What does it cost you to race? (Cost of racing)

[smbstyle]

Originally Posted by GTHachiRoku

While that's better than the figure above, I still think I'd be in trouble if I spent that much on a weekend, let alone 4-5 weekends a year.

Only costs you see really each weekend are entry fee and hotel; then a few hundred dollar expenses throughout the year for the items listed.

Also, for Sebring events, I don't have to pay for a hotel as it's close enough to drive back and forth.

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by GTHachiRoku

I'd be in trouble if I spent that much on a weekend, let alone 4-5 weekends a year.

A wise man once told me, "just make more money". It was good advice.


As for the costs I've posted: that's when I'm really competing or splurging.. buying new tires, not sleeping in the van etc. When the competition isn't really stiff I buy used tires and when the g/f isn't with me I'll sometimes sleep in the Van (conversion van FTW). Also 2 of the tracks I race at I'm only 50 minutes away so I don't need a hotel.

Another way I've saved money is by renting the car. My dad would come to a few races and drive it in an alternate run group. So he paid for half the hotel, half the gas and then cut me a check for his portion of the wear and tear. My dad stopped racing now so I think I'll be renting the car to other drivers which I've done a few times before. Basically for $400-500 all the other driver has to do is show up, pay their own entry fee and the car is ready to go. Of course they pay for any damages and have to have the means to replace the car or write a check for it if it's written off ($10k).

Another guy I race with shares his car with his wife. He races in ITA and her in H4. That definitely keeps costs down, sharing a car.

So the costs I've listed above isn't the complete picture when I take into account savings. Like in 2013 I only bought 1 set of tires that I only put 15 sessions on. I was racing on free or cheap used tires all year.

[ayau]

Wonder if Spec Miata racing is more/less expensive or similar.

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by ayau

Wonder if Spec Miata racing is more/less expensive or similar.

Do you want to win?

[ayau]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Do you want to win?

Thought all cars had to be a certain "spec". Are there certain loopholes that money can buy?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by ayau

Thought all cars had to be a certain "spec". Are there certain loopholes that money can buy?

The spec is not one number. It's a range of tolerance. You can game that tolerance...

[rice_classic]

Game the tolerances just like Mike said.

Think of buying all the parts needed to build a factory engine, now do that 12 times. You now have 12 sets of parts. You pull out your scale and micrometer and start weighing and measuring every part: Crank, cams, bearings, pistons, rods, heads, lifters, springs, gears.. you name it. Then you assemble the engine that is the total sum of all the parts that are as good as they can be. And poof, that's how you get a $10 or $15k spec miata engine.

Other than engines there are ways of spending money to find small advantages: Guys running motor oil in their wheel bearings and replacing them every session (lower rolling resistance). Drivers who only race on brand new tires, every race. That's $800 in tires for every race, some guys race twice per weekend. Very expensive data acquisition systems and so on an so forth.

Spec Miata and ITA are some of the most affordable classes in club racing but if you're in an area with steep (and I mean steeeeeep) competition then guys who have the money will always spend it. When a spec class gets competitive the cost to run up front can get out of hand pretty quickly unless there's rules put in place to cap spending like engine buy-out rules.

In our local club we have Spec Miata and it got out of hand... we're talking Spec Miatas that were rumored to be over $30k. So since our club is run by the members, one of our SM drivers created a new class called CSM (Club-Spec Miata). This was identical to Spec Miata with the exception that you were allowed, after a race, to ask a driver that beat you to you sell you his engine at a price set in the rules (like $3000 or so). Per the rules the other driver had to agree and sell you his engine. The point here is that nobody would want to be required to sell a $10k engine for $3k. So the rich guys stayed in SM while the budget guys (who were just as competitive) raced in CSM where they knew they would be competing with their skills instead of their wallets.

And the heavens rejoiced.

[smbstyle]

Originally Posted by ayau

Wonder if Spec Miata racing is more/less expensive or similar.

Depends where you want to be and how competitive your region is; my price sheet I posted could maintain a mid-pack SM car with a good driver at a regional race. Mid-pack Spec Miata = Spec Pinata.

[Seattle944t]

Old joke that I learned when club racing a 944 Turbo:

Q: How do you make a small fortune in racing?

