Where is your line drawn between the FR-S and BRZ?

[ahausheer]

In my opinion the front end of the BRZ looks better in person than in pics. Perhaps you may want to wait until you see it in real life to pass judgment. Of course this is subjective but in my opinion the BRZ is quite the good looking car. In pics, however, it looks bland and that is because the dimensions and scale are lost.

[dookie11]

Originally Posted by ahausheer

In my opinion the front end of the BRZ looks better in person than in pics. Perhaps you may want to wait until you see it in real life to pass judgment. Of course this is subjective but in my opinion the BRZ is quite the good looking car. In pics, however, it looks bland and that is because the dimensions and scale are lost.

Does the front end look like the Mazda3? I'm constantly reminded of it cuz of the plastic bumper thing... that's why I was happy to see that in photos for SWP and DGM it didn't look too bad.

[ahausheer]

Originally Posted by dookie11

Does the front end look like the Mazda3?

No absolutely not. The front end is really rather neutral and, if anything, blends well with the rest of the car. It is not loud visually in any way. My eyes were drawn more to the center and rear of the car. All Mazdas have that ridiculous grill that is very attention grabbing and is nearly the center of focus. The BRZ's grill plays more of a supporting role. I.E. it looks, dare I say it, classy with a touch of restraint.

[KevinDuMa]

Originally Posted by ahausheer

No absolutely not. The front end is really rather neutral and, if anything, blends well with the rest of the car. It is not loud visually in any way. My eyes were drawn more to the center and rear of the car. All Mazdas have that ridiculous grill that is very attention grabbing and is nearly the center of focus. The BRZ's grill plays more of a supporting role. I.E. it looks, dare I say it, classy with a touch of restraint.

I agree old chum...I've been looking at BRZ's so much the Fr-s front looks naked...like having a friend with a mustache for so long and he finally shaves it off

[Khyron686]

I'd like the push start and hids, and I don't care one way or the other about auto-climate but I cannot stand uni-color dash clusters (ie, the BRZ all red nothing but red). And in Canada, our lights are on pretty much all the time cause it's DARK. And since that's the thing I spend 90% of the time looking at....

[HitTheGas]

The lower cost of the FR-S

+ the black dash, instead of the silver dash of the BRZ

+ i like the higher rear end on the FR-S

[Jokester]

Originally Posted by ahausheer

In my opinion the front end of the BRZ looks better in person than in pics. Perhaps you may want to wait until you see it in real life to pass judgment. Of course this is subjective but in my opinion the BRZ is quite the good looking car. In pics, however, it looks bland and that is because the dimensions and scale are lost.

I have a spot reserved at a Scion dealer for a FR-S and a BRZ at the Subaru down the street. Both know my situation and are hoping I just pick the one I truly want. I am waiting until the NY Auto Show to see both in person if I am still in a dead heat or a realatively close race after pricing, etc... details are released in approx. 30 days!

But the BRZ is starting to grow on me, enough to make it close. The suspension dampening is the only other bugaboo I have with the BRZ due to my preference of oversteer to understeer.

[FRSpdDmn]

Originally Posted by FRSpdDmn

They will both understeer at the limit, in steady state. The BRZ will just understeer more-so. The understeer can be driven around in both, but more easily in the FR-S. All the videos you see of the FR-S drifting are VERY intentional. No one in this day in age is selling cars who's natrual tendancy is to oversteer. As for which is faster, I believe that the FR-S will have more front end grip, which we've established as the limiting factor in outright, steady state grip, due to the slightly softer front end settings, relative to the rear. As long as this is true and the handling change is due to added front grip, rather than reduced rear grip, then the FR-S should lap a circuit at exactly .001% faster

Rear-engined Porsches are their own animal. They need to be driven completely differently in order to keep out of the realm of excessive understeer. However, they are set up relatively "safely", with a good helping of understeer in the more pedestrian models, because they are harder to control in an oversteer condition. And before you ask, I've driven a lot of Porsches, from street to full race prep, on the track, so I'm not talking out of my ass.

