Poor Sales of Toyota GT86/Scion FR-S Likely To Rule Out New Variants

[LBC Por Siempre]

Originally Posted by Chen

That's fine with me. I was already pissed off when the monogram series came out. ��

HA! If you were pissed that they were coming out with another iteration, then just be grateful you don't call upon yourself as the Porsche-Faithful... At the end of their past run on 997.2 911s it seemed they came out with a new variant every week or two. There must have been at least 20 variants all the way from the 911 up to the 911 GT2 RS. The VW Group was really trying to squeeze everything out of that model, that is for damn sure.

[Whitigir]

Throw a Turbo in, or Stroke the engine out, however you do it Toyota....up it to 250-300 HP

And, hell....no other cars can beat it. People would never consider Twice...they would even buy 86 instead of another Sedan even

[TwinturboCamry]

A V6 camry/accord would beat it.
Are you really suggesting a 300hp FRS would butcher all 4 door car sales? WTF?

[Derickie]

Originally Posted by Burrcold

Okay now you're comparing used, out if warranty, roadsters (not very convenient might I add) to a very practical 2+2 sports car that can be driven all year round...much MUCH easier than an S2K. So what's out there (new) that's so much more practical, as much fun as these cars, and for less money?

The biggest point that I gave the big WTF to, was that you said they aren't "lookers". Are you kidding me?! That's been a pretty wide margin consensus positive to these cars from most journalist reviews and user reviews.

Finally, your point completely collapsed when you ended with the "86 will survive". Based on what? From what I've seen, sales figures are pretty even globally (if not in favor of NA).

Common' Man!!

[/END RANT]

Some people like to make a fool of themselves. I personally think the 86 is one of the best looking car out there. Obviously, not everyone share the same view or they are just talking shit, most likely the latter.

[daiheadjai]

One big glaring argument against all this hand-wringing:

If the GT86/FRS/BRZ are doing so poorly, why are Nissan and Kia (and possibly Chevy with the 130) offering production-ready concepts for precisely the same market?

As noted, the sports car market is a niche, so it would be foolish to expect 100,000+ units per year, and anecdotal evidence says there are more and more of these.
I'm seeing at least one or two FRS/BRZs per day in mid-town and downtown Toronto (not even talking about Markham, which has a higher Asian population), surprising given that RWD tends to be frowned upon here.

What this might be, however, is an indication that it would be unprofitable to go for niches of niches (i.e. the convertible niche of the sports coupe niche).
It might make sense to expand the line for the car guys with families (i.e. 4 door sedan a la Altezza/IS200).

[Derickie]

Originally Posted by daiheadjai

One big glaring argument against all this hand-wringing:

If the GT86/FRS/BRZ are doing so poorly, why are Nissan and Kia (and possibly Chevy with the 130) offering production-ready concepts for precisely the same market?

As noted, the sports car market is a niche, so it would be foolish to expect 100,000+ units per year, and anecdotal evidence says there are more and more of these.
I'm seeing at least one or two FRS/BRZs per day in mid-town and downtown Toronto (not even talking about Markham, which has a higher Asian population), surprising given that RWD tends to be frowned upon here.

What this might be, however, is an indication that it would be unprofitable to go for niches of niches (i.e. the convertible niche of the sports coupe niche).
It might make sense to expand the line for the car guys with families (i.e. 4 door sedan a la Altezza/IS200).

One or two per day is a lot man. I only see one or zero per month in Hong Kong lol. But dude, cars in Canada are really cheap, the FRS cost 57k CAD here.

[Whitigir]

Originally Posted by TwinturboCamry

A V6 camry/accord would beat it.
Are you really suggesting a 300hp FRS would butcher all 4 door car sales? WTF?

Nah, what I am saying is just in my own opinion about the Sedan. In my situation, we all have DD vehicle. m looking for a sport car to drive...but then as a family guy, i had to pick sport sedan, not yet. but aiming toward. i wish 86 was to have 250 or 300 hp, then i would pick one instead of a sport sedan. it s just me

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

One of these is not like the other...

How so? While the Miata is still in production NB and NC sales both displayed the trend I'm pointing to that I expect the Toyobaru to follow.

http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html

All the cars I referenced sold half the volume of their first year in their fourth year or sooner and continued to decline. Like others have said, nothing has been surprising so far.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by strat61caster

How so? While the Miata is still in production NB and NC sales both displayed the trend I'm pointing to that I expect the Toyobaru to follow.

http://www.goodcarbadcar.net/2011/01...s-figures.html

All the cars I referenced sold half the volume of their first year in their fourth year or sooner and continued to decline. Like others have said, nothing has been surprising so far.

Essentially that the Miata is still in production while the other two are extinct. I agree that Japanese sports cars have negative sloping sales over the course of their lives, but at least the Miata is still around in some form.

[robwbright]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

The comments to the article make it clear why sports cars like these aren't volume sellers and will never be.

One guy said he owned an FR-S for 2 months and was glad to sell it at a $4k loss because:

- it was too small
- the interior was cheap and not refined
- the suspension was too harsh
- the engine lacked power and needed to be rev'd out

Most of that sounds like an argument for NASCAR against F1.

But we all know which of them is the car for any road that has both right AND left hand turns.

[robwbright]

Originally Posted by AznBRZer

I've said it before and I'll say it again: the only car I would get in lieu of this one is a modern Integra. Since Honda ditched that idea or delayed it for another few years, here I am with no regrets.

Always preferred the Prelude myself...

[DSlayerZX]

Originally Posted by Derickie

One or two per day is a lot man. I only see one or zero per month in Hong Kong lol. But dude, cars in Canada are really cheap, the FRS cost 57k CAD here.

Try Irvine.

For the past month, I see at least one different FRS on the 15 minute drive back home. Its getting too common around here

[Takumi788]

GOOD!! They shouldn't produce a faster one. That would take away from the tribute to the 86 thing they have going. The AE86 is legendary because of how capable it was without big power and i feel the twins are the same.

[robwbright]

Originally Posted by suaveflooder

weird. My dad just bought a prius and when he mentioned that I had an FRS the dealer told him they couldn't keep them on the lot, they were selling too quickly.

Just depends on where you're at, I think. They get one at a time at the closest dealer to me and each car seems to last 2-3 months before it sells.