Official Formula 1 thread

[torqdork]

Given the rules changes and slower cars I'm at this point more looking forward to the 3/30 IndyCar inaugural race from St. Pete now that Montoya is back in the series with Penske. I just can't get excited about watching hybrids racing.

I'll still be a fan and watch, and hope I'm wrong, but what put the damper on the year in advance for me was Alonso saying that the most important part of the race will late stage fuel, tire and battery management. Really? Not driving? It's political correctness time for F1 and I get more than enough of that in real life every day. I view and participate in motor racing for escape and entertainment, not conformity and restraint.

[cfusionpm]

It's been done in Le Mans for the last few years, and those races are exciting. After seeing what the cars can do and how different they will be to drive, I think it will still be very exciting races. The cars generate massively more torque at much lower RPMs while also getting a reduction in aero efficiency by narrowing the front and rear wings, getting rid of a lot of little aero aides that teams will desperately try to get back (like McLaren with their rear suspension). With all that in mind, spinning out mid corner or putting your foot down too early could be disastrous. Throw in reliability quirks and roll the dice strategies, and it will be interesting if nothing else.

Anything to keep Vettel from winning another 9 races in a row is a good thing to me. Because 2013 sucked balls.

[headlikeahole]

Fuel and tires have always been a deciding factor in F1. With the cars now having almost no downforce (+more torque), its more about driver skill then before. It isn't just me saying this, most of the drivers have been saying the same thing. Look for a lot of guys to be spinning out and losing control this season. People with raw driving skill like kimi, Hamilton and Alonso will have a huge advantage.

All this talk about cars being slower isn't really true either. Considering the format and engine is brand new, the cars have been going quite quick. They'll only get faster over the years so expect them to out perform the V8 units someday.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by torqdork

Given the rules changes and slower cars I'm at this point more looking forward to the 3/30 IndyCar inaugural race from St. Pete now that Montoya is back in the series with Penske. I just can't get excited about watching hybrids racing.

I'll still be a fan and watch, and hope I'm wrong, but what put the damper on the year in advance for me was Alonso saying that the most important part of the race will late stage fuel, tire and battery management. Really? Not driving? It's political correctness time for F1 and I get more than enough of that in real life every day. I view and participate in motor racing for escape and entertainment, not conformity and restraint.

The cars should have well over 1200hp though, which is WAY more than the NA engines (they are allowed to ingest 2x the air!). Maybe a little slower in the corners but the speeds they hit should be higher. I know the tires are a controversy, but fuel makes sense; If you had less power and weren't capable of burning through your fuel tank, your fuel tank is too big and you should carry less fuel, which makes fuel management relevant. The engines don't sound as good but the cars should be faster in some respects.

[torqdork]

Originally Posted by headlikeahole

Fuel and tires have always been a deciding factor in F1. With the cars now having almost no downforce (+more torque), its more about driver skill then before. It isn't just me saying this, most of the drivers have been saying the same thing. Look for a lot of guys to be spinning out and losing control this season. People with raw driving skill like kimi, Hamilton and Alonso will have a huge advantage.

All this talk about cars being slower isn't really true either. Considering the format and engine is brand new, the cars have been going quite quick. They'll only get faster over the years so expect them to out perform the V8 units someday.

They're slower. Apples and oranges comparing V-10's to batteries but Alonso makes it sound like they're fun to drive at their lower limits, something like his kart. I'm not sure if it'll come down to better car control, most of the grid is pretty good there, rain seeming to be the biggest variable in the past. I think it'll level the field more due to lower physical demands that even got to Hamilton and Button at times last year:

FTA:

Alonso remarked that today’s cars are ten seconds off the pace of those he drove earlier in his Formula One career.

“The cars are slower, nothing more than that I think,” he said, pointing out he lapped Jerez in 1’16 with the V10-engined cars in 2004 and 2005. “I ran today 1’26 so I was ten seconds slower than ten years ago.”

Alonso said the demands of driving Formula One cars have changed: “When you go ten seconds slower it’s not the same in physical point of view as well. These cars are a lot easier than what Formula One has been. There are less G-forces, less speed into the corner.

“But on the other hand there are more parameters to control, there are more buttons on the steering wheel, more criticality in terms of driving or in terms of having control of the car in high speed corners and also in traction. So just different.”

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/01/3...rent-less-fun/

Originally Posted by serialk11r

The cars should have well over 1200hp though, which is WAY more than the NA engines (they are allowed to ingest 2x the air!). Maybe a little slower in the corners but the speeds they hit should be higher. I know the tires are a controversy, but fuel makes sense; If you had less power and weren't capable of burning through your fuel tank, your fuel tank is too big and you should carry less fuel, which makes fuel management relevant. The engines don't sound as good but the cars should be faster in some respects.

I'd only heard of high 700 hp outputs total. Considering that fuel is limited to 100 kg per race, down from 160 kg last year, I wonder how they'll be able to produce well over 1,200 hp for long or at all?

