Scion FT-86 FR-S

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Who ever said that there are no scion guys that care about performance?

Un bunch your panties dude, nobody is attacking you personally.

After you take the tampon out first, as my comment was not a defensive statement. You took that out of context, as I didn't feel like I was being attacked when I made it. It was just a category statement to sum up the following links I was about to post.

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

After you take the tampon out first, as my comment was not a defensive statement. You took that out of context, as I didn't feel like I was being attacked when I made it. It was just a category statement to sum up the following links I was about to post.

Why would you want me to take out your tampon? That's just nasty

Originally Posted by oneday

You are absolutely right. An A4 could be raced in stock trim. Have you ever raced or driven an A4 saloon (non-S/RS trim) of any recent generation? If so, then you are aware that an A4 in stock trim is an overweight, underpowered, pig of a car that doesn't like to turn, correct? You know, I think I said the exact same thing about my tC earlier in this very thread.

Is there a version of the tC that is made that is comparable to S/RS trim?

Originally Posted by oneday

I disagree. You don't need to be in a premier series to have a racing heritage, nor do I think street cred and heritage are mutually exclusive marketing concepts. If Scion can help grassroots racers get into competitive cars (whether it's tC or an FT-86) and win races and championships, then that will be their heritage.

A racing heritage is not cemented in history with one successful season in one series, but it does have to start somewhere. Most young marquees will not throw tens of millions of dollars at premier series to build a following (look at Hyundai and their backing out of F1 [who could blame them?] before they even got in).

They are not mutually exclusive marketing concepts, but that is the key there isn't it? Marketing. Not engineering.

And obviously, racing heritage doesn't come from one successful season, rather things like 50+ years of motorsports in every category you could think of, and I dunno, say 27 years of rallying with 6 generations of a model and 6 world championships to go with it?

No one is asking scion to throw tens of millions at racing in a premier series. Rather just take some of the millions used on douche marketing, and "all show no go" and use it to go racing instead (relevant, racing of course).

There are rife opportunities, X-Games rally, IRC, GrandAm GT class ... well no, it'd just be slaughtered there wouldn't it.. but you get my point.

Instead the pay 0-60 to dress up an xD in Castrol-Toyota Rally livery with nigh a performance modification

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Why would you want me to take out your tampon? That's just nasty

Oh I forgot my bad, I just remembered now that you wear Maxi Pads....

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

No one is asking scion to throw tens of millions at racing in a premier series. Rather just take some of the millions used on douche marketing, and "all show no go" and use it to go racing instead (relevant, racing of course).

There are rife opportunities, X-Games rally, IRC, GrandAm GT class ... well no, it'd just be slaughtered there wouldn't it.. but you get my point.

Instead the pay 0-60 to dress up an xD in Castrol-Toyota Rally livery with nigh a performance modification

They do both. Endurance racing, Road Racing, Time Attack, and Drift. And then there are people who don't care about racing, and do shows, which they put money into creating a show atmosphere for those type of people too. Not seeing your argument there when they do both.

[Matador]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

They do both. Endurance racing, Road Racing, Time Attack, and Drift. And then there are people who don't care about racing, and do shows, which they put money into creating a show atmosphere for those type of people too. Not seeing your argument there when they do both.

Why do I even bother...

****walks out muttering about the fucking clueless retards in here, wishing he could slap whoever started the scion rumors and brought them out of the woodwork****

[oneday]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Is there a version of the tC that is made that is comparable to S/RS trim?

That is the reason I said excluded the S/RS from the pool. The standard A4 is as I described. The S4 is nice and manages it's bloatiness with more power and better brakes. The RS4 is other-worldly--and has the price tag to go with it.

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

They are not mutually exclusive marketing concepts, but that is the key there isn't it? Marketing. Not engineering.

Racing is not just engineering though, it is also marketing. Since the beginning of auto racing manufacturers use their victories to sell cars, which in turn funds the engineering and racing. If you engineer the greatest car of all time (can't believe I am going here, but it is actually relevant), like Newey's X1 project for GT5. Phenomenal engineering, but the X1 will likely never be built and there is even less chance of it being raced. Why? Because they could never make enough money marketing it to make the engineering profitable.

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

And obviously, racing heritage doesn't come from one successful season, rather things like 50+ years of motorsports in every category you could think of, and I dunno, say 27 years of rallying with 6 generations of a model and 6 world championships to go with it?

