coilcover choice, "will bilstein b14 be the last one"

[jxtgy3]

in the last years, i tried several shocks and found nothing that fit. So wish u could shed some light on this one.
past year's experience
1 stx coilcover & v3
the kw's doesnt repond rapidly. it tend to melt the shock and work a little lasier than stock. And there're two things I cant bear, first, there's directional deficiency. Second, kw&st tent to be understeer. In corners, the back wheels just bite the ground which make me very annoying cause it losts too many drifting joy.
2 hks sp & gt
stiff ones. quick repond and firm support. oversteer.
i love sp but there're too many speed bumps in my workplace and the feeling of back wheel crashing into them is a real suffer.
gt is comfort enough in the city and is very easy to drift. But on the highway, it feels floating on the road and passes too many unnecessary little bumps. the floating and bumping makes the driver have very little comfort.
3 tein
i hate teins cause it makes the road fuzzy, much worse than the kws. As to mono, it also act weird.
my wish
1 firm in corners
2 oversteer
3 moderate comfort
4 dont want to ajust the camber

my choice
i love hks sp but the back is too firm on speed bumps.
The hks gt is softer but on highway it's too bumpy.
Bilstein offers b14 and b16 for frs in china. Compared with hkss, it uses progressivce spring instead of straight ones. So i suppose it would be firm on high ways and it adopts monotube so it might respond quickly.

So my question is will the b14 meet my requirements? if not, are there other options? great thanks for any ideas

[JIM THEO]

What about Ohlins DFV with 6/6K springs?

[jxtgy2]

Originally Posted by JIM THEO

What about Ohlins DFV with 6/6K springs?

dfv users tried hks gt and said dfv was even harder. So it may not fit

[churchx]

Also imho 6/6 might be too much for "new" Ohlins without revalving (which will further up price).

[JIM THEO]

Originally Posted by churchx

Also imho 6/6 might be too much for "new" Ohlins without revalving (which will further up price).

According to what others writte here directly from Ohlins old MI20 and new MP20/21 have exact same valving!

[churchx]

JIM THEO: depending on source you hear. I also recall from "as reliable" sources that valving is different on MP20/21. Whom to believe? As result i don't consider Ohlins at all. 5/5K imho might be closer to sometimes mentioned as reasonable +/-30% spring rate that should be handled. BTW, i'm sure Ohlins coilovers WILL work also with outside range, car will be driveable .. but there is one but in my mind - they are premium product priced above average low cost crap. So i would expect them to be valved just right/on spot to match springs for that premium cost, not that "maybe they should work with those too".
P.S.
I also don't think that Ohlins will do for OP, as IIRC "new" might be tuned more to comfort and even more to understeer vs old kit. So contradicting with OP's (2.).

[JIM THEO]

What I am sure is that Ohlins dampers from 0 to 20 clicks have remarkable difference compared with other coilovers so "optimal" may be relative, you just loose some settings but if you play in the middle area of adjustments there is no problem even with 6-7K springs!
I'll ask them directly as I sale some of their products and let you know.

[churchx]

They have already answered to somewhat similar questions.
For example this:

The stock valving is good for a 35% increase in spring rate before we recommend a revalve. You might be able to just swap the springs and get away with it, but at some point the car is going to bounce down the road due to too high of a spring rate. You will also loose some adjustability range without a revalve as well.

But to me it looks, if they themselves suggest 5/5K rates for track, and obviously 5K in rear looks outside 35% range, after which they recommend revalving, also if i'll need to pay extra for another spring set, it simply is not something i'd expect if i'd be paying premium. After all, there are several alternatives out there, that don't require such working around choices of changes in updated kit. They are free to release with whatever design choices they want .. but imho it was wrong to discontinue old kit, which very probably may have been more popular then MP20/MP21. If it still had been available that is.

[JIM THEO]

Originally Posted by churchx

They have already answered to somewhat similar questions.
For example this:

But to me it looks, if they themselves suggest 5/5K rates for track, and obviously 5K in rear looks outside 35% range, after which they recommend revalving, also if i'll need to pay extra for another spring set, it simply is not something i'd expect if i'd be paying premium. After all, there are several alternatives out there, that don't require such working around choices of changes in updated kit. They are free to release with whatever design choices they want .. but imho it was wrong to discontinue old kit, which very probably may have been more popular then MP20/MP21. If it still had been available that is.

You could be right but do they mean 35% range based on 5-5K springs they suggest as optimal fitment?
They don't specify track or road use, just "recommended spring 5K" and if you see mounting istructions are based on 200mm spring that is the 5K spring not 4K or 3K that are both 230mm!
I read here - I think from RCE - that from 0 to 20 clicks the difference is 300% so it is more than enough for 6K springs.

[jxtgy2]

lol
are there any uses who had experience in both bilsteins and hks to make a contrast?

[churchx]

JIM THEO: my guess is that it's regarding stock rates of MP20/MP21, 4K/3K. +35% that would be 5.4/4K. So i guess, for optimal performance and for whole adjustability range to be usable, by their own words, for usage with 5/5 or 6/6 springs, dampers should be revalved. Yes, set probably by sacrificing some adjustability range or some other slight caveats probably will work with those, maybe with even stiffer springs (for example check this post, where guy uses 7/7.5K on MP20), but .. Ohlins kit already costs more then eg. some Tein kits from CSG or KW based kits from RCE. Why customer should enjoy having to go extra length to workaround limitations for this kit at such price (where i naively would expect for things "to just work" and "work better then in cheaper competitor offerings")?

[Shark_Bait88]

You might also see if you can get a set of SACHS Performance RS-1 coilovers. Very similar setup to the B14 (single adjustable, inverted monotube with progressive springs, and re-uses OEM top hats). I had a set on my car and they were quite good, especially for the sort of parameters you're looking for.

[jxtgy2]

Originally Posted by Shark_Bait88

You might also see if you can get a set of SACHS Performance RS-1 coilovers. Very similar setup to the B14 (single adjustable, inverted monotube with progressive springs, and re-uses OEM top hats). I had a set on my car and they were quite good, especially for the sort of parameters you're looking for.

it's a good idea but sachs rs-1 is not available in china, neither rce, brz sti shock....

[Shark_Bait88]

Originally Posted by jxtgy2

it's a good idea but sachs rs-1 is not available in china, neither rce, brz sti shock....

They are hard to locate through retail channels in most countries. If you're interested in them I'd try reaching out directly to ZF Motorsport.