Innovate (Sprintex) Supercharger Owners Topic

[NickFRS]

Why take photos of the intake when i can just take a video... here you guys go. Iphone 4 is crappy

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v...68183430&saved

but here is a photo

[evo4g63]

Originally Posted by tech4pdx

PRE says on my car, they were seeing 9psi. I thought that too was odd.

Stock map sensor?

[tech4pdx]

Yes.. but my understanding is that they drilled a hole on the map sensor plate to take a reading for tuning purposes. I can get more details on this..

[Anaxilus]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

No offense but there is a lot of wrong info in this post.

A lightened flywheel is the same as lightening your rims, pulleys or crankshaft etc. More torque will get to the tires because there is less rotational mass and thus the dyno will read higher trq.

The intake pipe does not contribute to slop or lag. Do you understand how fast this air is moving? Really really fast. It doesn't take a second to go from airbox to intake port... it takes fractions of a sec. Furthermore the device compressing air is mere inches away from the intake ports unlike in a turbocharged application. You will not be able to feel this "lag".

Any low end bogging is purely in the tune.

Actually we are both right upon further reflection, my bad. You most definitely loose torque when you lighten the flywheel but gain power. Greater mass acting on the same point of the same outer diameter increases leverage thus torque. The flywheel itself looses torque which is why lighter flywheels need to be reved higher to prevent bogging. However, you are right that a lighter flywheel reduces parasitic loss thus the engine can produce more torque. Sorry for confusing the two.

As for airflow, as someone who has ported heads and spent time on a flow bench you are completely wrong in your analysis about airflow. There is a very real correlation to length, diameter and port velocity, volume, CFM. I believe myself and every auto manufacturer would agree that it certainly does make a difference in response/lag. Btw, really really fast is not an objective value. Here is a video to help you out from GM:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RiHy4xWzDOc"]Cadillac's Twin Turbo Cuts Turbo Lag - YouTube[/ame]

[MattF]

Originally Posted by evo4g63

Stock map sensor?

I have an aftermarket boost guage and I am seeing 10 at redline. I think the stock map sensor is only read to 5psi.

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by NickFRS

Why take photos of the intake when i can just take a video... here you guys go. Iphone 4 is crappy

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v...68183430&saved

but here is a photo

[IMG ]https://sphotos-a-pao.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/618_534928999893615_67545327_n.jpg[/IMG]

Why take a video if you're not going to rev it?

[xjohnx]

Originally Posted by MattF

I have an aftermarket boost guage and I am seeing 10 at redline. I think the stock map sensor is only read to 5psi.

One tuner (maybe @FA20Club.com ) said that it the stock map sensor should be able to read higher than 5PSI, however the stock tables aren't scaled for it.

[DriftEm]

Originally Posted by Anaxilus

Actually we are both right upon further reflection, my bad. You most definitely loose torque when you lighten the flywheel but gain power. Greater mass acting on the same point of the same outer diameter increases leverage thus torque. The flywheel itself looses torque which is why lighter flywheels need to be reved higher to prevent bogging. However, you are right that a lighter flywheel reduces parasitic loss thus the engine can produce more torque. Sorry for confusing the two.

As for airflow, as someone who has ported heads and spent time on a flow bench you are completely wrong in your analysis about airflow. There is a very real correlation to length, diameter and port velocity, volume, CFM. I believe myself and every auto manufacturer would agree that it certainly does make a difference in response/lag. Btw, really really fast is not an objective value. Here is a video to help you out from GM:

Please watch the video again, they are talking about the shorter air path from turbo to the throttle body, our supercharger is a different story since it's after throttle body and the compressed air gets pushed into the cylinders with almost no distance to travel except the length of the intake manifold.

[swift996]

FYI:
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxveOVxGtqM&feature=c4-overview&list=UUfZt9_HTVY7vTAzazj3LHCw"]Subaru BRZ Toyota 86 Supercharger kit with turbo. Testing Pullies Part 3 MRT Performance - YouTube[/ame]

[Anaxilus]

Originally Posted by DriftEm

Please watch the video again, they are talking about the shorter air path from turbo to the throttle body, our supercharger is a different story since it's after throttle body and the compressed air gets pushed into the cylinders with almost no distance to travel except the length of the intake manifold.

Air has to get to the throttle and compressor first. Same principle. Might even be more relevant because 'ours' is relying on vacuum to get there whereas the turbo is already compressing. Push is more efficient to pull. Newtonian mechanics. This is the original reason superchargers used hood scoops, not for Subi top mount intercoolers. They used Ram air to force air directly into the blower. Same reason NA V8s did this as well when increasing performance over under hood induction.

There is a reason the FA20 had such short and direct air path to the throttle stock. Airflow doesn't look at all pathways the same and it's not like instant magic. If you ever get to spend time on a flow bench you'll see what the smallest most minute change can do to airflow under regular atmospheric pressure even with the shortest path from runner to valve. Take some numbers off a cylinder head and then add an intake manifold and compare the results, you'll see what I mean.

FYI, I'm not targeting this product, I want it to work properly so I can buy one.

[xjohnx]

Originally Posted by Anaxilus

FYI, I'm not targeting this product, I want it to work properly so I can buy one.

I've yet to see any evidence that it isn't working properly.

[DriftEm]

Originally Posted by Anaxilus

Air has to get to the throttle and compressor first. Same principle. Might even be more relevant because 'ours' is relying on vacuum to get there whereas the turbo is already compressing. Push is more efficient to pull. Newtonian mechanics. This is the original reason superchargers used hood scoops, not for Subi top mount intercoolers. They used Ram air to force air directly into the blower. Same reason NA V8s did this as well when increasing performance over under hood induction.

There is a reason the FA20 had such short and direct air path to the throttle stock. Airflow doesn't look at all pathways the same and it's not like instant magic. If you ever get to spend time on a flow bench you'll see what the smallest most minute change can do to airflow under regular atmospheric pressure even with the shortest path from runner to valve. Take some numbers off a cylinder head and then add an intake manifold and compare the results, you'll see what I mean.

FYI, I'm not targeting this product, I want it to work properly so I can buy one.

If shorter path from air box to turbo helps with the lag, why is the other turbo on passenger side in this video has the longer air path from air box than the driver side turbo?

[Anaxilus]

Originally Posted by xjohnx

I've yet to see any evidence that it isn't working properly.

Hmm, not quite what we were getting at. Poor choice of words if that's how you took it. The point was some people provided conflicting impressions of instantaneous throttle response.

Originally Posted by DriftEm

If shorter path from air box to turbo helps with the lag, why is the other turbo on passenger side in this video has the longer air path from air box than the driver side turbo?

All the way down the rabbit hole huh?

[DriftEm]

Originally Posted by Anaxilus

All the way down the rabbit hole huh?

LOL, it's just funny that the video you are providing to prove your "theory" is doing the opposite. Oh well, we agree to disagree :happy0180: