Unofficial - CEL/SL/Idle Issue List for FR-S/BRZ Owners

[regal]

Originally Posted by FR-S Trev

FR-S TREV, FRS, 45,000 kms, in shop since July 23rd 2013!!!!, Canada

Crusing at HWY speeds toward the mountains, and kaput!! CEL came on, SL lights came on, Cruise control lights turned orange, etc...... Car started bucking and sputtering. But the engine was running the whole time. Took in to local Toyota for answers. They changed the High Pressure fuel pump, as this was the code they were getting. Drove away from shop 3 blocks when it happened again. Returned to Toyota to drop it off and haven't driven it since.

The shop foreman took it for a rip to get some data for Toyota and in the process the engine finally let go. One of the Catalytic converters let go a perfect circle out the middle into the other one and blew it through my exhaust. All the pistons and cams are scored and there is so much carbon build up in the engine I can't believe it.

Last week the last of the back ordered parts arrived to start building me a new engine (or so I thought). Got a call again yesterday saying I was still waiting for 7 rocker arms to arrive. So here I sit with a rental car (which my dealer is taking care of I might add ) And it looks like I'll get it back just in time to park it for the winter. Bhaaaa Frustrating summer indeed. All I wanted to do was drive my car :P

SO my ordeal has lasted about 3 months now and I finally see a light at the end of the tunnel. Lets just hope the shop can build and FA-20 better than the factory ?????

what is your build date ?

[FR-S Trev]

Originally Posted by regal

what is your build date ?

I'm not sure. Pardon my noobness but how do I find that info out? Is there a code in my VIN that will tell me?

[Marrk]

Originally Posted by FR-S Trev

I'm not sure. Pardon my noobness but how do I find that info out? Is there a code in my VIN that will tell me?

Open the driver's door and check the sticker (should be white in color). Along with other info, you will find a month and year.

[FR-S Trev]

Originally Posted by Marrk

Open the driver's door and check the sticker (should be white in color). Along with other info, you will find a month and year.

Lol. Figured it would have been this easy. I'll let you folks know the build date as soon as I see my car again.

[FR-S Trev]

Originally Posted by regal

what is your build date ?

Build Date is 07/12

[Eddie]

Add my BRZ to the list:

build date 07/12
last 4 of VIN 3003
~6000kms

I have had the rough idle on and off through the winter in Montreal (chalked it up to the cold along with limited use), but I got the severe shakes just after my move and that triggered the codes P0300 and P0019.

[shiro]

Update 7:
23 Oct 2013

Bottom Line Up Front (BLUF): If you have modified your car's engine, ECU, drivetrain, etc. Scion will most likely not cover any of their Technical Service Board (TSB) announcements. This is because of the modifications even if the modification did not cause the issue (Said by two Scion Corporate Reps, 2013).

Yesterday, I talked with my new Scion Rep case manager--for some reason they switched reps--and they basically gave me some options for my current issues. However, the options were a little disappointing since they already knew the outcome.

1. Take car into Scion dealer and have them diagnose the issue (almost any dealer that sees a modification, whether it is an intake system, oil catch can, turbo, etc. on this car will more than likely turn you away, which corporate says "the dealers are franchises so they can turn customers away if they feel the car can harm their equipment or they do not feel comfortable working on it."

2. Submit an "Arbitrary Law" claim against the voided warranty

3. Submit a "Lemon Law" claim since the car was going to fail

4. (Funny, asked Scion Corp rep to repeat this three times) Revert everything to stock/OEM and try to see if you can do a warranty claim (Scion Corporate referred this option, it's hard to believe). Basically my Scion rep said I can pull my Turbo off and make it look like nothing has been modified. Then they had said I will need to buy/install a new ECU through the dealership and have the dealership install it. This is because the current ECU has been modified (ECUtek). However, if an authorized dealer feels that car has been modded and the issues were caused by the modifications I would basically pay for a crap ton of shop time and have a torn down engine.

Most likely the cause of my issues: ECU and AVCM failure (this will be confirmed through my Tuner Shop in a month or two with pictures) As I did more research and talked to more Scion dealers I've found that the issue is possibly caused by ECU failure or Active Valve Control System (AVCM); I personally would go with the latter.

Funny Key notes the Scion Corp rep said:

1. Toyota designed the engine, not Subaru…even though it was a group project.

2. Any Technical Service Board announcements from Subaru do NOT have anything to do with Toyota/Scion (even though they are pretty much the same...). Toyota/Scion will post their own TSB announcements and they shouldn't be mixed.

Example I brought up: Subaru TSB announcement 02-132-12, released on 21 August 2012 talks about the issues with the Active Valve Control System (designed by Toyota from what the rep said) and the issues with the cam sensors and the valve opening/closing incorrectly. Scion's TSB announcement S-SB-0033-13 on 30 August 2013 talks about the exact same issue with effective VIN range. My question: Why was this TSB just released over a month ago when Subaru identified an issue over a year ago??? And yet it has nothing to do with the FRS? Plus, my Scion reps told me throughout the summer there were no issues with my car and the idling was normal...but Subaru is on to something…

More updates to come…

[Turkish]

Originally Posted by shiro

Toyota designed the engine, not Subaru…even though it was a group project.

Funny, Subaru told me that the car is 100% Toyota except the engine which was 100% Subaru. I'm pretty sure they're both probably incorrect.


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[Snowblind]

I've now had 2 ECU failures within a month time frame. CEL comes on and the car goes into limp mode..car is currently at the dealer.

[Nothing]

Originally Posted by @Art_Mighty

Yup. If it's machining errors with the parts replacing them will resolve the issue. Personally I think even the re flashes are fixing things as much as they are "working around" machining errors.

Got a picture of the part that Toyota says is the actuator. Just want to further confirm this and next weekend when I get the ability to tear this apart and fix it I'll try and post pics.




