Good sporty daily driver?

[HitTheGas]

Originally Posted by SVTSHC

Wanna impress the ladies -er.. sorry the gold diggers (because worthwhile women don't base attraction on material goods) then you'll need to start with BMW/Audi/Mercedes and finish somewhere in the Lambo/Ferrari/Porsche/Bugatti range. Buuuuut when you don't have a "money room" that you only enter to roll around in your middle-class crushing pocket change then realistically it's not the car it's the person inside it.

where did i say anything about girls who ONLY care about material things?

you think being female excludes girls from having an opinion about how things look? if that was the case, the makeup industry wouldnt be worth billions.

the world isn't black & white; all or nothing. it's an infinite amount of gray shades.

according to your logic, you shouldn't date a girl unless it doesn't bother her at all that you'd pick her up for dinner in a car w/ giant rust holes, no doors, burnt oil coming through the vents, and cat piss all over the seats. goes both ways.

[Gadflyii]

for the same price point you really should drive the WRX.... night and day better than the mazda speed 3, turbo, all wheel drive, and a functional back seat.

They make great every day cars.

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by Staticz

Hello, I am 22 and recently graduated college and started a good job. I have been shopping/researching cars, as I will be purchasing something this spring/summer. I really want something sporty and fun to drive. My current daily driver is an 03 Camry, which is about as opposite of sporty/fun as you can get.

Obviously, the frs/brz was designed to be a track car... I have never done any track stuff, but it is something I would like to try in the future if I end up with a car worthy of it. But predominantly, I want a car that I can drive to work every day, enjoy cruising around on the highway, and occasionally have some twisty back road fun.

The frs/brz stands out to me, I love the interior and exterior styling, design goals, specs, and every review I've read praises the cars. But basically, my question to you guys is do you think this would be a good choice for someone in my situation?

Other cars I have been looking into include: new genesis coupe 2.0T, veloster turbo, GTI, mustang v6, civic SI, Mazda 3.

Any opinions, suggestions, etc would be much appreciated!

Go for it. You sound like you're in a good position to purchase a car of this price.

Don't worry about it being a "track car." It's not really. It's a lightweight, good mileage, forgiving suspension all-purpose driving knife. The marketing behind the car is being geared towards a lot of track stuff because marketers know that owners want to buy something "authentic." This is no more of a track car than say, the most recent Toyota Celica or Civic Si. It just happens to be rear wheel drive, and FUN to drive on a track if you so choose. It lacks the rock hard suspension, road-rut following wide tires, and other compromises of a track-day special. It's so quiet that they had to pipe in engine intake noise to the cabin to make it sound exciting from inside.


With the rear seats folded it even has a decent amount of utility, so unless you have a wife and 2.3 kids to worry about, it's pretty much ideal.

[Nafe]

By "GTI" I assume you mean VW Golf GTI?
Do you want "sporty" or "sports car"?
This is really a sports car. It's low, light, RWD, has decent power.
If you want something safe, somewhat quick and somewhat fun, get a Mazda3 SP25. They are great cars, lots of fun. But not a sports car like this

[Re_Invention]

Originally Posted by HitTheGas

where did i say anything about girls who ONLY care about material things?

you think being female excludes girls from having an opinion about how things look? if that was the case, the makeup industry wouldnt be worth billions.

the world isn't black & white; all or nothing. it's an infinite amount of gray shades.

according to your logic, you shouldn't date a girl unless it doesn't bother her at all that you'd pick her up for dinner in a car w/ giant rust holes, no doors, burnt oil coming through the vents, and cat piss all over the seats. goes both ways.

Nope, can't back peddle your way outta this one. SVTSHC's remark is valid, yours is out of proportion and your reductionist argument is weak.

OP, have you considered leasing? Not sure how it'll pan out financially but it sounds like you aren't heart set on any one vehicle(s) and may not even be happy or content with a vehicle in this category where comfort is compromised, especially if this is your only car. Might be something to check out. I remember an older gen WRX was going for a good rate some years ago (relevant because sporty model), dunno what's out there now.

Also, consider your life style. How often do you have passengers, how much do you sit in traffic, how often do you transport items, recreational activities, etc. Personally, I've come to terms that the FR-S will likely be too cramped (~6'2 with 36'' leg) for my liking and have since turned my attention to the 2013 Genesis Coupe 2.0T R Spec. I like having rear seats for throwing a backpack or shoes or whatever in but I don't take more then 1 passenger, I can recline my chair when I feel like it (good luck trying that in a Z), I plan to keep the car as a second toy car once it's 10 year/100k mile warranty expires (also a great selling point), barring transmission issues (which are supposedly addressed now) - the Gen coupe seems more reliable then most GTI models [DSG hiccups, DI carbon build up, coilpacks, etc.], or Speed3 [engine mounts, transmission, etc.] and for 2013 offers similar levels of 'bang for the buck' and better mpg then either Camaro or Mustang V6 models as well as having nicer interiors, superior build quality, similar resale, greater MPG, and more engaging drive dynamics.