A: Start with a large fortune.

[ayau]

Originally Posted by rice_classic

Game the tolerances just like Mike said.

Think of buying all the parts needed to build a factory engine, now do that 12 times. You now have 12 sets of parts. You pull out your scale and micrometer and start weighing and measuring every part: Crank, cams, bearings, pistons, rods, heads, lifters, springs, gears.. you name it. Then you assemble the engine that is the total sum of all the parts that are as good as they can be. And poof, that's how you get a $10 or $15k spec miata engine.

Other than engines there are ways of spending money to find small advantages: Guys running motor oil in their wheel bearings and replacing them every session (lower rolling resistance). Drivers who only race on brand new tires, every race. That's $800 in tires for every race, some guys race twice per weekend. Very expensive data acquisition systems and so on an so forth.

Spec Miata and ITA are some of the most affordable classes in club racing but if you're in an area with steep (and I mean steeeeeep) competition then guys who have the money will always spend it. When a spec class gets competitive the cost to run up front can get out of hand pretty quickly unless there's rules put in place to cap spending like engine buy-out rules.

In our local club we have Spec Miata and it got out of hand... we're talking Spec Miatas that were rumored to be over $30k. So since our club is run by the members, one of our SM drivers created a new class called CSM (Club-Spec Miata). This was identical to Spec Miata with the exception that you were allowed, after a race, to ask a driver that beat you to you sell you his engine at a price set in the rules (like $3000 or so). Per the rules the other driver had to agree and sell you his engine. The point here is that nobody would want to be required to sell a $10k engine for $3k. So the rich guys stayed in SM while the budget guys (who were just as competitive) raced in CSM where they knew they would be competing with their skills instead of their wallets.

And the heavens rejoiced.

Really like the CSM rule, but that sounds pretty crazy. I'd assume it'd be possible to still win, given enough driver skills, on a $1k engine, no? Just trying to get a feel of how much advantage a $10k could give you. Do they dyno much higher than the "standard" engine?

[rice_classic]

Originally Posted by ayau

Really like the CSM rule, but that sounds pretty crazy. I'd assume it'd be possible to still win, given enough driver skills, on a $1k engine, no? Just trying to get a feel of how much advantage a $10k could give you. Do they dyno much higher than the "standard" engine?

Find yourself in a field of 5, 10 or even 15 equally talented fellows and at the power/weight ratios of a spec pinata a 1 or 2hp advantage can be the different of being 1st or 5th.

Same with tires. When the talent and spec is that close the difference of a set of tires that has 5 sessions on them vs 0 sessions on them can be the difference of 5 places after a 30 minute race.

At some point the driver become exceedingly fast and consistent being able to run flat out laps that are within 2/10's seconds of each other, lap after lap after lap. So if that other person's car is 1/10th of a second faster than yours, then after 18 laps he finishes the race 1.8 seconds in front of you. Sometimes you can make up for it in the draft, but then you're only hope of winning is to pass on the S/F straight on the last lap and you have to be good enough all race long to not make a mistake, to be flawless.

Goddamn it feels good just to talk about it! I'm feeling very competitive right now. I think I'm going to sit in the race car and watch in-car footage on my laptop.

[DougW]

You forgot the multiplying factor if you are married, you have to spend one to one on the wife/racecar so double your original estimate. In 1994/5 I spent 5k per race if nothing went wrong for a 45 min IMSA supercar 300ZXTT just for track expense about 250 to run the program so the closer to the front you run the more it cost.
DougW

[solidONE]

When this question was asked to several amateurs and some pro racers after a charity endurance race I did, one of the guys answered "everything." They all agreed.

[ultra]

Q: What does it cost you to race?

A: Everything, if you don't have clear goals, expectations and a budget to match set in stone *before* you start racing.

I'm saying that as a guy who veeered between track days, autocross and time attack competition in street oriented cars over a number of years until I eventually ran out of bank account, at which point I realized that I could have bought and raced a Radical for the same money I spend hopping up, breaking and repairing numerous street cars.

Also, the best proper racing action I ever had was in Go Karts. Go figure.

Main point: think, plan and set limits before you dive in. There's a form of racing out there for almost any budget.