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[shiro]

That sucks man. Bonus side is that your dealership is replacing it. I flashed mine so no more warranty, which I really don't want to know how much a new ECU is lmao.

Originally Posted by Snowblind

I've now had 2 ECU failures within a month time frame. CEL comes on and the car goes into limp mode..car is currently at the dealer.

[regal]

Originally Posted by Eddie

Add my BRZ to the list:

build date 07/12
last 4 of VIN 3003
~6000kms

I have had the rough idle on and off through the winter in Montreal (chalked it up to the cold along with limited use), but I got the severe shakes just after my move and that triggered the codes P0300 and P0019.

Mine is also a 7/12 build. Had the CEL but the dealer flash "fixed it" so far no engine work. But still frustrated that the 01C flash is not available for our cars. Kind of left us in limbo with a lot of unanswered questions as to why 2012's can't have the latest calib.

Originally Posted by shiro

Update 7:
23 Oct 2013

Bottom Line Up Front (BLUF): If you have modified your car's engine, ECU, drivetrain, etc. Scion will most likely not cover any of their Technical Service Board (TSB) announcements. This is because of the modifications even if the modification did not cause the issue (Said by two Scion Corporate Reps, 2013).

Yesterday, I talked with my new Scion Rep case manager--for some reason they switched reps--and they basically gave me some options for my current issues. However, the options were a little disappointing since they already knew the outcome.

1. Take car into Scion dealer and have them diagnose the issue (almost any dealer that sees a modification, whether it is an intake system, oil catch can, turbo, etc. on this car will more than likely turn you away, which corporate says "the dealers are franchises so they can turn customers away if they feel the car can harm their equipment or they do not feel comfortable working on it."

2. Submit an "Arbitrary Law" claim against the voided warranty

3. Submit a "Lemon Law" claim since the car was going to fail

4. (Funny, asked Scion Corp rep to repeat this three times) Revert everything to stock/OEM and try to see if you can do a warranty claim (Scion Corporate referred this option, it's hard to believe). Basically my Scion rep said I can pull my Turbo off and make it look like nothing has been modified. Then they had said I will need to buy/install a new ECU through the dealership and have the dealership install it. This is because the current ECU has been modified (ECUtek). However, if an authorized dealer feels that car has been modded and the issues were caused by the modifications I would basically pay for a crap ton of shop time and have a torn down engine.

Most likely the cause of my issues: ECU and AVCM failure (this will be confirmed through my Tuner Shop in a month or two with pictures) As I did more research and talked to more Scion dealers I've found that the issue is possibly caused by ECU failure or Active Valve Control System (AVCM); I personally would go with the latter.

Funny Key notes the Scion Corp rep said:

1. Toyota designed the engine, not Subaru…even though it was a group project.

2. Any Technical Service Board announcements from Subaru do NOT have anything to do with Toyota/Scion (even though they are pretty much the same...). Toyota/Scion will post their own TSB announcements and they shouldn't be mixed.

Example I brought up: Subaru TSB announcement 02-132-12, released on 21 August 2012 talks about the issues with the Active Valve Control System (designed by Toyota from what the rep said) and the issues with the cam sensors and the valve opening/closing incorrectly. Scion's TSB announcement S-SB-0033-13 on 30 August 2013 talks about the exact same issue with effective VIN range. My question: Why was this TSB just released over a month ago when Subaru identified an issue over a year ago??? And yet it has nothing to do with the FRS? Plus, my Scion reps told me throughout the summer there were no issues with my car and the idling was normal...but Subaru is on to something…

More updates to come…

Your post highlights why no one with early build dates should be doing any mods. If you read that TSB it basically addresses the same issue the massive flash "recall" was supposed to.

And it is a very complicated TSB, I would rather keep driving and get a new engine before expecting the local Scion mechanic to do this sort of work. Its basically a corporate CYA TSB IMO, not something that will be realistically performed.

Originally Posted by shiro

1. Toyota designed the engine, not Subaru…even though it was a group project …

Understand there is a big difference between design "engineering" and engineering. Design is basically I have an idea, a concept, I want x,y,z. There are many engineers who specialize in design because they have some grasp on what is technically achievable. But its obvious Subaru did the real leg work and engineered the entire car. Even the D4-S controls are written in Subaru code

[shiro]

Originally Posted by regal

Your post highlights why no one with early build dates should be doing any mods. If you read that TSB it basically addresses the same issue the massive flash "recall" was supposed to.

And it is a very complicated TSB, I would rather keep driving and get a new engine before expecting the local Scion mechanic to do this sort of work. Its basically a corporate CYA TSB IMO, not something that will be realistically performed.

Absolutely, you make very valid points. It is unfortunate that these outcomes happen. And it's a gamble if/when these symptoms and issues will occur. It is a fun car yet a very costly project for the original owners.

Originally Posted by regal

Understand there is a big difference between design "engineering" and engineering. Design is basically I have an idea, a concept, I want x,y,z. There are many engineers who specialize in design because they have some grasp on what is technically achievable. But its obvious Subaru did the real leg work and engineered the entire car. Even the D4-S controls are written in Subaru code

Yes, agreed. I was just a little offended how the Corporate Scion Rep worded "ownership" of the engineering. They said it in such a confident voice that it was condescending on an enthusiast's knowledge. Basically, they said it was Toyota that did all the design and work and Subaru was along for the ride...sorry Toyota but I'm sure Subaru did some major work themselves on this car...

Thanks for your response.

[Snowblind]

Originally Posted by shiro

That sucks man. Bonus side is that your dealership is replacing it. I flashed mine so no more warranty, which I really don't want to know how much a new ECU is lmao.

The ECU itself is around $800. Not something you'd want to have to replace.