Innovate/Spritex/Bullet... What I found searching the web.

[buditjoenawan]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

Remember the 260 was on E85 which helps a bit.

I understand e85 helps, but this is waaaaay beyond the scope of published specs. 300hp at the engine at 1 bar is the published spec. So at less than half the boost pressure, you are making as much as the max at 1 bar? Does e85 compensate 100%? And all this is non intercooled! I'm sorry that I am skeptical, but the numbers do not add up in a major way. I would love to be proven wrong, and I will even put away my flame suit if it turns out I'm completely off-base. But so far, this is not passing the basic sniff test.

budi

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by buditjoenawan

I understand e85 helps, but this is waaaaay beyond the scope of published specs. 300hp at the engine at 1 bar is the published spec. So at less than half the boost pressure, you are making as much as the max at 1 bar? Does e85 compensate 100%? And all this is non intercooled! I'm sorry that I am skeptical, but the numbers do not add up in a major way. I would love to be proven wrong, and I will even put away my flame suit if it turns out I'm completely off-base. But so far, this is not passing the basic sniff test.

budi

put on your flame suit.

I think you forget what E85 did on the vortech kit... 245 whp on pump -------> to 365 whp E85 no knock.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by buditjoenawan

I understand e85 helps, but this is waaaaay beyond the scope of published specs. 300hp at the engine at 1 bar is the published spec. So at less than half the boost pressure, you are making as much as the max at 1 bar? Does e85 compensate 100%? And all this is non intercooled! I'm sorry that I am skeptical, but the numbers do not add up in a major way. I would love to be proven wrong, and I will even put away my flame suit if it turns out I'm completely off-base. But so far, this is not passing the basic sniff test.

budi

I have no dog in this fight. I'm skeptical too (not because I think there is something being covered, but because I am always skeptical until I see independent review). I can't wait till this kit makes it hand to a customer (third party) and he dynos it with consistent before and after dynos to see the gains. Its all good.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

put on your flame suit.

I think you forget what E85 did on the vortech kit... 245 whp on pump -------> to 365 whp E85 no knock.

That's not completely true. It was done at a different PSI, so the difference was not ONLY E85 it was more variables.

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

That's not completely true. It was done at a different PSI, so the difference was not ONLY E85 it was more variables.

My point is E85 allows for a ton more timing and more boost.

I am surprised no one has produced an E85 dyno on the base vortech kit. With the timing advance you can run with E85 I'd speculate a bump up from 245 to 280-290 ish whp.

[buditjoenawan]

Naw sw20kosh, I am an adult capable of taking criticisms. I would love a realistic discussion. And if I'm wrong, I will freely admit it. But your respond neither moves the discussion along, nor really refutes any of my assertions.

budi

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

My point is E85 allows for a ton more timing and more boost.

Yes.... I believe a good amount of people know that here already. That does not change the fact Robi is at 7 psi, and there is a ceiling to how much timing you can run, its not endless.

[industrial]

Originally Posted by buditjoenawan

I understand e85 helps, but this is waaaaay beyond the scope of published specs. 300hp at the engine at 1 bar is the published spec. So at less than half the boost pressure, you are making as much as the max at 1 bar? Does e85 compensate 100%? And all this is non intercooled! I'm sorry that I am skeptical, but the numbers do not add up in a major way. I would love to be proven wrong, and I will even put away my flame suit if it turns out I'm completely off-base. But so far, this is not passing the basic sniff test.

budi

Perhaps the "published specs" are taking into account a small, low compression, 92 octane, normally injected engine. I think the thing you are forgetting is our 12.5:1 CR, direct injection effects and the effects e85 has on knock.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by industrial

Perhaps the "published specs" are taking into account a small, low compression engine. I think the thing you are forgetting is our 12.5:1 CR, direct injection effects and the effects e85 has on knock.

This is true too. There are so much variables to consider.

Whenever the kit is released we will all see what the fuss is about

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by buditjoenawan

Naw sw20kosh, I am an adult capable of taking criticisms. I would love a realistic discussion. And if I'm wrong, I will freely admit it. But your respond neither moves the discussion along, nor really refutes any of my assertions.

budi

I was using your words buddy (or budi). You brought up the flame suit...

Sorry you didn't find it comical...

Anyways, as someone who saw the car in question get dyno'd, I am gently telling you that your "assertions" are incorrect.

[buditjoenawan]

Originally Posted by industrial

Perhaps the "published specs" are taking into account a small, low compression, 92 octane, normally injected engine. I think the thing you are forgetting is our 12.5:1 CR, direct injection effects and the effects e85 has on knock.

No, the published specs are for the supercharger unit. It can *ONLY* supply a certain amount of air flow. Anything over that is magical. Like Unicorns magical.

budi

[buditjoenawan]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

Yes.... I believe a good amount of people know that here already. That does not change the fact Robi is at 7 psi, and there is a ceiling to how much timing you can run, its not endless.

sw20kosh, so your assertion is that e85 alone can make up for the more than 100% volumetric efficiency gap that the supercharger isn't providing? Since at 260whp, it's just about max of what the supercharger is rated for at 14.7psi. I can't make the math work....

budi

[buditjoenawan]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

I was using your words buddy (or budi). You brought up the flame suit...

Sorry you didn't find it comical...

Anyways, as someone who saw the car in question get dyno'd, I am gently telling you that your "assertions" are incorrect.

Budi is my real name. I have nothing really to hide. I'm not saying that anything is incorrect. But, BUT, if the supercharger unit is the same 300hp@1bar unit that I linked to, it's amazing that the car makes that much power with that little boost.

budi

[industrial]

Originally Posted by buditjoenawan

No, the published specs are for the supercharger unit. It can *ONLY* supply a certain amount of air flow. Anything over that is magical. Like Unicorns magical.

budi

How do you measure the HP just the supercharger makes? All cars will make the same power with the same PSI from this supercharger?

Are you kidding me?