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/141011.html

[headlikeahole]

Originally Posted by torqdork

They're slower. Apples and oranges comparing V-10's to batteries but Alonso makes it sound like they're fun to drive at their lower limits, something like his kart. I'm not sure if it'll come down to better car control, most of the grid is pretty good there, rain seeming to be the biggest variable in the past. I think it'll level the field more due to lower physical demands that even got to Hamilton and Button at times last year:

FTA:

Alonso remarked that today’s cars are ten seconds off the pace of those he drove earlier in his Formula One career.

“The cars are slower, nothing more than that I think,” he said, pointing out he lapped Jerez in 1’16 with the V10-engined cars in 2004 and 2005. “I ran today 1’26 so I was ten seconds slower than ten years ago.”

Alonso said the demands of driving Formula One cars have changed: “When you go ten seconds slower it’s not the same in physical point of view as well. These cars are a lot easier than what Formula One has been. There are less G-forces, less speed into the corner.

“But on the other hand there are more parameters to control, there are more buttons on the steering wheel, more criticality in terms of driving or in terms of having control of the car in high speed corners and also in traction. So just different.”

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/01/3...rent-less-fun/



I'd only heard of high 700 hp outputs total. Considering that fuel is limited to 100 kg per race, down from 160 kg last year, I wonder how they'll be able to produce well over 1,200 hp for long or at all?

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/141011.html

It's far too early to be comparing lap times between engines. It's the very first tests with a very new system. Compare lap times 2 years from now when the engines are perfected and putting out as much power as possible. Jerez under 1:20 is easily within reach of the new cars, it will just take some time.

I think by the end of the 2014 season once the drivers are used to the level of grip, we could see quali laps comparable to V8 era.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by torqdork

I'd only heard of high 700 hp outputs total. Considering that fuel is limited to 100 kg per race, down from 160 kg last year, I wonder how they'll be able to produce well over 1,200 hp for long or at all?

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/141011.html

Oh, I just noticed the fuel flow restriction rule... Okay that's plain stupid, you already have a fuel limit so why not let the driver figure out how to manage the fuel instead of deliberately cut the power? -_-

Right, if the engines put out the maximum allowed amount of power (3 bar, 15000rpm) then they would run out of fuel well before the race is over. 3.5 bar boost (4.5x atmospheric pressure) is about ~3-3.5x atmospheric density (depending on intercooling), the displacement has been cut to 2/3rds and with the electric turbo there's no reason the engine can't hold full boost to the rev limit, so you're looking at about 1100-1200bhp + a little bit more from the turbine.

With this 100kg/hour rule, at 37% thermal efficiency you can't produce more than 633bhp, so at 10500rpm the cars will only be running maybe 1 bar boost, and there should be a mountain of torque well below that.

Drats, I really wanted to see engines that could pump out 1200bhp. These engines should be capable of that maybe with a little tweaking. Imagine they were driving around with 1200hp on tap but could only use like 600 average while accelerating, that would make things very interesting (aka a shitload of overtaking). With the current setup it seems like they'd pretty much burn through the tank right on time if driving flat out.

[Atticus808]

i tried to watch a bit of F1 last season, and i will probably still watch a bit. but what turns me off of watching it is the winners are always the same few. don't you get bored of that?

[7thgear]

Originally Posted by headlikeahole

Fuel and tires have always been a deciding factor in F1. With the cars now having almost no downforce (+more torque), its more about driver skill then before.

no downforce compared to what? the 90s? 80s? the 70s?

There's still plenty of aero to go around.

[cfusionpm]

Originally Posted by torqdork

I'd only heard of high 700 hp outputs total. Considering that fuel is limited to 100 kg per race, down from 160 kg last year, I wonder how they'll be able to produce well over 1,200 hp for long or at all?

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/141011.html

The gas engine offers up about that much hp, but the electric systems add about another 180-200hp at variable usage throughout the track. I would imagine quali times will be pretty quick but race pace will probably be slower. But that's OK with me since the erratic driving and extra torque will make for a good show.

[GTB/ZR-1]

I'm just hoping it's not just an engineering capability show as it's been for a while now...

[cfusionpm]

It looks like they designed it specifically to not be an engineering show (less aero, more torque, harder tires), but who knows. Nothing could be as bad as last year...

[torqdork]

Everyone here surely knows but a friendly reminder that Oz is a day ahead of the US so first practice session will be this Thursday evening 6:30 PDST on NBCSNHD.

Quali is then Friday 11:00 PM, race day is Saturday 10:30 PM.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by torqdork

Everyone here surely knows but a friendly reminder that Oz is a day ahead of the US so first practice session will be this Thursday evening 6:30 PDST on NBCSNHD.

Quali is then Friday 11:00 PM, race day is Saturday 10:30 PM.

Already on the DVR but my snobbish ass will probably just Torrent the far superior SKY SPORTS broadcast from the UK anyway. I may come back to watching NBC's broadcast if they manage to fire Lee Diffy and if Steve Matchet can offer some technical analysis beyond "The tires are made of black sticky rubber!" Thanks Steve! (no not really Steve).

The SkySports people are all famous ex-F1 british racers that get WAY more access to people than Buxton does. Also, they do things like interview Ross Brawn during the race. SkySports delivers an embarrassment of riches compared to the bread crumbs NBC delivers.