Clutch Delay Valve? - Page 2 - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

luxmn · 06-13-2012, 02:09 PM

wait so what does it mean for newbies, like me, if I want to shift smoothly again? Shift, gas a little then release the clutch slower?

SkullWorks · 06-14-2012, 03:48 PM

no it means that you effectively can't drop the clutch, even if YOU do, the car limits the speed at which the fluid flows back and therefor the shock to the system is reduced.

it means if you are a newb to clutch it won't matter because this is what you will get used to, don't even think about it just learn to drive by doing what feels smoothest

FRSKEV · 02-06-2014, 06:29 PM

Glad Im reading this because I thought I was going crazy not being able to figure out how to shift smooth 1-2. All my life I've driven manual cars never had an automatic actually but I feel like I don't know how to drive sometimes with this clutch delay valve thing. Weird I guess I just have to get use to it. I don't like the feeling it gives very much.

Akari · 02-06-2014, 08:10 PM

Yes, this drives me absolutely insane. If anyone manages to remove/disable theirs please post up specifics on what you did and results!

00NissanNinja · 02-06-2014, 09:05 PM

I'm glad I saw this too, 1st to 2nd annoyed the crap out of me when I first bought the car. I've been driving stick since I started driving, it made me start thinking to myself, damn I suck at clutch work now. I've gotten mostly used to it now. Still get on the gas a little too soon every once in awhile though. Bugged my Mom too, and she has driven stick since she started driving.

BRZNutt · 02-06-2014, 10:27 PM

Adjusting the point of engagement lower also helps to minimize this.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8040

BRZfan · 02-07-2014, 10:23 AM

Some posters here should not be wearing combat boots when driving their manual transmission BRZ.
Try using bare feet (with or w/o socks) for a while and practice to get a better feel of engine rev and clutch actuation. Try to keep your left heel on the floor and use it as a pivot point (and not hip and knee pivoting) The BRZ is not a truck.

Ganthrithor · 02-07-2014, 10:37 PM

Serious question (I know nothing about clutch-delay valves)-- if there's a delay valve, how can we get wheel chirp going from first to second if we powershift? Is the valve just not effective enough to completely neuter a clutch dump? If so, what's the point of having it since it sounds like it would only make a very minor difference in terms of absorbing shocks?

The thing that kind of annoys me most about the stock drivetrain is the way you get a "bouncing" feeling from the tranny when getting hard on the throttle even after the clutch is fully engaged, which I assume is just an effect of the soft motor mounts and that big rubber donut where the diff meets the rear subframe.

SirBrass · 02-08-2014, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRZfan

Some posters here should not be wearing combat boots when driving their manual transmission BRZ.
Try using bare feet (with or w/o socks) for a while and practice to get a better feel of engine rev and clutch actuation. Try to keep your left heel on the floor and use it as a pivot point (and not hip and knee pivoting) The BRZ is not a truck.

Or do what I did:

Get a pair of Converse All-Stars as driving shoes. Flat, thin sole canvas shoes which allow you to really get a good feel of the pedals.

u/Josh · 02-08-2014, 04:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ganthrithor

The thing that kind of annoys me most about the stock drivetrain is the way you get a "bouncing" feeling from the tranny when getting hard on the throttle even after the clutch is fully engaged, which I assume is just an effect of the soft motor mounts and that big rubber donut where the diff meets the rear subframe.

Yep, I'm curious to know which of those things has the biggest effect?

daiheadjai · 02-08-2014, 01:52 PM

I'm not sure if this is the reason, but it's my bet: Drive-by-wire might be an issue - it seems old-school "cable throttle" cars seem to be easier to drive smoothly.
It took me awhile after transitioning from an older M/T car, but eventually you get the "hang" of it

chrisl · 02-08-2014, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirBrass

Or do what I did:

Get a pair of Converse All-Stars as driving shoes. Flat, thin sole canvas shoes which allow you to really get a good feel of the pedals.

I prefer pumas, but I agree - a good set of thin sole driving shoes makes a big difference in the feel and control you have driving a car (especially a stick shift)

Dave-ROR · 02-10-2014, 02:04 PM

I'm not concerned about this CDV. I wasn't concerned about the one in my S2K either. It's very easy to learn to live with it.

Akari · 02-10-2014, 03:56 PM

No offense to anyone in here but a good set of shoes doesn't solve the issue here. The issue is when shifting quickly, especially 1st to 2nd, you have to delay how quickly you get back on the accelerator, otherwise your clutch will not be fully engaged yet even though the pedal is fully released. Yes this is easy to avoid but it's not a behavior that is constructive towards spirited driving or track use.