Yes, I'm quoting myself from another thread here...
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...?t=3740&page=4

FR-S for me. I work for Toyota so I will get it at cost. Not to mention that I prefer the suspension setup and price. While I like the features of the BRZ, they add weight and cost that don't add to the driving experience. This car is about FUN for me.

[Jokester]

Originally Posted by FRSpdDmn

Yes, I'm quoting myself from another thread here...
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...?t=3740&page=4

FR-S for me. I work for Toyota so I will get it at cost. Not to mention that I prefer the suspension setup and price. While I like the features of the BRZ, they add weight and cost that don't add to the driving experience. This car is about FUN for me.

So you're getting a FR-S at cost huh... All the Scion dealers keep saying their "Scion Pure Pricing" bullcrap, but I have never paid more than a nickel to a thousand over invoice, and I won't start now. I will not put up with that, lol.

[tripjammer]

To me since both cars are basically the same...it comes down to price and which looks better on the inside. You spend all your time on the inside of the car not the outside. If the FR-S looks way cheaper on the inside...(no red stitching) and the price is really close I will go BRZ.

[HitTheGas]

Originally Posted by Jokester

So you're getting a FR-S at cost huh... All the Scion dealers keep saying their "Scion Pure Pricing" bullcrap, but I have never paid more than a nickel to a thousand over invoice, and I won't start now. I will not put up with that, lol.

MSRP is $1000 more than invoice for the tC. so paying $1000 more than invoice is like paying MSRP.

i think where u have negotiating power is on the "document fees". some dealers will try to charge you hundreds, others it will be free. that's about the only negotiating power u have when buying a scion.

unless you're getting accessories, u can price shop for those since they're not set in stone & usually have a big markup.

The good part about scion requiring dealers to sell at one price, is that they cant jack the price up at release because of high demand. so as long as u get there first, you'll get the car at the same price as someone who buys it 8 months later.

But the bad part is, if you get the BRZ instead; you can get a better deal (as far as saving money) if you're a smart shopper & haggle. That's assuming u'd spring for the nav & fog lights on the scion.

[Jokester]

Originally Posted by tripjammer

To me since both cars are basically the same...it comes down to price and which looks better on the inside. You spend all your time on the inside of the car not the outside. If the FR-S looks way cheaper on the inside...(no red stitching) and the price is really close I will go BRZ.

+1

[Jokester]

Originally Posted by HitTheGas

MSRP is $1000 more than invoice for the tC. so paying $1000 more than invoice is like paying MSRP.

i think where u have negotiating power is on the "document fees". some dealers will try to charge you hundreds, others it will be free. that's about the only negotiating power u have when buying a scion.

unless you're getting accessories, u can price shop for those since they're not set in stone & usually have a big markup.

The good part about scion requiring dealers to sell at one price, is that they cant jack the price up at release because of high demand. so as long as u get there first, you'll get the car at the same price as someone who buys it 8 months later.

But the bad part is, if you get the BRZ instead; you can get a better deal (as far as saving money) if you're a smart shopper & haggle. That's assuming u'd spring for the nav & fog lights on the scion.

true!

[86'd]

I go back and forth between the two.

I like both the boy racer styling of the FRS, but the more mature styling of the BRZ. The front bumper of the BRZ is growing on me, but the HIDs are really cool looking. I would hate to be driving a Scion and see in my rearview the BRZ headlights; I think I would always be a bit jealous.

I would love a Limited BRZ, but I don't care for the spoiler too much. I like the Push Button Start option, but I like it more for the "Smart Key" and ease of getting in and out of the car. The climate control isn't a deal breaker and I don't need heated seats or leather.

So more and more it's looking like either the FRS or the BRZ Premium. Unless the Limited is priced right. And the so far the estimated prices for all models are inching higher and higher.

I hope they are $23k for the FRS, $25k for the BRZ and $27k for the Limited.
Sigh.