Originally Posted by momo3605 (Post 2135403)

Some threads claim that they can get 200whp on an ecutek tune with just headers. I haven't seen any numbers like that for an OFT. Are the ecutek tunes superior to the OFT tunes or are they essentially the same?

Originally Posted by momo3605 (Post 2135403)

Some threads claim that they can get 200whp on an ecutek tune with just headers. I haven't seen any numbers like that for an OFT. Are the ecutek tunes superior to the OFT tunes or are they essentially the same?

Originally Posted by Malt (Post 2135443)

Furthermore, I don't understand the fascination with peak HP numbers. As an example take a mythical car that makes 200HP at 7000rpm as its peak number but makes like 100hp almost everywhere else in the rpm range. Now compare that to a car that makes 190hp over the entire rpm range. Which would you like to drive?

Originally Posted by Malt (Post 2135443)

If you are referring to that post by delicious tuning that steve linked, I see a dyno chart of a 86 making 174 whp and then they apply pseudomath to arrive at that "200" number by attempting to relate mustange dyno numbers to dynojet numbers.

Not knocking Delicious Tuning as I think they do amazing stuff but the important thing to remember here is that dyno numbers can vary wildly from car to car and dyno to dyno depending on many variables such as weather conditions and how the dyno was setup.

Furthermore, I don't understand the fascination with peak HP numbers. As an example take a mythical car that makes 200HP at 7000rpm as its peak number but makes like 100hp almost everywhere else in the rpm range. Now compare that to a car that makes 190hp over the entire rpm range. Which would you like to drive?

People need to stop and really look at dyno charts and see whats going on instead of blindly focusing on a single data point or you run the risk of missing out on extremely interesting possibilities like the ESC setup.

Originally Posted by Malt (Post 2135443)

If you are referring to that post by delicious tuning that steve linked, I see a dyno chart of a 86 making 174 whp and then they apply pseudomath to arrive at that "200" number by attempting to relate mustange dyno numbers to dynojet numbers.

Not knocking Delicious Tuning as I think they do amazing stuff but the important thing to remember here is that dyno numbers can vary wildly from car to car and dyno to dyno depending on many variables such as weather conditions and how the dyno was setup.

Furthermore, I don't understand the fascination with peak HP numbers. As an example take a mythical car that makes 200HP at 7000rpm as its peak number but makes like 100hp almost everywhere else in the rpm range. Now compare that to a car that makes 190hp over the entire rpm range. Which would you like to drive?

People need to stop and really look at dyno charts and see whats going on instead of blindly focusing on a single data point or you run the risk of missing out on extremely interesting possibilities like the ESC setup.

Originally Posted by Koa (Post 2135752)

Well said. I often think that how we measure a car's power is flawed.. Area under the curve, as you eloquently put it, is MUCH more important than peak.

How can we quantify this area under the curve on a Cartesian plane? Using integration/calculating the integral would be one easy approach. Would love to see this kind of perspective prevail over the currently "peak hp/tq" metrics

Originally Posted by momo3605 (Post 2135403)

Some threads claim that they can get 200whp on an ecutek tune with just headers. I haven't seen any numbers like that for an OFT. Are the ecutek tunes superior to the OFT tunes or are they essentially the same?

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash (Post 2135811)

We only use Dynojets for custom tunes. Other tunes use other dyne's and then apply a very optimistic "correction" to bring their numbers to "Dynojet-like" numbers. Unfortunately (or fortunately for them), this is not accurate or even logically sound.

The truth is that any flash tuning solution will results in equal power gains all things equal. Any tuner suggesting that their Kung Fu is stronger than anyone's else's Kung Fu needs to be taken down a couple notches.

Originally Posted by Koa (Post 2135815)

Shiv what do you think about the current automotive power metrics of peak whp/tq, and our proposed metric of finding the 'area under the curve' via integrals and calculus?

Would this be feasible? What are you thoughts on how people measure and discern the power of a combustion system?

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash (Post 2135833)

I think that is the best way to quantify power/power gains. In fact, we employed the same calculation back in the late 90s when compared power curve (area under the curve) in Sport Compact Car magazine's Ultimate Street Car Shootout :)

Originally Posted by Koa (Post 2135842)

Would following the integration process arrive us at similar results as you guys? How'd yall do it? ;)

http://www.wyzant.com/resources/less...nding_the_area

Originally Posted by Shiv@Openflash (Post 2135884)

We used Excel :) By exporting the raw torque and RPM data from the dynojet run file, we created a spreadsheet that took rectangular "slices" of the torque curve and calculated area. Then we added up the areas of all the slices to get a reasonably accurate total area.