Decades of Toyota history

[cassidy0998]

So here is your Subaru.


This is something I can't get out of my head. I know that the companies worked together to build this car. But they have put so much emphasis on Toyota's cars throughout the years that the BRZ seems to be a byproduct.

I'm not trying to be rude or offend any of the BRZ fans. But to me the BRZ will always just be an 86 with a different badge, and never the other way around.


Does anybody else look at it like that?

[JDLM]

Will always be an 86 with different badges...so you want to discredit Subaru's efforts or are you looking for a break down of which co. did what with the car?

I don't recall Toyota giving up factory space/machines/time to assemble or produce the cars.

I can see where both companies put in time/resources and where they offered input into the car just because Toyota is going after this whole marketing "history" campaign to make sells.


Funny they just had an article about Toyota and the basis was "they need other companies to be a success again" or they would have done this car on their own and not going looking to BMW for Diesel technology, or going to Telsa etc...

[DaveyG]

Really? Who made the motor? You know the heart of any car.

[Sip]

Funny, I find it quite the opposite. I keep looking at the car and thinking 'what exactly did Toyota contribute here?' The DI and the sheet metal, it would seem.

The car is mostly Subaru to me.

I own an MR2 and a Celica, and while Toyota did get help from Yamamha on the heads, at least Toyota built those fucking things.

[JDLM]

I can see why Subaru would have said no at 1st it doesn't fit the lineup they have

[Scottyscooter]

The mission statement for this car was to build a balanced sports car that put driving back into the hands of the driver because modern sports cars have become too powerful with their turbocharged engines, had too much grip from their wide sticky tires, and had fancy AWD setups that made the cars drive themselves around corners. We have all heard these words from the project engineers and lets face it, the car that Toyota wanted to build was the exact opposite of the kind of cars that Subaru builds.

Yeah, most of the parts bin is Subaru but Subaru never would build a car like the FRS/BRZ in a million years. Subaru fans can claim that this car is a Subaru with a Toyota/Scion badge on it, but the indisputable fact is that this is a sports car that Toyota hired Subaru to build, and Toyota is really the reason that this car exists.

[JDLM]

But it wouldn't exist without input/time from Subaru it is a joint deal no matter what and I am glad they both agreed on doing it

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by JDLM

But it wouldn't exist without input/time from Subaru it is a joint deal no matter what and I am glad they both agreed on doing it

This. With out both parties this car would not be around. They both played an important part in getting the car built, however Subaru was given the project of doing most of the engineering as well as building the darn thing. Sure Toyota had their say but they primarily focused on the styling and the D4S.

[cassidy0998]

You guys have made some valid points. But even as BRZ fans you have conflicting opinions on what this car is truly about. The fact that Toyota has marketed this car as being the revival of the fun rwd Toyota sports car makes me believe that it was designed to be just that. They are saying that it is a single car designed around the AE86, Celica, Supra, 2000GT, etc. Sure it has a Subaru boxer engine in it. But Toyota is saying that it is also based on the old 800.

I'm just saying that we hear alllllllllllll about the Toyota history of this car. It's the fusion of decades of Toyota sports cars all rolled into one ball. YET, there is a Subaru version.

If you owned a BRZ, would you not say to someone who was unfamiliar with the car "Well, you know the the old AE86? Yeah it's pretty a new one of those."

Again, not trying to offend anyone. I'm still not settled on the FR-S or BRZ yet, but these are the thoughts going through my head at the moment while trying to decide.

[JDLM]

I am glad that you are buying into marketing...since it does appear that Toyota is doing all of it thus far.

Subaru has had RWD cars in the US before...have to dig but they built their rep on AWD and are good at it and this being a RWD car they will have to get their marketing and advertising dept. in order.

[madfast]

Originally Posted by Scottyscooter

Yeah, most of the parts bin is Subaru but Subaru never would build a car like the FRS/BRZ in a million years. Subaru fans can claim that this car is a Subaru with a Toyota/Scion badge on it, but the indisputable fact is that this is a sports car that Toyota hired Subaru to build, and Toyota is really the reason that this car exists.

i believe i read somewhere that even though subaru developed the car, the development GOALS were set by toyota. lets examine one very simple bit of info: the rear suspension tuning. the prevailing idea at this time is that subaru tuned the rear for more stability, or understeer. toyota? they have an oversteer friendly drift machine. im sorry, but this car screams toyota to me. subaru may have done the dirty work, but toyota told them what to do to make it special...

[JDLM]

Originally Posted by madfast

i believe i read somewhere that even though subaru developed the car, the development GOALS were set by toyota. lets examine one very simple bit of info: the rear suspension tuning. the prevailing idea at this time is that subaru tuned the rear for more stability, or understeer. toyota? they have an oversteer friendly drift machine. im sorry, but this car screams toyota to me. subaru may have done the dirty work, but toyota told them what to do to make it special...

View it how you want but the idea is simple:


There is 1 car

3 Variants


2 Companies are going to make it "their own"

[cassidy0998]

Originally Posted by lfawishes

This is so silly, it'd be nice of you to post facts. The only claim is that toyota has used a flat motor once;in the 800. Guess what, wasn't even brought to the US. You need to research specific facts, not just statements. The 2000gt is a really ridiculous comparison as there were roughly 60 cars brought to the US, and they cost the price of 2 corvettes+ new at the time. If the 2000gt and 800 were inspiration the car would be 10 inches shorter and have totally different styling.

You have a great deal to learn if you feel as though that the 2000GT and 800 weren't inspiration for this car.

And who cares if they did or did not bring the cars into the U.S. - Now you're talking about Corvettes??

sigh...


I like what JDLM said about the car.

1 car, 3 variants.

[chulooz]

They are all marketing ploys! Sure it shares similar ideologies to the AE86, but the 2000gt and 800 are cars that they have been mentioning only very recently, marketing purposes of course.