buzzing I experienced or do I need to look into adjusting the clutch. Note, I have about 7,800 miles on it.

BTW, I have fond memories from living in Ocala. It was nice to dive any day I wanted.

The buzzing could be your syncros grinding due to the oil at that temp. Once it is warmed up, it sounds like the symptoms go away. I would try Royal Purple with Syncromesh and see what that does. Still make sure that gearbox is up to temperature before getting on it. This fixed my friends 996.

I am originally from West Palm Beach, so I was at Morroso, now known as PBI raceway on a regular basis.

John

[Thrilled]

Thanks for your input!. I took a spin tonight after the car sat all day. Daytime temp was 60F, dropped to about 40F when I went out. No shifting issues at all. I think it's happening only in the morning when the temp has been low and has not started to climb (early morning). It's a regular problem in the morning, but I rarely get to try it at night after sitting still all day.

At 7000 miles I had it in the dealership for service and asked they investigate this with the engine cold in the morning. Two techs and the shop foreman were all certain they didn't find anything odd on test drives. When I picked it up, I took a ride with a tech and he finally felt the problem (late afternoon, but sub-freezing). They were supposed to call Toyota's engineers to get advice, but I had not heard back for three weeks - even after I made follow up calls…. ARRRGH.

This thread has confirmed, though, that my regular mechanic was probably right when his first guess was that new fluid was needed.

[Jond63]

When I brought my car in for its oil change, I immediately noticed smoother shifting when I picked it up. Have no idea what they put in there, and they say they didn't do anything, but I know the shifting is way smoother -- no grinding even going into 2nd during the cold mornings. Anyone know if they changed fluid spec? Greased the shift fork?

Oil change took an hour and a half, and it seemed the tech took an extended, but slow drive (I saw him driving like a grandma around the block) from the repair bay to the pickup area, makes me go hmmm...

[Mikepage]

Originally Posted by Jond63

When I brought my car in for its oil change, I immediately noticed smoother shifting when I picked it up. Have no idea what they put in there, and they say they didn't do anything, but I know the shifting is way smoother -- no grinding even going into 2nd during the cold mornings. Anyone know if they changed fluid spec? Greased the shift fork?

Oil change took an hour and a half, and it seemed the tech took an extended, but slow drive (I saw him driving like a grandma around the block) from the repair bay to the pickup area, makes me go hmmm...

Am curious to know what they have doing.

I run redline MT90 and it's smooth but stay hard during cold...

Like they say, it is thought like this...

[mweidner311]

Originally Posted by Purdue FR-S

Haha, Moto you're so awesome. :happy0180:

BOILER UP DUDE! Alumni Class of 2007!

Only owned the car for about month. I'm running Motul Gear 300 75w90 thinking that would help it. First thing in the morning I have to hit second gear twice before I'm cruising on a 55mph county rode.

I hope Moto is right cause damn its a scary feeling for a new car...

[OICU812]

I tried Motul 300 in tranny. Even when fully warm 2nd gear is a bitch as is well the entire range overall... This tranny seems to really prefer MTL or Pentosin.

[Mikepage]

Originally Posted by mweidner311

BOILER UP DUDE! Alumni Class of 2007!

Only owned the car for about month. I'm running Motul Gear 300 75w90 thinking that would help it. First thing in the morning I have to hit second gear twice before I'm cruising on a 55mph county rode.

I hope Moto is right cause damn its a scary feeling for a new car...

I think Moto is right don't worry!

[Purdue FR-S]

Originally Posted by mweidner311

BOILER UP DUDE! Alumni Class of 2007!

Only owned the car for about month. I'm running Motul Gear 300 75w90 thinking that would help it. First thing in the morning I have to hit second gear twice before I'm cruising on a 55mph county rode.

I hope Moto is right cause damn its a scary feeling for a new car...

Haha, BOILER UP!! Class of 13' here. Let's meet at Harry's and talk cars

I've been tempted to swap out the gear oil to see what happens. Guess I'm not sure I wanna add any risk yet :P

[mweidner311]

Originally Posted by Purdue FR-S

Haha, BOILER UP!! Class of 13' here. Let's meet at Harry's and talk cars

I've been tempted to swap out the gear oil to see what happens. Guess I'm not sure I wanna add any risk yet :P

I would if I could dude but I'm down in ATL now... long way to drive for beer lol

I can tell you after switching to Motul as a whole the tranny feels much smoother. There was about 7,500 miles on the factory fill when I drained it. To be honest I'm surprised how different it felt. If you're interested I see other vendors hustling it on here but Summit Racing sells it for around $17 a quart after $100 they ship it free as well and no tax. Amazon has decent prices as well.

I may try red line next time I drain it to see if that helps the early morning 2nd gear but I'm not going to sweat it its under the power train warranty anyways. Plus the ability to use the same product in the tranny and diff sold me that was convenient.

[microbionic]

i just put in motul 300 in both tranny and diff, did not seem to do anything good or bad about 2nd gear,...feels the same....

[Ray Gunnz]

Installed the arm rest, you will be very happy when you do for long trips..