Organic clutch?

[DAMotorsports]

Ill throw this out there is there a differance between the stock Exedy clutch and a stage one? I have not looked into it. But I know that there is a sc owner that is running the stock clutch and won't change. We (AVO at 5psi) currently are at 189 tq and the stock clutch is not having any problems.

So which clutch do you pick, we'll in the 7 years of racing i have had and ran several different clutches. No one clutch felt the same on a differant car. You will always have a weak link you just need to pick where you want it. I can and have finished a race with out a clutch, but a broken axle or drive shaft makes for a long weekend. Just a way of looking at it.

In the frs I have driven an fx300 and an AVO clutch on a BRZ with an AVO kit. The AVO engagement was smooth felt close to stock and I really liked it. The fx300 was new in the car took some getting use to. Felt stiffer then stock both kits grabbed nicely. I spoke to the owner of the fx300 and he said the clutch felt better after break in. Just a bit of info hope it helps

[vgi]

Originally Posted by Mrc@ptuning

What i'm trying to say is that most of the tq holding capacity are calculated off the clutch torque numbers--don't know the method or measurment instrument use to come up with that number-i'm sure each mfg has their own way of calculating this. As far as the tq holding capacity at the wheel, from my understanding with talking to some of the mfg, it's a calculated #. ie, they did not build a clutch, through it on the car, run it on a chassis dyno and keep cranking up the power until the clutch slips and use that to publish the TQ at the wheel capacity.

The fact that the exedy stage 1, in my personal car holds 300ft/tq at the wheel (dyno dynamics) without slipping and can break traction in first, second, chirp 3rd gear without slipping, tells me that the clutch can handle the 300ftp/tq. Now does that mean the clutch should be rated for 300ft/tq at the wheel by the mfg instead of the 200+ WTQ...probably not, it's better to be on the conservative side and not have to deal with warranty issues. Will the stage 1 hold 300wtq with constant abuse for 30K miles, maybe, maybe not. I can only say from personal experience on the clutch that is in my car.

If you are shopping for single-disc clutch for the fr-s/brz with mfg rating of 300TQ @ wheels that's going to be a hard find. If one exist, i doubt the pressure plate spring and disc is going to be "soft" enough to use on the street, instead it will be more of an on/off switch--not something you want to get stuck in traffic with

The ideal way to shop for a clutch is from feedback from those that has the exact clutch you are interested in, or better yet be able to drive the car with that clutch setup and make up your own opinion on which clutch to use. Like i mentioned, if there was a single-disc clutch out there for the frs that's "published" to hold 300+ ft/tq @ wheel with stock-like pedal feel and does not chatter and easy to daily drive on the street, it would be on my car already. For now, the exedy stage 1 works for me.

MrC

so how many miles have you put on this clutch so far?

[diss7]

Originally Posted by DAMotorsports

Ill throw this out there is there a differance between the stock Exedy clutch and a stage one? I have not looked into it. But I know that there is a sc owner that is running the stock clutch and won't change. We (AVO at 5psi) currently are at 189 tq and the stock clutch is not having any problems.

So which clutch do you pick, we'll in the 7 years of racing i have had and ran several different clutches. No one clutch felt the same on a differant car. You will always have a weak link you just need to pick where you want it. I can and have finished a race with out a clutch, but a broken axle or drive shaft makes for a long weekend. Just a way of looking at it.

In the frs I have driven an fx300 and an AVO clutch on a BRZ with an AVO kit. The AVO engagement was smooth felt close to stock and I really liked it. The fx300 was new in the car took some getting use to. Felt stiffer then stock both kits grabbed nicely. I spoke to the owner of the fx300 and he said the clutch felt better after break in. Just a bit of info hope it helps

It is different. We just changed mine yesterday and there were slight differences. Also the part numbers were different.

Exedy have a stock replacement, stage 1, stage 2, and the twin plate. That's what is available from exedy Nz anyway.

I'll try and get around to putting pics up tomorrow.

The clutches were almost exactly the same weight as well. There was about 40g in it. I can't remember which way, but again I took pics of that as well.

[Mrc@ptuning]

Originally Posted by vgi

so how many miles have you put on this clutch so far?

Around 2500 miles. But keep in mind it has over 400 dyno pulls on it from dyno tuning with our turbo system.

MrC

[vgi]

Originally Posted by Mrc@ptuning

Around 2500 miles. But keep in mind it has over 400 dyno pulls on it from dyno tuning with our turbo system.

MrC

well, i think some people do 7k rpm pulls 1-3 gear from a stop light every time...

[Mrc@ptuning]

Originally Posted by vgi

well, i think some people do 7k rpm pulls 1-3 gear from a stop light every time...

You mean 8K rpm..

[ZionsWrath]

Originally Posted by Mrc@ptuning

Around 2500 miles. But keep in mind it has over 400 dyno pulls on it from dyno tuning with our turbo system.

MrC

Would you recommend a stage 1 for DD application? With stop go traffic daily.

I'm looking at it more like I want it to be easy to drive not "it's tolerable" type of solution, hopefully it exists.

If I can't get a few rides I'll probably just try to organic and make sure I have $ allocated if it fails.

[Mrc@ptuning]

Originally Posted by ZionsWrath

Would you recommend a stage 1 for DD application? With stop go traffic daily.

I'm looking at it more like I want it to be easy to drive not "it's tolerable" type of solution, hopefully it exists.

If I can't get a few rides I'll probably just try to organic and make sure I have $ allocated if it fails.

Absolutely. The stage 1 feels just like stock but with a slightly better pedal feel. It's exactly what you want to use for DD.