It is an ugly car, however, and the GTI is a much nicer upscale place to be inside - but I enjoy the Gen Coupe for what it is - the inexpensive Korean alternative that tries to be a bit more boy racer with the appropriate parts.

[Maxim]

Originally Posted by Re_Invention

Nope, can't back peddle your way outta this one. SVTSHC's remark is valid, yours is out of proportion and your reductionist argument is weak.

OP, have you considered leasing? Not sure how it'll pan out financially but it sounds like you aren't heart set on any one vehicle(s) and may not even be happy or content with a vehicle in this category where comfort is compromised, especially if this is your only car. Might be something to check out. I remember an older gen WRX was going for a good rate some years ago (relevant because sporty model), dunno what's out there now.

Also, consider your life style. How often do you have passengers, how much do you sit in traffic, how often do you transport items, recreational activities, etc. Personally, I've come to terms that the FR-S will likely be too cramped (~6'2 with 36'' leg) for my liking and have since turned my attention to the 2013 Genesis Coupe 2.0T R Spec. I like having rear seats for throwing a backpack or shoes or whatever in but I don't take more then 1 passenger, I can recline my chair when I feel like it (good luck trying that in a Z), I plan to keep the car as a second toy car once it's 10 year/100k mile warranty expires (also a great selling point), barring transmission issues (which are supposedly addressed now) - the Gen coupe seems more reliable then most GTI models [DSG hiccups, DI carbon build up, coilpacks, etc.], or Speed3 [engine mounts, transmission, etc.] and for 2013 offers similar levels of 'bang for the buck' and better mpg then either Camaro or Mustang V6 models as well as having nicer interiors, superior build quality, similar resale, greater MPG, and more engaging drive dynamics.

It is an ugly car, however, and the GTI is a much nicer upscale place to be inside - but I enjoy the Gen Coupe for what it is - the inexpensive Korean alternative that tries to be a bit more boy racer with the appropriate parts.

Leasing to own might be a very viable way for him to reduce the monthly payment if he isn't willing to put down a sizable deposit. However, if he's established some credit, taken out student loans in his own name, kept a credit card and used it regularly while paying off, etc, he may be able to get a very competitive APR on a vehicle loan. If he can, then I would go that route. More money spent up front but less in the long term.

It all depends on how comfortable he is with an investment. No, a car isn't a financial investment, but it is an enjoyment investment. Many people like switching cars every 3 years because the newness wears off and they get bored with what they have. Getting into the mod scene cures me of this, but everybody is different and if this is his first new car, a lease might be a good way to test the waters and find out about his own desires in terms of a vehicle.

[Staticz]

I have considered leasing, but I really would prefer to own the car. Financially I should be fine, I have had a credit card for 5 years or so, have no student loans, and cost of living is fairly low here. If I stay in the 20-25k range, I shoul be fine.

I think I have so many options still open at this point because I havnt started test driving yet.. I'm sure it will get narrowed down to 2-3 cars once I test drive. As for the gen coupe, it was first on my list for a few days before I started researching the fr-s. the problem with gen coupe, gti, and wrx is they msrp in the 24-25k range. The lowest I've seen a gti listed for at a dealer is about 26.5k.. Maybe I should talk to a dealer about price if I ordered a fresh gti without any of the expensive options

I fear the brz will have a similar price issue, but hopefully the frs is closer to the civic SI/v6 mustang price

[Re_Invention]

Check out http://www.truecar.com/ for pricing. You'll need a very aggressive dealership to match but it isn't unheard of. If anything, use it as a reference for what a reasonable negotiation point may be.

OT; the VW Tiguan is actually cheaper then a GTI here in SoCal (both equip with DSG). It's essentially the same car, just in mini SUV form.. Offers more practicality, more comfort, and retains much of the thrills for commuter driving (same engine, transmission, similar driving dynamics, etc.). The GTI may be slightly more potent at the track but the Tiguan is a better vehicle to tow a cheap track toy or kart

[Vasilis]

If you can afford an FR-S get the FR-S.. (or BRZ) - Be prepared to be one of the guinea pigs tho as first year models may have some problems or the ones released in the next few years will get better / cheaper or whatever. However if the info is correct you'll get great MPG.

Don't forget these reviews that praise the car may not be 100% accurate since the car isn't out in production just yet so take them with a grain of salt.

If rear seat space/access is important to you and don't mind worse mpg, consider an RX8 R3 also if possible. If you're buying new you don't have to worry about reliability since the R3 is as best as it gets at this point.

If you're short on cash and FR-S is out of your budget and can buy used, consider a Miata or 1st series of RX8. Perhaps an S2000 instead of a Miata if you like that.

Anything else besides these and you're not in the same kind of car

I'd stay away from the Hyundai personally - As good as it sounds on spec sheet, it feels quite cheap and it's a Hyundai (I'm not a badge snob but at least Toyota, Subaru or Mazda have some heritage). Also it's ugly and not special enough. - It's one advantage is that it's turbo from the factory (I'm guessing its easier to squeeze a few more power out of it).

I'd also consider a Mazdaspeed6 if you can find it. It's classy, lots of room + luxury and it's AWD with 265hp if im not mistaken. Better than the FWD Mazda3 in my eyes

If you're straying away from the balanced RWD sports cars and going for more power + cruising the Mustang isn't a bad choice!


If you ultimately want the FR-S though, consider settling for something else for a couple of years in hope of a turbo/supercharged version or stick to your Camry if you can put up with it

The most important aspect for me that will eventually drive away or towards the FR-S is the aftermarket support and possibility of forced induction. That will require time and patience though, however you can take a leap of faith !

[HitTheGas]

Originally Posted by Re_Invention

Nope, can't back peddle your way outta this one. SVTSHC's remark is valid, yours is out of proportion and your reductionist argument is weak.

back pedaling implies that i changed/reversed what i said. i didn't.

he just drew a conclusion from his own imagination, misinterpreting my meaning. making the false assumption that there are only 2 types of females in this big wide world (& assuming that i was just wrong as to where the line was drawn). ones who only care about what you think ("worthwhile women"*), and ones who only care about what you own ("gold diggers"*).

* SVTSHC's qualifiers

a very depressing way to view the world.

what i said was

Aside from that, in the price range the FR-S, BRZ or GTI would be the cars to look at. The Hyundais are ugly imo + you'll be stuck w/ the stigma of driving a Hyundai (not going to impress the ladies). The civic Si is FWD like the GTI, but the GTI has a really nice interior which the Si lacks (& a better engine).

notice i said nothing about the GTI or civic? even though they're in the same price range as the veloster turbo? obviously i wasn't talking about "gold diggers", SVTSHC pulled that out of thin air. & you decided to follow, ignoring what i actually said originally.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by HitTheGas

back pedaling implies that i changed/reversed what i said. i didn't.

he just drew a conclusion from his own imagination, misinterpreting my meaning. making the false assumption that there are only 2 types of females in this big wide world (& assuming that i was just wrong as to where the line was drawn). ones who only care about what you think ("worthwhile women"*), and ones who only care about what you own ("gold diggers"*).

* SVTSHC's qualifiers

a very depressing way to view the world.

what i said was
notice i said nothing about the GTI or civic? even though they're in the same price range as the veloster turbo? obviously i wasn't talking about "gold diggers", SVTSHC pulled that out of thin air. & you decided to follow, ignoring what i actually said originally.

If you buy a car with the intentions of impressing the ladies like you posted then you are going after golddiggers. A woman shouldn't be impressed with your car to begin with and I am not saying a woman can't like the car you drive. But if that's what got her interested in you then she is a hoe.

I just asked my GF the same question without mentioning this thread and she said the same thing. GOLDDIGGERS!!

[ChrisH]

Hi

Just a little comment about the FR-S/BRZ to be a "track car".
A "real" race car or very specialized track cars often show strong limitations in all day use, mainly because the suspension is much to stiff, so you loose mechanical traction and get a hard ride instead. Also the ground clearance as well as limited front slope angles make all day use nearly impossible. These issues start allready with well known street supercars like Lambo, Porsche GT3 etc.

However, the FR-S/BRZ is luckily NOT a track car in this sense and does NOT have all these limitations. The ground clearance seems to be absolutely fine and the suspension seem to be not too stiff at all. (But keep in mind, all cars so far are pre-production modells). That's excatly what makes the car so nice: A lot of fun on race tracks, but not all these limitations..... So a lot of fun in slow or fast all day use, too.

I think the one and only draw back in all day use is actually the limited space on the rear seats - for the people, who care about this point (I wouldn't).

Please find here the proof, that you can store very nice "luggage" on the rear seats





...as well as some bulky practical stuff:







BR
ChrisH

[HitTheGas]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

If you buy a car with the intentions of impressing the ladies like you posted then you are going after golddiggers. A woman shouldn't be impressed with your car to begin with and I am not saying a woman can't like the car you drive. But if that's what got her interested in you then she is a hoe.

I just asked my GF the same question without mentioning this thread and she said the same thing. GOLDDIGGERS!!

again, you're assuming that's the only reason.

and you guys are deluding yourselves if you don't think women can like or dislike things based on how they look. it doesn't mean that they make all their life decisions on it.

saying an ugly car isn't going to impress the ladies (a jestful saying); is not the same thing as saying, you have to buy a certain cars TO impress the opposite sex. or saying, if you don't buy this car women won't want to date you.

context

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by HitTheGas

again, you're assuming that's the only reason.

and you guys are deluding yourselves if you don't think women can like or dislike things based on how they look. it doesn't mean that they make all their life decisions on it.

saying an ugly car isn't going to impress the ladies (a jestful saying); is not the same thing as saying, you have to buy a certain cars TO impress the opposite sex. or saying, if you don't buy this car women won't want to date you.

context

The problem is you didn't mention that would be the reason why it wouldn't impress a women. You said a HYUNDAI will not impress the ladies. Now if you said an UGLY car won't impress the ladies then that's a different story. Only problem with that is everybody has different opinions on styling.