Import cost of Toyota GT-86?

[Phant]

Cost would be astronomical.

Brief breakdown of components you'd have to pay for to -LEGALLY- import Toyota GT86:

1.) Car itself, at a higher price than FR-S or USDM BRZ. (Due to strength of the Yen, and what they're pricing the cars at for the Japanese market)

2.) Transportation fees to get the car to US shores

3.) Importation fees/taxes paid at port, usually.

4.) Conversion fees, to make the car meet -ALL- US standards for emissions (completely different reqs. than japan)

5.) Testing for safety. As the vehicle is marketed under a completely different make/model as the ones already approved for the US market, and utilizes different parts that are untested on our shores (RHD v. LHD = quite a few completely different parts, you know?) you'll have to prove that it complies with ALL safety regulations. This can require things up to, and including, conversion to LHD, or crash-testing of multiple same-model vehicles.

So yes, it's expensive. Likely well over double the cost of the vehicle itself. Think about it; are you the first person in the world that's thought of importing a vehicle? Hardly. Yet how many do you see driving around? How many do you see at auto shows? Not many. Heck, not hardly any, at all... and the reason for that is $$$$$$$.

Now, there are a few exceptions: 1.) Vehicles over a certain age (I believe 20-25 years) are exempt from most safety/emissions check requirements. 2.) Vehicles that have been tested/approved previously, due to massive demand (old R32 GTRs, for instance... though their imported pricetag is STILL well into the realm of ridiculous), 3.) Import the car illegally... in which case you only pay the cost of the car, and the transportation fees. Good luck registering it, though! 4.) You purchase the car, and separate the body and the engine. You import each separately, and then re-assemble the car state-side. You can then go about registering it as a kit-car. Goodbye warranty, ability for loan approval, ability to get any form of standard/non-limited insurance, etc.

And there you have it, the cliffs notes as to why it's a HORRIBLE idea to even think about trying to import a vehicle. But hey, if you either a.) are a millionare with a couple/few $100k to spare, or b.) just plain don't believe me, then feel free to look into things yourself. I may be slightly off on a few of my recaps, but I'm fairly sure you'll find most of this info to be authentic.

Good luck!

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by bneale

What exactly is so embarassing with buying the FR-S? ... bneale

bneale, certainly no embarassment from me (as one of the First 86) and I share you're amusement (albeight not as strongly I suspect) at folks who feels somehow it matters. To each his/her own I say.

I did think the question about importing was an interesting though in general. There have been other cars, and more frequently motorcycles, I would like to have imported because they weren't available in the US.

[Yaardy316]

Originally Posted by bneale

What exactly is so embarassing with buying the FR-S?

I really don't get all the hate towards Scion or the FR-S. These cars are all the exact same once you strip the minor difference in details away.

I really don't understand this attitude towards the Scion and for one, I'm actually glad/proud I'm buying the Scion version if this is the attitude other 86 drivers have.

Look down on me if you must but to be honest, we're all driving 86's so who the hell cares which version it is. Just be happy another one is on the road!

I'm really sick of seeing all the flack towards Scion and the FR-S.

bneale

I don't like how the styling and interior are modified for the U.S. market. I think it is a step down in quality. I current drive a '09 Civic Si. I thought that I would be getting a fairly comparable car to that of the Type R or the RR, but that just isn't the case. The insides are completely different, and that has nothing to do with regulations. Plus there is a difference in HP as well, now that may have something to do with Regs., but I doubt it. Over all I just think from the eye ball test and what I've read and heard is that JDM are just better quality vehicles. They are more meticulously built. I have heard JP QC is off the charts, and also heard that 30% of the car is built in states and U.S. has't shown the best track record when comes to QC.

Not to mention that Scion has done everything but enhance its brand in the eyes of car enthusiast.

And *bneale* I will never look down on someone who decides to go the Scion route- to each his own.

[Yaardy316]

Originally Posted by Phant

Cost would be astronomical.

