Limited Slip Blog review

[Demandred7]

I haven't seen this review posted, so, I thought I would share:

http://limitedslipblog.com/2013/09/13/2013-scion-frs/

And this post seems to be connected to the review:

http://limitedslipblog.com/2013/09/1...s-progression/

[Ramster]

Good review. Reminds me of the video by Chris Harris where he compares the GT86, Cayman, and 370z. He raised many of the same points.

[mav1178]

This is a realistically attainable car that starts you down the path of the enthusiast. And as a starter car with that intent, it can’t be beat.

This pretty much sums up what the vast majority of complaints are on the forums about our cars.

It's a first-gen, all-new sports coupe that is a starter car (i.e. influx of young people with no car experience), and it's not a "true enthusiast car" as evidenced by some of the quality issues and subpar specs in some areas (tires, brakes for track use, etc).

-alex

[Braces]

Originally Posted by mav1178

This pretty much sums up what the vast majority of complaints are on the forums about our cars.

It's a first-gen, all-new sports coupe that is a starter car (i.e. influx of young people with no car experience), and it's not a "true enthusiast car" as evidenced by some of the quality issues and subpar specs in some areas (tires, brakes for track use, etc).

-alex

Totally agree.

[torqdork]

I wouldn't agree that the twins are solely starter cars. There are many here who have owned semi- and full exotics, higher powered, some lighter, most heavier, almost all more expensive, but have come full circle to appreciate what makes a good GT car great.

I can't count the current and former Corvette, 'Stang, BMW, Lexus, Porsche, NSX, Lotus and other owners who prefer their twin over any of the others.

It's something like what boat owners experience going up and then down the waterline length after realizing that bigger isn't necessarily better.

Otherwise, good review, thanks for posting.

[Demandred7]

Originally Posted by mav1178

This pretty much sums up what the vast majority of complaints are on the forums about our cars.

It's a first-gen, all-new sports coupe that is a starter car (i.e. influx of young people with no car experience), and it's not a "true enthusiast car" as evidenced by some of the quality issues and subpar specs in some areas (tires, brakes for track use, etc).

-alex

Just to be devil's advocate, why can't it be both a starter car and an enthusiast's car?

An enthusiast's starter car if you will. At least that is what I took away from reading both articles.

Obviously, there are a lot of places in our cars that leaves something to be desired and improved upon, but, our cars have a lot of the core elements that imho make for a lot of attainable fun.

[Demandred7]

Originally Posted by torqdork

I wouldn't agree that the twins are solely starter cars. There are many here who have owned semi- and full exotics, higher powered, some lighter, most heavier, almost all more expensive, but have come full circle to appreciate what makes a good GT car great.

I can't count the current and former Corvette, 'Stang, BMW, Lexus, Porsche, NSX, Lotus and other owners who prefer their twin over any of the others.

It's something like what boat owners experience going up and then down the waterline length after realizing that bigger isn't necessarily better.

Otherwise, good review, thanks for posting.

So, a back to basics approach perhaps? Going back to one's roots of what they like most about driving.

[Braces]

As the article mentioned .... most drivers can explore the limits of the car somewhat safely (i.e. low speeds). The car allows novice drivers an idea of what a neutral slide feels like and how you can control the car. This is all accomplished at relatively slow speeds. Yes ... a starter car. The problem is that over time .... most enthusiast drivers will want MORE. MORE power, MORE grip, MORE speed. This is only natural. There is obviously a ceiling regarding too much of anything. Start with the FRS. Then either mod the FRS or move up to the Cayman S.

[mav1178]

Originally Posted by Demandred7

Just to be devil's advocate, why can't it be both a starter car and an enthusiast's car?

It can be, that's what the aftermarket is for.

As-is, to qualify the car as an outright sports car is absurd, given the low power output and the need to upgrade the car for it to see extended driving (tires, brakes, and oil are three standout areas).

I just see all the problems on the forums about these cars having problems, when in reality I think it's a matter of product positioning and market reaction to said positioning.

-alex

[DarkSunrise]

According to that definition, there'd be no outright sports cars on the market. Every car needs to have some parts upgraded for extended track use, whether it's tires, brakes, oil cooler, suspension, etc.

You're conflating sports car with race car.

[torqdork]

Originally Posted by Demandred7

So, a back to basics approach perhaps? Going back to one's roots of what they like most about driving.

It's the light weight chassis dynamics that got me on the first test drive. I've owned lighter cars including a Lotus 7 and MR Spyder (and am currently hunting for an Exige S), but none had the combination able to give such a satisfying all-weather driving experience. Plus the Limited/10 Series owners have pretty posh surroundings for a budget GT, beyond what I'd call basic but yes, it's the purity of the 86 driving experience that I haven't felt in any other contemporary car, including Cayman S.

[Don Ivey]

Originally Posted by mav1178

It can be, that's what the aftermarket is for.

As-is, to qualify the car as an outright sports car is absurd, given the low power output and the need to upgrade the car for it to see extended driving (tires, brakes, and oil are three standout areas).

I just see all the problems on the forums about these cars having problems, when in reality I think it's a matter of product positioning and market reaction to said positioning.

-alex

I notice you drive a Camry. So, WTF are you talking about?

[Adam Anthony]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

According to that definition, there'd be no outright sports cars on the market. Every car needs to have some parts upgraded for extended track use, whether it's tires, brakes, oil cooler, suspension, etc.

You're conflating sports car with race car.

100% agree. Plus, if you want a Porche, and can afford it, get one. Don't complain that this car isn't the quality of cars that costs at least $20K more for the same driving dynamics.

The majority of the complaints I have ever seen about the FR-S/BR-Z are specifically about "Why doesn't it have $10-$20K more stuff on it? That's ridiculous! It shouldn't have these parts it should have the more expensive parts!" which goes against the purpose of this vehicle.

[Hanni_0176]

I've read so much content on the net about this car, and the primary gripe that I've seen is lack of power. I find it rather amusing. So many people care about stock hp/tq numbers... but, the type of people that are concerned with hp/tq... don't they plan on modding their cars anyway?

I think the twins are a fantastic platform to mod from. 200 hp/151 tq isn't bad at all coming out of an N/A 2.0L engine IMO. Regardless, the low weight/CoG and good balance is something you can't easily mod/change. I'd rather have a great Chassis and great looking car, than a boxy car that looks ugly but has more stock hp/tq.

There are also cars out there that come specifically detuned from the factory, like the 2003/2004 Ford Cobra (Termi). I know that is a more radical example, but still... I don't understand why so many people are focusing on the stock numbers rather than the mod potential.

From all that I've read about our cars so far, it seems like engine in the twins has alot of modding potential.

Did anyone purchase an FRS/BRZ without the intent of modding, and expected it to be fast?

I guess I don't understand what all of the complaints are about... This car was designed to appeal to the "tuner" market, was it not?

EDIT: Also, I didn't purchase this car strictly to buy a "sports" car. I bought this car because it was basically an upgraded version of the 7th Gen Celica... great gas mileage for a DD, while looking great and offering a fun driving experience. Although... now that I have the car, I do eventually plan on turning this into a track car while still maintaining it as a DD (most likely by utilizing an Open Flash or something where I can toggle between ECU maps).