I agree to an extent. If Scion keeps upping their racing/motorsports involvement, in 50 years if Scion (or Toyota, for that matter) is still around they will have a chance at having heritage you deem worthy. But if they listen to the naysayers and stay off the race tracks they will never have the chance to have a heritage. Know what I mean?

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

No one is asking scion to throw tens of millions at racing in a premier series. Rather just take some of the millions used on douche marketing, and "all show no go" and use it to go racing instead (relevant, racing of course).

There are rife opportunities, X-Games rally, IRC, GrandAm GT class ... well no, it'd just be slaughtered there wouldn't it.. but you get my point.

I had just posted a story and link of a Scion accomplishing something in a legitimate racing series, in a legitimate race car (more similar to a stock car than the much lauded RallyCross STI is to its stock counterpart). Does that not count for something? You've got admit that it is at least a start.

If it is not on your short list of opportunities then it's not worth doing? Touring car? Conti Challenge? SCCA Pro? Club Racing? Are those not real, legitimate endeavors?

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by oneday

Yes, SCCA bought the SWC series at the end of the 09 season. Most, if not all of the rules carried over.

Interesting thing about this then... I read an article about the history of the Mazda Protege5 that was entered into this a while back (I think it was in a Grassroots Motorsports mag, but I would have to double-check...). The team chose the MP5 instead of the Miata, not because it was better but because the rules allowed them more concessions for running a less competitive car. They figured that the amount of extra stuff they were allowed would more than compensate for the worse platform. Plus there were accusations of the team sandbagging during the first race. Then they did really well after that, even with the ballast for high finishes, until the officials figured out what was going on and took back a lot of the advantages that they were originally given. (I think they had originally been allowed significant headwork mods, that are normally off limits.)

The point here is that although the cars are dissimilar in this racing, that doesn't mean that a lot of effort isn't made to create parity. Usually with ballast. If the Scion tC doesn't start competitively with the basic allowed mods, they will likely lower the minimum weight until it is.

In this racing (like most) it is preparation, testing, organization and driver skill that makes the most difference. The officials make a tremendous effort to balance the cars' performance. So it doesn't mean, for example, that a Protege5 is 'equal' to an RSX-S.

As for the troll thing, I got your back

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by MatadorRacing_F1

Why do I even bother...

****walks out muttering about the fucking clueless retards in here, wishing he could slap whoever started the scion rumors and brought them out of the woodwork****

Rumors? Rumors being what? When you provide Evidence about something it's no longer a Rumor. After being on this forum long enough, I've seen enough post from you to know how antagonistic you are. When challenged though, I see you just snub your nose and run and hide murmuring talking under your breathe like some kid just stole your candy.

Originally Posted by oneday

I had just posted a story and link of a Scion accomplishing something in a legitimate racing series, in a legitimate race car (more similar to a stock car than the much lauded RallyCross STI is to its stock counterpart). Does that not count for something? You've got admit that it is at least a start.

If it is not on your short list of opportunities then it's not worth doing? Touring car? Conti Challenge? SCCA Pro? Club Racing? Are those not real, legitimate endeavors?

Not to mention, Dan Gardner/Jackson Dawson Race team didn't just have ONE successful season as the un-informed keep trying to imply. They are REPEAT champs.

Repeat Championships in Edurance racing (Dan Garder/Jackson Dawson)
Repeat Championships in Time Attack (World Racing and PTuning)
Repeat Podium Finishes in Drifting (Yes I know, least closest to the factory tC, but it still factors into getting the Scion name in Motorsports).


Among a group of most Influential Scions in Motorsports you have

-World Racing's FWD and AWD Time attack machines (yes tubed frame, but still runs the same power plant as the rest of the tC's and thus still get's recognized for being a Scion and has been repeat champion and track record holder for fastest FWD at every track it has touched, which is like 10 across the states)

- PTuning's TA tC (because it's 100% all Scion, just built with repeat Championships)

- DG/Jackson Dawson (because they are 100% Scion's with repeat championships)

- Ken Gushi's Drift tC (recently in my eyes because he now runs the factory motor. If you want to comment about it being RWD, the RWD components on his tC are the original components from the Toyota Avensis, so they just re-installed the parts that were missing for the rear, thus keeping it grounded and not some far out custom job)



Cars that are the least Influential that are in Motorsports

- Rockstar Drift Scion tC (the only similarity between it an a tC is the body. There is nothing else left on that car that is a Scion tC, that's why it does not make the list. V8 swapped, Tube frame, Supra Rear end...etc). It is the LEAST Scion of all the most well know Scions with a recognition in Motorsports.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

Rumors? Rumors being what? When you provide Evidence about something it's no longer a Rumor. After being on this forum long enough, I've seen enough post from you to know how antagonistic you are. When challenged though, I see you just snub your nose and run and hide murmuring talking under your breathe like some kid just stole your candy.