Brief breakdown of components you'd have to pay for to -LEGALLY- import Toyota GT86:

1.) Car itself, at a higher price than FR-S or USDM BRZ. (Due to strength of the Yen, and what they're pricing the cars at for the Japanese market)

2.) Transportation fees to get the car to US shores

3.) Importation fees/taxes paid at port, usually.

4.) Conversion fees, to make the car meet -ALL- US standards for emissions (completely different reqs. than japan)

5.) Testing for safety. As the vehicle is marketed under a completely different make/model as the ones already approved for the US market, and utilizes different parts that are untested on our shores (RHD v. LHD = quite a few completely different parts, you know?) you'll have to prove that it complies with ALL safety regulations. This can require things up to, and including, conversion to LHD, or crash-testing of multiple same-model vehicles.

So yes, it's expensive. Likely well over double the cost of the vehicle itself. Think about it; are you the first person in the world that's thought of importing a vehicle? Hardly. Yet how many do you see driving around? How many do you see at auto shows? Not many. Heck, not hardly any, at all... and the reason for that is $$$$$$$.

Now, there are a few exceptions: 1.) Vehicles over a certain age (I believe 20-25 years) are exempt from most safety/emissions check requirements. 2.) Vehicles that have been tested/approved previously, due to massive demand (old R32 GTRs, for instance... though their imported pricetag is STILL well into the realm of ridiculous), 3.) Import the car illegally... in which case you only pay the cost of the car, and the transportation fees. Good luck registering it, though! 4.) You purchase the car, and separate the body and the engine. You import each separately, and then re-assemble the car state-side. You can then go about registering it as a kit-car. Goodbye warranty, ability for loan approval, ability to get any form of standard/non-limited insurance, etc.

And there you have it, the cliffs notes as to why it's a HORRIBLE idea to even think about trying to import a vehicle. But hey, if you either a.) are a millionare with a couple/few $100k to spare, or b.) just plain don't believe me, then feel free to look into things yourself. I may be slightly off on a few of my recaps, but I'm fairly sure you'll find most of this info to be authentic.

Good luck!

Thank you for answering the question in a positive way! I know its not my question, but it nice to someone do it w/ some decency- even if you think its a HORRIBLE idea. lol

[2fast4you]

I don't think it will be as difficult as many think to import a Toyota 86. Yes, it will be stupid expensive and time consuming, however, even with the differences in crash and emissions standards between Japan, EU, and U.S., I would believe Toyota/Subaru is building this to be a "world car" to save manufacturing costs... e.g. one car to meet or exceed all standards. However, I would wait a year for replacement/collision part inventories to build up just in case you need to replace crash beams & doors, and to swap out the exhaust manifold. Also, it would be a good idea to take that year to acquire evidence that the "Toyota 86" and the "Toyota Scion FR-S" are structurally the same vehicle.

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Yaardy316

..Over all I just think from the eye ball test and what I've read and heard is that JDM are just better quality vehicles. They are more meticulously built. I have heard JP QC is off the charts, and also heard that 30% of the car is built in states and U.S. has't shown the best track record when comes to QC.

All variations are all being built in the same factory on the same line, I really don't see how there could be that much difference in the build quality. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see how that would even work.

[bneale]

Originally Posted by Yaardy316

I don't like how the styling and interior are modified for the U.S. market. I think it is a step down in quality. I current drive a '09 Civic Si. I thought that I would be getting a fairly comparable car to that of the Type R or the RR, but that just isn't the case. The insides are completely different, and that has nothing to do with regulations. Plus there is a difference in HP as well, now that may have something to do with Regs., but I doubt it. Over all I just think from the eye ball test and what I've read and heard is that JDM are just better quality vehicles. They are more meticulously built. I have heard JP QC is off the charts, and also heard that 30% of the car is built in states and U.S. has't shown the best track record when comes to QC.

Not to mention that Scion has done everything but enhance its brand in the eyes of car enthusiast.

And *bneale* I will never look down on someone who decides to go the Scion route- to each his own.

