how many miles before first oil change

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted by SirBrass

Stock subaru oil is indeed synthetic. And it's essentially re-branded mobile 1.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

Actually the factory fill for both cars is Idemitsu. The dealer service fill for the Subaru is also Idemitsu and the dealer service fill on the Scion is made by Exxon Mobil and is a different formula than Mobil1 0W-20.

Originally Posted by sierra

Why not spend the money on an oil change instead?

In the context of the original post, because the factory fill has higher levels of some anti-wear additives (like molybdenum and zddp) than the oil that you can get from the dealer and it is beneficial to follow the OEM's recommendations during break-in instead of going by how an oil looks or because someone thinks there's a lot of metal in the factory fill.

And in the context of changing oil too early in general, because the SAE has written papers on how used oil can be better than new. It can take mileage, time, and heat for the additives in oil to activate.
Used oil better than new?
This can be seen in cases where someone does uoa's at say 1,000 mile intervals but does not change the oil. The first few uoa's can show higher wear metals than the uoa's towards the end of the interval.

And because it's just a waste to change oil too early.
http://www.edmunds.com/car-care/stop...-your-oil.html

-Dennis

[sierra]

Originally Posted by bluesubie

Actually the factory fill for both cars is Idemitsu. The dealer service fill for the Subaru is also Idemitsu and the dealer service fill on the Scion is made by Exxon Mobil and is a different formula than Mobil1 0W-20.


In the context of the original post, because the factory fill has higher levels of some anti-wear additives (like molybdenum and zddp) than the oil that you can get from the dealer and it is beneficial to follow the OEM's recommendations during break-in instead of going by how an oil looks or because someone thinks there's a lot of metal in the factory fill.

And in the context of changing oil too early in general, because the SAE has written papers on how used oil can be better than new. It can take mileage, time, and heat for the additives in oil to activate.
Used oil better than new?
This can be seen in cases where someone does uoa's at say 1,000 mile intervals but does not change the oil. The first few uoa's can show higher wear metals than the uoa's towards the end of the interval.

And because it's just a waste to change oil too early.
http://www.edmunds.com/car-care/stop...-your-oil.html

-Dennis

So when I was an apprentice and broke, using used sump oil from the service station waste tank to top up my knackered engine, I was unwittingly doing the right thing.

If that is correct we should only replace 50% of the old oil to protect the engine until the new oil starts doing its job properly.

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by sierra

So when I was an apprentice and broke, using used sump oil from the service station waste tank to top up my knackered engine, I was unwittingly doing the right thing.

If that is correct we should only replace 50% of the old oil to protect the engine until the new oil starts doing its job properly.

Not a problem if you drive a pre 80's Alfa Romeo, the oil leaks and burns so fast you only needed to top up and change the filter periodically. No drain plug was needed.

[sierra]

Originally Posted by Suberman

Not a problem if you drive a pre 80's Alfa Romeo, the oil leaks and burns so fast you only needed to top up and change the filter periodically. No drain plug was needed.

My first cars were all early fords with the 1172cc side valve engine, 3 speed box and cable brakes. Amazingly I only destroyed one engine, it was winter, with no heater and I was wearing one of those Russian style fur lined hats with a tranny tucked inside one of the ear flaps. I didn't hear it start to rattle and give it a top up with used sump oil and it was terminal when it lost power and stopped.

It was almost more fun in those days because it was an adventure into the unknown going anywhere!

[PERRIN_Chris]

Subaru recommends the first oil change at 3,000 miles, then at 7,500, and every 7,500 miles after. You can stick to that and you'll be fine.

[pche]

Originally Posted by PERRIN_Chris

Subaru recommends the first oil change at 3,000 miles, then at 7,500, and every 7,500 miles after. You can stick to that and you'll be fine.

Agree, that's what Subaru wants you to do. But Subaru also considers burning 1 quart per 1000 miles is acceptable. So you do the math.

Here's what I did. I drove the car pretty aggressively the first 500 miles. Making sure I don't stay in consistent RPM, to set the rings. Change the oil at 500, to get all the break in shit out, which there was some. Then follow the 7500 interval. If you drive like I do, I do it every 5000.

Not saying that's the golden rule, just what I did.

[Zechs21]

I want to change oil filters without replacing the oil. If I unscrewed the filter without emptying the oil, will the oil spurt out?

[sierra]

Originally Posted by Zechs21

I want to change oil filters without replacing the oil. If I unscrewed the filter without emptying the oil, will the oil spurt out?

Only if the engine's still running!

Let it stand overnight and the filter will drain down so it's empty.

[ndsleep612]

I did mine around 3500. Let's just say that the oil was DIRTY. If Toyota "recommends" 7500, I seriously doubt they care about the longevity of their customer's cars. Basically if the engines blow, more sales.

[Gary in NJ]

Originally Posted by ndsleep612

I did mine around 3500. Let's just say that the oil was DIRTY. If Toyota "recommends" 7500, I seriously doubt they care about the longevity of their customer's cars. Basically if the engines blow, more sales.

That's just dumb. Yes, Toyota does depend on repeat sales. You don't get customers to come back if their "engines blow". You don't get their friends and family to consider the brand if their engines blow. Consumer and enthusiast publications don't recommend a car if their engines blows. A car company couldn't survive if their engines blow or that they want them to fail. It's about the dumbest premise on the planet.

You may have a hard time believing this, but there are a team of engineers at Toyota that conduct direct testing to determine the longevity of the engine. THIS INCLUDES HOW OFTEN TO CHANGE OIL.

If you are unsure how often or when to change oil, here's a little hint: READ THE OWNERS MANUAL. Toyota has a vested interest to ensure that your engine meets its design life. That design life is around 250,000 miles!

BTW, oil color has nothing to do with the condition of the oil.

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by ndsleep612

I did mine around 3500. Let's just say that the oil was DIRTY. If Toyota "recommends" 7500, I seriously doubt they care about the longevity of their customer's cars. Basically if the engines blow, more sales.

You can't tell if your oil is dirty by looking at it. If you could then that's what the owners manual would say indicates you needs an oil change.

The reason the owners manual doesn't say that is because it is just a fact that engine oil needs to be changed by mileage or time, whichever comes first.

"Dirty oil" claims is a technique used by oil change places to sell more oil.

Engine manufacturers are very conservative in recommending oil changes. In reality the oil lasts much longer in the majority of cases. The change interval is set for the more severe conditions usually expected. Only if you really punish your oil frequently driving very hard on a track or by multiple short trips to the grocery store where the engine never gets hot, stick with the factory's recommendations.

[sierra]

Regardless of what you say there is no way I would continue to use engine oil that was black.
It's contaminated and getting replaced.

[ndsleep612]

Originally Posted by Gary in NJ

If you are unsure how often or when to change oil, here's a little hint: READ THE OWNERS MANUAL. Toyota has a vested interest to ensure that your engine meets its design life. That design life is around 250,000 miles!

BTW, oil color has nothing to do with the condition of the oil.

The Owner's Manual is just a base guideline for the servicing based on approx. mileage. It's not the "ne plus ultra" service manual.

So if you track your car roughly once a month and your mileage is below 7500, don't tell me that you won't change your motor oil just because the service manual said so.

If the oil is black and contaminated, therefore it is "dirty".

[Suberman]

Originally Posted by ndsleep612

The Owner's Manual is just a base guideline for the servicing based on approx. mileage. It's not the "ne plus ultra" service manual.

So if you track your car roughly once a month and your mileage is below 7500, don't tell me that you won't change your motor oil just because the service manual said so.

If the oil is black and contaminated, therefore it is "dirty".

Incorrect. Oil colour means NOTHING.