02-10-2014, 02:04 PM	#27
Dave-ROR Site Moderator Join Date: Dec 2010 Drives: Stuff Location: Florida Posts: 10,317 Thanks: 955 Thanked 5,965 Times in 2,689 Posts Mentioned: 262 Post(s) Tagged: 8 Thread(s)	I'm not concerned about this CDV. I wasn't concerned about the one in my S2K either. It's very easy to learn to live with it. __________________ -Dave Track cars: 2013 Scion FRS, 1998 Acura Integra Type-R, 1993 Honda Civic Hatchback DD: 2005 Acura TSX Tow: 2022 F-450 Toys: 2001 Chevrolet Corvette Z06, 1993 Toyota MR2 Turbo, 1994 Toyota MR2 Turbo, 1991 Mitsubishi Galant VR-4 Parts: 2015 Subaru BRZ Limited, 2005 Acura TSX Projects: 2013 Subaru BRZ Limited track car build FS: 2004 GMC Sierra 2500 LT CCSB 8.1/Allison with 99k miles

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06-13-2012, 02:09 PM	#15
luxmn First FR-S Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: Whiteout MT FRS Location: austin tx Posts: 561 Thanks: 120 Thanked 125 Times in 83 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	wait so what does it mean for newbies, like me, if I want to shift smoothly again? Shift, gas a little then release the clutch slower?

06-14-2012, 03:48 PM	#16
SkullWorks Banned Join Date: Mar 2012 Drives: SSM LT MT BRZ Location: SoCal Posts: 1,033 Thanks: 803 Thanked 754 Times in 328 Posts Mentioned: 23 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	no it means that you effectively can't drop the clutch, even if YOU do, the car limits the speed at which the fluid flows back and therefor the shock to the system is reduced. it means if you are a newb to clutch it won't matter because this is what you will get used to, don't even think about it just learn to drive by doing what feels smoothest

02-06-2014, 06:29 PM	#17
FRSKEV Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Drives: FRS Location: Austin, TX Posts: 89 Thanks: 23 Thanked 47 Times in 31 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Glad Im reading this because I thought I was going crazy not being able to figure out how to shift smooth 1-2. All my life I've driven manual cars never had an automatic actually but I feel like I don't know how to drive sometimes with this clutch delay valve thing. Weird I guess I just have to get use to it. I don't like the feeling it gives very much.

02-06-2014, 08:10 PM	#18
Akari Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Drives: 2013 DGM BRZ Location: Auburn, WA Posts: 417 Thanks: 181 Thanked 149 Times in 97 Posts Mentioned: 11 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Yes, this drives me absolutely insane. If anyone manages to remove/disable theirs please post up specifics on what you did and results!

02-06-2014, 09:05 PM	#19
00NissanNinja The Thread Lurker Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: '14 BRZ, '17 GTI, MT09 Location: SW OH Posts: 552 Thanks: 282 Thanked 213 Times in 135 Posts Mentioned: 6 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'm glad I saw this too, 1st to 2nd annoyed the crap out of me when I first bought the car. I've been driving stick since I started driving, it made me start thinking to myself, damn I suck at clutch work now. I've gotten mostly used to it now. Still get on the gas a little too soon every once in awhile though. Bugged my Mom too, and she has driven stick since she started driving.

02-07-2014, 10:23 AM	#21
BRZfan Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Drives: 2013BRZ Premium St Silver Metallic Location: USA Posts: 824 Thanks: 79 Thanked 212 Times in 156 Posts Mentioned: 1 Post(s) Tagged: 1 Thread(s)	Some posters here should not be wearing combat boots when driving their manual transmission BRZ. Try using bare feet (with or w/o socks) for a while and practice to get a better feel of engine rev and clutch actuation. Try to keep your left heel on the floor and use it as a pivot point (and not hip and knee pivoting) The BRZ is not a truck.

02-07-2014, 10:37 PM	#22
Ganthrithor Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Drives: '13 BRZ, '06 997, Other Things(TM) Location: Santa Barbara, CA Posts: 1,078 Thanks: 1,715 Thanked 670 Times in 351 Posts Mentioned: 9 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Serious question (I know nothing about clutch-delay valves)-- if there's a delay valve, how can we get wheel chirp going from first to second if we powershift? Is the valve just not effective enough to completely neuter a clutch dump? If so, what's the point of having it since it sounds like it would only make a very minor difference in terms of absorbing shocks? The thing that kind of annoys me most about the stock drivetrain is the way you get a "bouncing" feeling from the tranny when getting hard on the throttle even after the clutch is fully engaged, which I assume is just an effect of the soft motor mounts and that big rubber donut where the diff meets the rear subframe.

02-08-2014, 01:52 PM	#25
daiheadjai Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Drives: 2003 S2000, 2008 Fit Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 1,990 Thanks: 2,584 Thanked 1,154 Times in 688 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'm not sure if this is the reason, but it's my bet: Drive-by-wire might be an issue - it seems old-school "cable throttle" cars seem to be easier to drive smoothly. It took me awhile after transitioning from an older M/T car, but eventually you get the "hang" of it

02-10-2014, 03:56 PM	#28
Akari Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Drives: 2013 DGM BRZ Location: Auburn, WA Posts: 417 Thanks: 181 Thanked 149 Times in 97 Posts Mentioned: 11 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	No offense to anyone in here but a good set of shoes doesn't solve the issue here. The issue is when shifting quickly, especially 1st to 2nd, you have to delay how quickly you get back on the accelerator, otherwise your clutch will not be fully engaged yet even though the pedal is fully released. Yes this is easy to avoid but it's not a behavior that is constructive towards spirited driving or track use.

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