Your sort of mixing fruit witn your example there. But just to clarify, all of these cars are being made at the same Subaru plant in Japan. So even the NA models are Japanese made. I don't see how any of them can somehow be better then the others.

Aside from the minor details (springs for BRZ/FRS and GT86, Interior, HID's, dashboard color, push button start and Sat Nav) these cars are exactly the same. So how someone can say "Driving a Scion is embarrasing" is stupid to me.

Scion seems to have this stigma which everyone holds in their minds as somehow being negitive. Why is this? Is it because Scion owners like to customize their cars? If so, why is there this sterotype that every Scion owner is going to somehow ruin their car? It's not the cars fault someone ruined it.

My point is simply this, just because someone buys/drives a Scion, we shouldn't look down on them. It's just a brand they purchased. There's simply no link between Scion being somehow bad because of what the owners have done.

If we were throwing around Automotive Sterotypes, I would call all of the perspective BRZ owners Lesbians (no offence ment here, its just a Top Gear reference). But you won't see me doing this because I can look past these types of things.

Also, I'm glad you won't be looking down on us Scion owners. It makes you a bigger person then most on here. Regardless on which version of the 86 you like, we should be able to treat each other with respect around here.

bneale

[Yaardy316]

Originally Posted by Dadhawk

All variations are all being built in the same factory on the same line, I really don't see how there could be that much difference in the build quality. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see how that would even work.

Yea I hear ya- that just what I was told by someone. They said Cars from JP that come to U.S. are usually built that way (70/30 or some thing to that effect) maybe he's wrong. I've yet to come across anybody who actually knows 100% on this topic of international car dealings.

If what your saying is true (and I think it is cause it sounds logical) I might be better off getting the base model and swapping in the JDM touches that I want.

[Yaardy316]

Originally Posted by bneale

Your sort of mixing fruit witn your example there. But just to clarify, all of these cars are being made at the same Subaru plant in Japan. So even the NA models are Japanese made. I don't see how any of them can somehow be better then the others.

Aside from the minor details (springs for BRZ/FRS and GT86, Interior, HID's, dashboard color, push button start and Sat Nav) these cars are exactly the same. So how someone can say "Driving a Scion is embarrasing" is stupid to me.

Scion seems to have this stigma which everyone holds in their minds as somehow being negitive. Why is this? Is it because Scion owners like to customize their cars? If so, why is there this sterotype that every Scion owner is going to somehow ruin their car? It's not the cars fault someone ruined it.

My point is simply this, just because someone buys/drives a Scion, we shouldn't look down on them. It's just a brand they purchased. There's simply no link between Scion being somehow bad because of what the owners have done.

If we were throwing around Automotive Sterotypes, I would call all of the perspective BRZ owners Lesbians (no offence ment here, its just a Top Gear reference). But you won't see me doing this because I can look past these types of things.

Also, I'm glad you won't be looking down on us Scion owners. It makes you a bigger person then most on here. Regardless on which version of the 86 you like, we should be able to treat each other with respect around here.

bneale

Yea I agree I did do a little of comparing apples and oranges there. So I rescind my previous statement. It looks like you guys know what your talking about as far as the cars being the same mechanically. I didn't expect that since that since its never been that way for Honda- but again that is a different ball of wax.


And maybe your right about the owners of scion driving the branding down- cause whenever I see a tC here in Cali- I just smh Maybe this car is the car to turn it around for them.

*RESPECT*

P.S. I still haven't made up my mind as to either buy the 86 or BRZ- gonna give it 2-3 years

[Dadhawk]

Originally Posted by Yaardy316

...If what your saying is true (and I think it is cause it sounds logical) I might be better off getting the base model and swapping in the JDM touches that I want.

I do know they are all being built in the same Subaru factory on the same line. I suppose since some options are "dealer installed" (which means either at port or actually in the dealership) you could say some percentage doesn't go through the same QA process. Most of that though is things like radios, etc and has minimal impact on overall build quality.

That may not be true for all imported models, but we do know its true on this one.

