Scion FRS (with unichip) vs Fully Bolted Mazdaspeed 3

[Vlady]

Good to hear that you are enjoying your ride just as much as I am hmong337. Glad you had a good laugh Fast Freddy.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by vangisback

I didn't know that boost pressure = torque steer. Well, you learn something new everyday. LOL

OP and all supporting racerbois, please refer to the "Don't be a ricer" thread.

Higher boost pressure usually means more horsepower. More horsepower leads to more torque steer.

Ergo, more boost = more torque steer.

[6speed_Sam]

I love this story. My bro has a '12 MS3 with full bolt ons(larger turbo coming after Christmas) making 300whp. I pull ahead through most of 2nd gear. After that I have no chance. I've driven his car and you can obliterate the tires by just rolling into 2nd gear. After that it pulls your head back.

I can't seem to talk him into racing me at the auto-x track, though lol.

[vangisback]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

Higher boost pressure usually means more horsepower. More horsepower leads to more torque steer.

Ergo, more boost = more torque steer.

So without knowing ANYTHING else about a particular car's setup, higher boost pressure = more torque steer ???? That's what I was getting at. Unfortunately, my sarcasm didn't bleed through well.

In case some of you "enthusiasts" didn't know, there are well-performing FWD setups out in the wild, it's not as simple as RWD>>>>FWD.

[bcj]

Oh, come on...

We're just hyperbowling for babby hayzeus.

Here, have a smilie

[Mikem53]

Originally Posted by Vlady

Knew I would get a comment like this so I was prepared. He is an impressive driver. As others have mentioned the FWD is a huge issue. Adding massive power to any FWD car will have resort in some negative outcomes. The torque steer is not an issue in his case since he has all motor mounts covered, it is the wheel spin.

Tq steer is more than motor mounts.. It's more about equal length half shafts and such..

[nathanR]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

I think your friend needs to learn how to drive...

Speaking as an owner of two MS3's ('10 and '12) and an FRS, I agree. I have a hard time wrapping my head around how the 3 loses to an FRS in a straight line. Even with the mentioned mods.

The MS3's ecu also does a pretty good job of throttling power in order to avoid (mostly) the insane wheel slip, while still allowing a 14.0 +- quarter mile time.

Unless, his boltons included a leaf blower and a BBQ grill. Then I guess I'd have to reconsider.

[Bad Habits]

Originally Posted by vangisback

So without knowing ANYTHING else about a particular car's setup, higher boost pressure = more torque steer ???? That's what I was getting at. Unfortunately, my sarcasm didn't bleed through well.

In case some of you "enthusiasts" didn't know, there are well-performing FWD setups out in the wild, it's not as simple as RWD>>>>FWD.

Ok torque steer/wheel spin/general loss of forward progress - wtf ever you want to call it.

And yes I have seen a few FWD cars running high boost numbers that have had hundred of hours of setup work and tuning done to make them hook reliably. Maybe this guy has this amount of time into his MS3. Still, running that must boost and this guy is out racing an almost stock FRS. Cool story.

To the OP, get this on video. I know having owned a 2008 MS3 and a 2002 MSP I would love to see how his car reacts to that amount of boost.

[Lytheum]

I traded a 2008 ms3 with bolt ons and tune for the brz. I think I could have started the speed in 2nd gear and still beat the twins.

[wlfpck]

Full bolton MS3s are nothing to joke around with. If the driver can maintain traction from a dig... those things are quick.

[w00t692]

full bolt-on ms3 can run very close to a 12 second 1/4 mile. E85 will put them at a 12 second 1/4 mile. I've seen enough ms3's on street tires cut 1.9 60 fts to know that your buddy can't drive.

[thill]

It is the driver. I have driven lots of Speed3's and it takes a lot of patience not to spin the front tires off the line. I bet your buddy would be faster starting out in 2nd.

I had the same issue with the Focus ST I drove recently. Once I let up on the throttle at launch and found the sweet spot to control wheelspin the ST was much quicker.

This is the problem with high horsepower/TQ front wheel drive cars. They give up a lot off the line usually but they can also make it up pretty quickly.

[JS + BRZ]

Originally Posted by w00t692

full bolt-on ms3 can run very close to a 12 second 1/4 mile. E85 will put them at a 12 second 1/4 mile. I've seen enough ms3's on street tires cut 1.9 60 fts to know that your buddy can't drive.

This.

OP, as a former tuned MS3 owner, your FRS has NO CHANCE of beating a full bolt on-ed MS3 in a drag race. A full bolt on + Cobb AP tune is a seriously fast car.

Don't get me wrong. I traded in my MS3 for a BRZ couple weeks ago, and I don't miss the straightline power at all. It's just SO MUCH MORE FUN to drive a BRZ than MS3 on a daily basis.

And as for the wheel spin/wheel hop issue, there's a lot of solutions to this for drag racing. 1) driver mod 2) tune to keep the torque tamed for the 1st gear

And if your friend's car is running 22psi on the stock turbo, he's doing it wrong. Just turning up the boost is NOT the way to tune the car.

[Liehtw8]

I currently own a full bolt on 08 ms3 as my daily. The ms3 is a quick car. Especially when you get to third gear. The ms3 is electronically boost limited in 1st and 2nd gear so maybe with a poor start you had a chance? But once full boost hits forget it. That being said the twins are still a better car. The ms3 is however a very practical fun daily driver.

Sent from my SGH-I337M using Tapatalk