Turbo planning
 

Like many others, I have decided that I would like my car to have a little more power, and have decided turbo is the route for me. I have searched all over the forum but did not easily find what I am looking for.


Many threads talk about horsepower goals and then there are discussions on which brand of what will work for their application. What I am looking, for as far as "turbo planning", is at what horsepower thresholds are modifications recommended. For example, what horsepower threshold would it be recommended to upgrade fuel injectors? 250whp? 300whp? what about fuel pump? oil cooler? clutch? etc.


If some of the experts and car gurus could weigh in on what upgrades are needed at what horsepower, it would help me (and I am sure others) decide on horsepower goals. I would be happy to summarize feedback as it comes in.


First post to the site, so go easy on me. If I have missed this thread, please point me to it.

Welcome to the forum! The stock fuel system can support up to 300whp. So no need for port injectors or fuel pump for that. This is also going to be your expected power level for most (not all) turbo kits, and some supercharger kits out of the box. Fuel also plays a roll as well. Because of the stock high compression, pump gas power is really going to be limited to around 330-350whp reliably. If you want to go higher than that, E85 would be recommended. Stock clutch typically will not support more than 300whp for long periods of time either. Oil cooler in my opinion is a must, even if it's a daily driver. If you plan to track the car, a radiator is not a bad idea either. Also look into catch cans as well. Hope that gives you a good start. PM me with any other questions you may have!

250whp, 200ft/lbs of torque - you don't need to do much.

270whp, 220+ ft/lbs of torque - your clutch needs to be replaced.

300-315whp, 240+ ft/lbs of torque - you are at the limits of power on pump gas. At and after this point onwards, you need to be looking at e85, and that's where the costs come in. Flex fuel kit, larger injectors, and larger pump.

Your fuel injectors and fuel pump do not need to be replaced if you are running on pump gas, because you'll run into a octane limit before you run into a fuel flow limit.

Oil coolers are dependent upon two factors, your local temperatures and the type of kit you are running.

270-300whp for clutch. What threshold for AT?

Not as clear an answer on the 6AT. Not for a bad reason, we simply haven't seen many 6AT's grenade.

We've built more than a few 300whp setups for customers with the 6AT, and they've been fine for the last year to 2 years. I'd say you are ok in that range, and budget out for tranny cooler if you are going to planning to track that.

as much as i do like the vendors above me in post

give @FullBlown a holler. LJ is truly a helpful individual and made provide excellent customer service.

I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the stock AT can handle up to ~275 torques or 350whp. Everyone's experience varies because it depends heavily on how much you abuse your clutch. You could run 800hp through the stock transmission if you babied it everywhere. :lol:

As for your initial question: a big consideration is how much you're willing to spend. Here's a rough guideline of what to expect for price to performance when including labor and all the necessary supporting mods:

250-280 whp - $5,000
300-325 whp - $8,000
450+ whp - $10,000

Pay to play lol. Of course, you can save some cash if you buy parts used or get a good deal on labor (or even do it yourself), but in my experience, this is what turbo builds typically end up costing.

So to summarize


* 300-350 whp is limit of pump gas
* No fuel system upgrades while staying on pump gas
* Oil cooler suggested regardless of horsepower goals
* Catch can / air oil separator suggested regardless of horsepower goals
* 270-300 whp limit of stock clutch
* 350 whp limit of AT


Anything else to consider?

A list of things like the above would be a great sticky for this forum "FI FAQ." I know we have the buyers guide but that seems to be more based around what can you get for $5,000 as opposed to what will support your power goals.

Obviously you would have to talk about taking the above values with a grain of salt but it would probably save a lot of questions and give people a good idea of where to start, especially people like me who don't have nearly as much experience and would like to have a place to start with the supporting mods they will need based on their power goals. It could even be broken down by ranges of whp goals. I'd do it but I know jack shit compared to most of the people on here.

200-220 whp
-Suggested item 1
-suggested item 2
-so on

220-250 whp
-you get the idea
-
-

Subbed!

I think the reason for the confusion is that it has been a learning process on what was and was not needed. Many tuners swore you needed fuel injectors and a pump to even reach 270whp for a while.

It's been a learning process for everybody. Ecutek has been continuously improved since the initial release, and that's changed what was needed as well.

So what truly is the acceptable limit for stock injectors? For example, I am gunning for 300whp on E85 with the JRSC with standard pulley. I've asked three separate Master Ecutek tuners now, and one has said "just injectors", the next said "injectors and pump" and the third said "stick with the stock injectors and get a fuel pump".

So which is it? I have full bolt ons already (if that makes a difference). But if I can safely get away with NOT buying injectors then I would of course love to go that route.


Thoughts?

At what point should someone consider upgrading internals? Would you be able to run a stock bottom end at 225-250 to the wheels? (I am guessing you would only be running around 5-7psi to achieve that.) Then above say 300whp start thinking about upgrading rods/pistons?

Not all turbos are equal. Some turbos are 250 at 7psi while others are 300 at 7psi. You gotta look at the turbo itself. Some turbos are just oil and others are water/oil.

Study your ass off and look at all your options for all your kits.