ADDED: Just saw you're response above ^^ so its all good!

[Yaardy316]

Found these vids on youtube- they provide some insight on purchasing and importing a vehicle from JP. Albeit, the vehicles are going to Australia, but non-the-less insight is gained.

[dsgerbc]

Originally Posted by Phant

Cost would be astronomical.


So yes, it's expensive. Likely well over 100 times the cost of the vehicle itself.

Fixed that for you. Just google estimates how much it took to legitimize R32s. The total investment was worth millions.

[LSxJunkie]

Folks, they didn't legalize the R32. They legalized the R33. They then falsified the papers for R32s and R34s as R33s to get their bond releases.

They brought in many R33s. Tested a few to destruction. Tested a few for emissions.

Vehicles imported into the United States that are less than 25 years old must comply with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards (FMVSS) regulations and they must be imported via a Registered Importer (RI). If vehicles are imported that do not meet FMVSS regulations, they must be brought up to compliance by the RI within 120 days of entry into the US. NHTSA also limits the models of vehicles that are eligible for importation into the United States.

NHTSA states, “to be imported free of restriction, a motor vehicle less than 25 years old must be originally manufactured to comply with all applicable FMVSS and bear a label certifying such compliance that is permanently affixed by the vehicle’s original manufacturer.”. Skylines, sadly, do NOT meet that criteria.


What does the above mean? First off, the NHTSA had originally determined that the 1990-1999 versions of the RHD Nissan GTS and GT-R Skyline were eligible for importation (R32, R33, R34 generations) as long as a HS-7 declaration is made.At the time it enters the US, the clock starts ticking and the car must be brought up to code via the RI within the 120 days allowed. Hey, this sounds simple!

In comes the saga of Motorex. Motorex was a RI that was in business from 1998 to 2002 after which time they closed shop. Motorex took the initiative to work with the Federal Government in order to determine what is needed to bring an imported Skyline “up to code” to be legal within the US. As part of this process, they worked with JK Technologies to import numerous R33′s, at their expense, for crash testing in order to determine the modifications needed. As a consequence, Motorex claimed a proprietary interest in the modifications which are now covered by a confidentiality grant. Not only did this give Motorex a corner on the market for legal Skylines, it also allowed them to command a premium price for each legalized car.In effect, other RI’s do not have access to the information gained via the crash tests performed nor the modifications needed, thus they will not be able to get Skylines to meet FMVSS requirements.

While making loads of money, Motorex also made loads of enemies.In yet another interesting twist, it was alleged that Motorex didn’t actually comply with all crash test requirements for the R32 and R34. The US Department of Transportation, in response, officially rescinded importation eligibility for both the R32 and R34 Skylines, therefore only 96-98 R33 Skylines were still eligible to be imported.However, since that date, Motorex encountered a flurry of additional legal challenges, ultimately closing its doors.As a result, there is currently no information available (confidential nor public) to legalize R32′s nor R34′s.

Cost of numerous cars.
Cost of third party independent testing firms.
Cost of attorneys to process all the paperwork.

Federal vs. State Registration
According to Sean Morris, one of the foremost experts on JDM vehicle importation, most people can not grasp the difference between vehicle legalization and vehicle registration.
Legalization – a vehicle in full compliance with Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, and Environmental Protection Agency standards.


Registration – registration is the responsibility of the individual states and localities. Most states do not check to see wether a vehicle is federally legal. If they see the vehicle, and are paid the registration fees, they will give registration for the vehicle.


Many people seem to get confused that if a vehicle is registered, that it is legal or “legalized”. A registered vehicle is just a registered vehicle. Registration could still be revoked by the DOT, EPA, or customs service, if the vehicle was found to have entered into the country fraudulently.