Link to stage 1: http://www.ptuning.com/subdir/partno...=PTEXE-15805FW

FYI, the oem clutch will start to slip around ~260whp/220ft/tq (dyno dynamics) = ~290whp (dynojet) on the dyno.

MrC

[pmccut]

Originally Posted by Mrc@ptuning

We carry the Exedy Stage 1, Stage 2 as well as the Exedy Twin Disc setup, if someone needs a bit more grip

I don't believe any of the clutch manufacturers (Exedy, Clutchmasters, ACT, etc) that we carry or that manufacturers a single-disc clutch setup for the FR-S/BRZ, list their clutch holding capacticy at or over 300FT/TQ at the wheels. I believe the posted TQ holding capacity for these mfr are rated as "Clutch Torque" and not TQ at the wheels. But that's not to say that a "clutch torque" rating of 300, could not handle a car with 300ft/tq at the wheels.

MrC

Have you tried the stage 2 clutch yet? Or the twin disc?

My car is getting some power upgrades courtesy of @FullBlown and we're a little worried it's going to blow up on the dyno with some added boost. It was at 300wtq on a dynapack prior. I switched from the CM FX300 to the exedy stage 1 based on your posts...trying to get opinions now incase it happens

[Mrc@ptuning]

Originally Posted by pmccut

Have you tried the stage 2 clutch yet? Or the twin disc?

My car is getting some power upgrades courtesy of @FullBlown and we're a little worried it's going to blow up on the dyno with some added boost. It was at 300wtq on a dynapack prior. I switched from the CM FX300 to the exedy stage 1 based on your posts...trying to get opinions now incase it happens

We have not yet tested out the exedy stage 2 nor twin disc on our frs. I do have experience with both on an evo 9 but that's a different car. I don't think the exedy stage 1 will "blow up", if anything it will start to slip. If you're looking for a significantly higher tq capacity and don't mind a little clutch chatter when you disengage the clutch, you might want to jump straight to the twin disc. That setup will probably get you the least pedal pressure for the higher tq capacity vs stage 2.

What hp/tq are you shooting for, on e85 I presume.

MrC

[pmccut]

Originally Posted by Mrc@ptuning

We have not yet tested out the exedy stage 2 nor twin disc on our frs. I do have experience with both on an evo 9 but that's a different car. I don't think the exedy stage 1 will "blow up", if anything it will start to slip. If you're looking for a significantly higher tq capacity and don't mind a little clutch chatter when you disengage the clutch, you might want to jump straight to the twin disc. That setup will probably get you the least pedal pressure for the higher tq capacity vs stage 2.

What hp/tq are you shooting for, on e85 I presume.

MrC

I'm hoping for close to 400whp on 91, but I'm not sure how possible that is. They're lowering comp to 9:1 to help...maybe that's enough. E85 to follow...no clue!

If it starts slipping I'll either have to swallow the $2500 for the twin disc or pull back the power. I'm certainly not chasing a #. I want it be somewhat reliable (will see track time) and FUN.

I really appreciate your honest review of these clutches. The comments I've seen stating the FX series clutches are "just like OEM!" couldn't be farther from the truth from my experience.

[Mrc@ptuning]

400whp on 91 with low compression piston is definitely possible. 400whp on 91 or even 93 alone on stock compression is not going to happen

So sounds like you're going all out with a motor build and all

Sorry for getting off topic. Keep us updated on your progress with the power and clutch.

MrC

Originally Posted by pmccut

I'm hoping for close to 400whp on 91, but I'm not sure how possible that is. They're lowering comp to 9:1 to help...maybe that's enough. E85 to follow...no clue!

If it starts slipping I'll either have to swallow the $2500 for the twin disc or pull back the power. I'm certainly not chasing a #. I want it be somewhat reliable (will see track time) and FUN.

I really appreciate your honest review of these clutches. The comments I've seen stating the FX series clutches are "just like OEM!" couldn't be farther from the truth from my experience.

[gdrider77]

Originally Posted by Mrc@ptuning

Absolutely. The stage 1 feels just like stock but with a slightly better pedal feel. It's exactly what you want to use for DD.

Link to stage 1: http://www.ptuning.com/subdir/partno...=PTEXE-15805FW

FYI, the oem clutch will start to slip around ~260whp/220ft/tq (dyno dynamics) = ~290whp (dynojet) on the dyno.

So more insight from someone who doesnt sell them. I was looking for a new clutch and I actually reached out to @ptuning. They recommended the Exedy Stage 1.

My stock was slipping pretty bad as soon as I put on my avo kit 300whp/250tq.

I made it clear i needed a new clutch and was going to be around 300wtq and they said to get this clutch. "This is the clutch kit that we're using for our turbo FR-S. It's had no problems holding 400whp and 300wtq."

So I purchased from them the clutch based on their recommendation. It went in fine, and is indeed, very oem feeling. Mine does have the slightest chatter, but its barely noticeable. It seemed fine and felt great.

I just worked on my new tune....im at 350hp and about 320tq. So we will see how it does. I have a feeling its not going to hold up all that well, as it has already slipped once on me. To be fair, they did say 300wtq, and i am a bit over that.

So my advice, go with a bit overkill and dont push right to the limit of your power. If you are planning 300whp, that will probably put you around 240-260tq. which this clutch felt great with. Very OEM. You think you will push it more, or add-on in the future, just upgrade the clutch now, and be done with it.

If you are doing a supercharger, then i am sure this will work also, as that will probably be even less torque.

I will keep this updated as i drive it more and see how it performs/lasts.