I think he's frustrated by you glossing over what a lot of people write. How can I say, not getting the point?

The rumour he is talking about, is the rumour of this car even becoming a Scion.

Pure unconfirmed rumour.

Edit: And you forgot all the factory-backed 'Scion' drag teams. 2JZ and 3RZ powered for the most part. No 2AZ in the Titan car.

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by Dimman

I think he's frustrated by you glossing over what a lot of people write. How can I say, not getting the point?

The rumour he is talking about, is the rumour of this car even becoming a Scion.

Pure unconfirmed rumour.

Edit: And you forgot all the factory-backed 'Scion' drag teams. 2JZ and 3RZ powered for the most part. No 2AZ in the Titan car.

I'm not glossing over post. I have already spoken up in that I can care less if it's a Scion or a Toyota. If it comes out with a performance level that meets it's price, and the styling to go with it, I'll be buying one. Badge don't mean nothing to me.

If badge meant more to me, I wouldn't have been considering buying a Gen Coupe. But I don't feel the price of it meets it's performance, so I didn't want it anymore. Especially with the FT-86 expecting production.

I didn't bother to list the Factory backed drag cars, cause I figured that was common sense that they belonged in the "Non-influential" category.

[nate89]

Since when did this thread go from being a "FT-86 POSSIBLY a scion" to a scion is the best shiz-niz,bees-knees, my junk's bigger than yours" thread?

Scions are not the greatest thing since sliced bread. They are entry level car targeted at "young" people wanting to buy a nice looking first car. Sure you can slap rims, exhaust, and whatnot on a scion and it will: look better/be louder/...STILL BE A SCION....

I think we know the general consciences is on this forum about peoples opinion of scion (except for few), so lets see what the rest of the world thinks about them... oh wait, scions are only US cause no one else wants em lol.

[70NYD]

A4 is a luxury cruiser.. not a track carm not straight from factory.. STRIP THE FUCK OUT OF IT and yes you can have some fun on a track with it..
cannot beleive you compared it to a cayman.. shows what you really think of a tC (by your analogy: A4 is to Cayman as tC is to mx5)

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by nate89

Since when did this thread go from being a "FT-86 POSSIBLY a scion" to a scion is the best shiz-niz,bees-knees, my junk's bigger than yours" thread?

Scions are not the greatest thing since sliced bread. They are entry level car targeted at "young" people wanting to buy a nice looking first car. Sure you can slap rims, exhaust, and whatnot on a scion and it will: look better/be louder/...STILL BE A SCION....

I think we know the general consciences is on this forum about peoples opinion of scion (except for few), so lets see what the rest of the world thinks about them... oh wait, scions are only US cause no one else wants em lol.

You sound no smarter than the people who yell...

STILL A HONDA
STILL BE AN IMPORT

If the FT-86 comes out under Toyota you will get
STILL A TOYOTA
REMEMBER THE BRAKES ON THE LEFT
DON'T GET YOUR ACCELERATOR STUCK


Congrats on being THAT type of person. The general consensus don't even know what they are talking about when it comes to a tC or Scion at all, bad example there bud.

[Calais]

Originally Posted by Dragonitti

You sound no smarter than the people who yell...

STILL A HONDA
STILL BE AN IMPORT

If the FT-86 comes out under Toyota you will get
STILL A TOYOTA
REMEMBER THE BRAKES ON THE LEFT
DON'T GET YOUR ACCELERATOR STUCK


Congrats on being THAT type of person. The general consensus don't even know what they are talking about when it comes to a tC or Scion at all, bad example there bud.

still better than

YOUR IN A SCION hahahahaahahhahahaahaha

[Dragonitti]

Originally Posted by Calais

still better than

YOUR IN A SCION hahahahaahahhahahaahaha

When the other guy is staring at my tail lights as I pull away....It won't matter what I'm driving cause I'm the won winning.

I love being underestimated though. That's why I won't debadge my tC, nor will I debage the FT if it comes out as a Scion. So there is no mistake that you just got your butt handed to you by a Scion.

When I walked on the Evo with my "Scion" who looks bad....Him or Me? How about the STI, or 240sx dudes who swapped in SR and RB20's only to lose to a Scion....go home retune and turn the boost up, and Lose again without me even changing anything....Yeah cause I should SOOO be ashamed to own a car that I love to Drive.