NHTSA is not responsible for regulating the operation of motor vehicles on public roads in the U.S. nor for titling or registering motor vehicles for such operation. That is instead the responsibility of the individual States. Some States may require a manufacturer’s certificate of origin (MCO) or manufacturer’s statement of origin (MSO) to register a new motor vehicle. These are not federally required documents. NHTSA, therefore, is not in a position to offer guidance to prospective vehicle manufacturers or vehicle purchasers on obtaining a needed MCO or MSO. Consumers with questions regarding these documents should direct those questions to their State’s Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV). Prospective manufacturers seeking guidance on obtaining MCO or MSO documents should contact the American Association of Motor Vehicle Administrators (AAMVA) at 703-522-4201 or visit that organization’s website at http://www.aamva.org.
99% of the time “State Titled” and “State Registered” translates to “Illegally imported and titled as kit car”.Cars that appear “legal” (to a state) can be impounded by the Feds. Likely, no. Possible, yes.It has happened before (in AZ, in particular) and may be stepped up if the Feds decide they’re “fed up” (no pun intended) with the flouting of the law. Many illegally-imported Skylines roam the streets unmolested on a regular basis.However, there’s always the chance that something goes wrong (usually due to an accident, a vandalism / theft, or simply an “anonymous call”) that brings the car to “official” attention.

ICE has been running around the country seizing improperly imported Skylines for the last three years.

http://jalopnik.com/5371967/feds-sei...-gt+rs-in-cali

http://jalopnik.com/5775509/feds-lau...skyline-owners

http://www.gtrusablog.com/2011/08/pl...n-skyline.html

What we're all telling you is it's going to be prohibitively expensive. You might be able to get away with it under $1,000,000, only because the cost of a new GT86 (and you will need many) is going to be cheaper than the cost of a used R33 GT-R in 1998. Here's a look at the tax fees according to JK Technologies, the people who actually did all the testing for the R33.

http://convert2us.com/veh_imports.htm

Importation of motor vehicles into the United States is a complicated process that involves a Registered Importer, and an Independent Commercial Importer. J. K. Technologies, L.L.C. holds both licenses and is one of the oldest and most respected importers in the country. This means we are specifically licensed by USDOT and USEPA to bring vehicles into compliance with Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards and Federal Emissions Requirements and Standards. Importing Requirements

• The first step is to arrange shipping and customs clearance with a freight forwarder and a U.S. Customs Broker. We are happy to provide recommendations on freight forwarder and customs brokers. Feel free to contact our office for information regarding freight forwarders and customs brokers.
• After the car arrives at our facility, we will do all of the necessary modifications to bring it into conformity with DOT and EPA regulations. This generally takes an average of 90-120 days. If the car is not equipped correctly or is in poor condition, there could be additional charges and additional time for your car to be released for DOT and EPA.
• We require a deposit of the base price plus agency fees with execution of the contract and the balance will be due upon receipt of parts for the vehicle or as billed to us by each supplier. The final payment must be in the form of a wire, ACH, or cashier's check, personal checks will not be accepted for final payment.
• You will also need to furnish us a copy of your liability insurance and physical damage insurance for the car along with the deposit.
• We require all customs charges paid in full before we will take possession of the vehicle.
• After the conversion, we will put together a licensing package that will help you to get your tags and title in whichever state you choose except California. If the car needs to be certified in California please contact our office for additional information and requirements.
• If you have any further questions please call or email.

U.S Customs

Fees

• 2.5% duty and 1% Customs bond (or $450 whichever is greater) based on the declared value of the vehicle will be paid upon entry into the U.S.
• 1% U.S. DOT bond (or $600 whichever is greater) based on the declared value of the vehicle will be paid upon entry into the U.S. Unless the vehicle is a petition car, then the U.S. DOT bond will be purchased after the petition has passed. The U.S. DOT bond will be equal to 150% of the vehicles value.
• 1% U.S. EPA processing fee (or $750 whichever is greater) based on the declared value of the vehicle will be paid upon entry into the U.S.
• Value may be determined using Kelly Blue Book www.kbb.com or Edmunds www.edmunds.com to find out the value of your vehicle.

