FR-S/BRZ vs 2011+ Mustang V6

[Capt Canuck]

Originally Posted by Giccin

Mustang GT... The car with the broken 2nd gear and clutch?

Karma is a bitch ;-)
We don't even know what kinda of issues the FRS/BRZ is going to have.

[Gaiakai]

Originally Posted by SVTSHC

Care to elaborate? Not being rude or anything I'm honestly just unaware of any issues with 2nd gear and the clutch... I mean the handful of 5.0's I've driven FELT normal but they weren't mine so I didn't beat on them.

There was this big whoopla about the MT82 transmission in the new Mustangs about them grinding gears. Scared off quite a lot of people, NHTSA got an investigation going but in the end concluded it was just driver error. I disagree with the NHTSA, but that's basically what the issue is with the new Stangs.

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by Gaiakai

I disagree with the NHTSA, but that's basically what the issue is with the new Stangs.

Please continue.

[WingsofWar]

Fixed

DR-S was bugging the shit out of me...

[Guff]

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

Fixed

DR-S was bugging the shit out of me...

I could just kiss you right now!

[Gaiakai]

Originally Posted by tranzformer

Please continue.

Oh, I just think there's more to the transmission, not just driver error. That's all. Just my opinion

[chate]

http://mustangsdaily.com/blog/2011/1...-transmission/

[chulooz]

No surprise that an American org would drop issues with ford as they try to grow, same people that had a problem with fools using the wrong pedal in Toyotas.

[brufleth]

Originally Posted by chulooz

No surprise that an American org would drop issues with ford as they try to grow, same people that had a problem with fools using the wrong pedal in Toyotas.

Word. The Toyota investigations were largely a witch hunt. The news was filled with people indignant that their cars relied on ::gasp:: software to run. Meanwhile problems on cars from US manufacturers weren't given nearly the same level of concern.

[ZDan]

Actually, Toyota accelerator pedal position sensors HAVE been found to be susceptible to failures due to tin whiskering (extremely fine filaments that can grow to millimeters in length and cause intermittent short-circuits).
http://nepp.nasa.gov/WHISKER/referen...app-sensor.pdf

Hmm, a mechanical throttle cable doesn't seem like such a bad idea after all...

[serialk11r]

Mechanical throttle cable doesn't allow flexibility in VVT control :P
Reading that article, maybe they could've insulated the contacts (at slightly higher cost)...

[Kunzite]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Actually, Toyota accelerator pedal position sensors HAVE been found to be susceptible to failures due to tin whiskering (extremely fine filaments that can grow to millimeters in length and cause intermittent short-circuits).
http://nepp.nasa.gov/WHISKER/referen...app-sensor.pdf

Hmm, a mechanical throttle cable doesn't seem like such a bad idea after all...

Haven't we talked about this, already?
The issue described in that document wasn't responsible for the so-called sudden acceleration syndrome. Pedals stuck to the improperly mounted floor mat was, and also people pressing the wrong pedal.
Yes, it was clearly a witch hunt and I'm not surprised that, after trying so hard (and only for Toyotas) they found something.

I assume you haven't heard about stuck mechanical throttle cables; I did.

[ZDan]

The issue described in the document did describe a failure that resulted in "unintended acceleration".

It has been totally PROVEN that Toyota throttle pedal angle sensors have developed whiskers that have been shown to cause potentially dangerous malfunctions. In the case cited, the failure was *relatively* benign, but still dangerous. It is totally possible that if other leads in this sensor were shorted that you could get less benign/more dangerous types of failures.

THERE IS AND HAS BEEN MORE GOING ON WITH TOYOTA THROTTLES THAN FLOORMATS OR WRONG PEDAL APPLICATION.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

Mechanical throttle cable doesn't allow flexibility in VVT control :P
Reading that article, maybe they could've insulated the contacts (at slightly higher cost)...

They probably do this now. Conformal coating with 2-5 mils of urethane pretty much contains the whiskering and mitigates the risk tremendously.

What would be better would be for Europe to revisit RoHS requirements and to allow 3% lead plating of leads and solder in electronics, with appropriate environmental controls in place at production and end of life.

Problem is, many electronics companies have invested heavily in going to zero-lead. Medical and space applications have waivers to use lead in electronics, IMO automotive and many other applications should, too.