Freight Forwarder and U.S. Customs Broker

• Please provide the location of your vehicle and the closest airport or port so we can assist with details.
• Please consign all cars to yourself car of the Customs Broker that you decide to use so that they will be advised when your car arrives. Also ship the vehicle express release (non-negotiable seaway bill).
• Wallenius Lines and Transcar have a number of drop-off centers in addition to offices in most major ports, or in some cases they can pick up your car.

Documentation- A contract will be sent to you upon receipt of the information below.

• Copy of title/registration document
• Copy of bill of sale or proforma invoice (download here)
• Copy of non conforming document (download here)
• Copy of power of attorney
• Copy of bill of lading or seaway bill (shipping document)
• Copy of driver’s license/passport
• Copy of insurance for both sea and USA

Please make sure your shipper files an ISF form with US Customs 24 hours prior to shipping the vehicle to the USA and provide us with the confirmation number. Fines can be in excess of $5,000 for not filing the ISF.

For more information, visit U.S. Custom’s importing page http://www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/trade/bas...orting_car.xml

U.S. DOT

• When looking to import a car or motorcycle, you will need to look at the NHTSA List of Nonconforming Vehicles Eligible for Importation http://icsw.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/ to see if the car is eligible for import. If the car is not on the list, then we would need to petition the car for eligibility.
• If a car is right hand drive and not on the eligibility list for the right hand drive car model, then crash testing would be required.
• In an effort to lower the cost of conversion, clients have the possibility to obtain a letter of conformity from the manufacturer stating whether or not it complies with DOT standards. When importing a car from Canada, the manufacturer’s letter is extremely vital and saves the client a large sum of money.
• The modifications for DOT concern the safety aspects of the car or motorcycle. Some of the changes to your car should be the headlights, taillights, side marker light assemblies, high mounted 3rd brake light, bumper reinforcements, door reinforcement beams, a rollover fuel-spill prevention valve, seatbelt warning system, speedometer and certifications labels.
• If your car was manufactured on or after September 1, 1989 (1990 model) then it must have driver’s side passive restraint (airbags) and if it was manufactured on or after September 1, 1993 (1994 model) then it must have driver’s and passenger’s passive restraints (airbags).
• After the modifications are finished, we will submit a report to DOT and they clear the car or motorcycle 30 business days later.
• In order to get a quote for your car or motorcycle, please call or email us.
• If your car is 25 years or older, the car is exempt from DOT and EPA standards and you would only need a customs broker to clear the vehicle through customs.

For more information regarding the NHTSA vehicle importation and certification requirements, please visit NHTSA’s website http://icsw.nhtsa.gov/cars/rules/import/.

U.S. EPA

• The modifications for EPA pertain to the emission control system in the car.
• In an effort to lower the cost of conversion, clients have the possibility to obtain a letter of conformity from the manufacturer stating whether or not it complies with EPA standards. When importing a car from Canada, the manufacturer’s letter is extremely vital and saves the client a large sum of money.
• If the car was manufactured after January 1, 1996, then it must have OBD2 (On Board Diagnostics 2).
• First, if so equipped, we certify the existing catalytic converter and test its efficiency. Then check the oxygen sensor, change the evaporative canister and purge system, check the fuel control computer, change the filler neck and do a federal emissions test to the car.
• If the car is not emissions equipped, we replace all non-conforming parts with U.S. parts and there will be substantial extra charges and additional time.
• The emissions test, conducted by an independent EPA laboratory, costs $2500, and one test will be included in your estimate.
• You will be charged if the car fails the test so please have a tune up and oil change before the car is shipped.
• After testing is complete, we file a report with EPA and they clear the car 15 business days later.
• In order to get a quote for your car, please call or email us.
• If your car is 21 years or older, the car is exempt from EPA standards but the DOT standards still apply.

Please visit EPA’s importing website http://www.epa.gov/otaq/imports/index.htm for more information.

So, how much are YOU willing to spend for your one of a kind, RHD, Toyota GT86?

[Guff]

Does it matter that the GT86 is already technically sold in the US under a different name, and therefore is qualified for US spec Crash Tests, emissions, etc.?