Traction Control vs. Stabilization Control vs. Sport Question
 

After crawling and searching for threads that clearly explain the pros and cons of these three settings that can be toggled on and off, even in combination with each other, I have yet to get a clear pro/con list for each. I would only like the pro con list here to be for the manual version of the car, as that is what I have. So here are the 3 things I need clarity on.

What are the pros and cons of having VSC Sport mode on or off?

Pros and cons of having Traction Control on or off?

And then, finally, when I hold the Traction Control button down, I get what I think is Traction Control off and Stabilization off (the SPORT does not light up in this mode). What is the pros and cons of this (hold it down) mode?

Please mention if any of these settings increase acceleration speed on a manual car going in a straight line. Thanks.

As you can see from the video. Pressing VSC sport allows a bit more slip angle over normal.

If you press the traction control button briefly -- TRAC OFF appears.
It's mainly for getting out of snow / mud, where you don't want the traction control to interfere. Traction control turns back on after you exceed 31mph.

If you press and hold the traction control button, then majority of the systems are off (outside of doing the pedal dance).

None of these settings affect throttle response on MT as far as I'm aware.

didn't you read your owner's manual?

step 1: start your FRS
step 2: hold down both buttons for 15 seconds
step 3: drive

Exactly what dhuang said.

With all off you can get off the line much quicker due to getting closer to the edge of traction.

Personally I've automated the "press and hold the traction control button" procedure so I'm always in this both off mode whenever I drive.

What does that do? I tried it and the trac and stability light only came on.

Is this true for manual? And if all off makes it MUCH quicker off the line, does SPORT mode make it half quicker?

Agree, this is how I normally drive my FR-S. I don't hold down both buttons thought, just hold the traction control button until both lights illuminate on the instrument panel. In my opinion, it is worthless to shut off one or the other, just get rid of them both. If I could, I would install an instant pedal dance button to shut of EVERYTHING (see below).

Holding the traction control button until both lights illuminate on the instrument panel shuts off almost all nannies. Some stability control still remains, but I don't think it will intervene in straight-line acceleration. Without the nannies, the traction control unit should not use the rear brakes to prevent wheel spin. The car comes with a limited slip differential, so this will mechanically activate to adjust power to the rear wheels if necessary. Is this faster off the line? I don't know, as straight-line acceleration is not my goal so I haven's tested it.

To shut off all of the annoying nannies for track use, warm up the car and then do the pedal dance. Without the pedal dance, the rear brakes still intervene in some corners – the car is much faster and more predictable (and more fun!) on the track without the nannies if you know what you are doing:

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...ht=Pedal+dance

You could also try the pedal dance for straight-line acceleration. It may or may not improve things. I do have a manual transmission and did do the pedal dance at an autocross once. I was able to get a good wheel spinning launch off the line in this mode.

This... any other way and you're a loser.

I thought wheel spin is the last thing you want in a launch, that it slows you down immeasurably? I thought less throttle with no wheel spin beats wheel spin launch...am I wrong?

I found that I was able to achieve much smoother driving during AutoX with Sport Mode ON but with TC ON. When I turned it off, I couldn't rely on the brake vectoring any more to steer me through corners, instead would peel out through many of them, slide, or even spin if I gave it too much throttle. In sport mode you can hammer the throttle and the TC will slow you down some, brake on the inside wheels for you. Though it feels much more natural to drive with the TC off, especially when starting in 1st (allows for that extra bit of slip), I prefer having TC on when doing tricky cornering, the brake vectoring helps a lot.

10% wheel slip delivers the best acceleration

But its slowing you down. You can't drive the car at the limit which is the only way to go fast.

You don't want traction control on if you are trying to launch...unless you want it to cut power on you.

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFuApgwCVrg"]2014 Scion FR-S 0-60 MPH Acceleration Test Video - 6-Speed Manual Transmission - YouTube[/ame]


I always drive with traction/stability control 'off'... the systems are nothing but a hindrance and handicap to the chassis for me, and the absolute last thing I want the car to do is unnecessarily cut power on me and brake when I need to turn quickly and accelerate. And anything less than 'off' is absolutely horrible on track. I forgot to turn the system off once and when on track I quickly hit the button to put it in VSC Sport mode because I didn't feel like going back into the hot pits... that session SUCKED! ABS and EBD going crazy and engine cutting power in tight quick turns...YUCK!

With stock tires and suspension, I don't think you will have many times that the system will engage the brakes due to rear tire lift.

VSC On => Pros: More slip angle before the system kicks in
Quicker lap times in general
Slightly bigger grin when driving hard over normal mode

Cons: Harder on tires and gas(Caused by larger grin :) )
Mistakes will cost more time due to the system having to reel it in more
Chances of losing control are higher

Traction Control => Pros: Better launches
Unless not enough revs, it won't bog down
In inclement weather, can help keep momentum

Cons: Harder on tires
Maybe not as consistent
Too much spin in snow and your getting the shovel
It deactivates itself after you hit a certain speed

Full off => Pros: Clarkson level smile
Drifting
Best lap times
Fun in the comfort of the speed limits
Did I mention HUGE SMILE on your face when pushing the car?

Cons: Very hard on tires and gas
If you have no skills, could end up in a wall or wraped around a pole
Mistakes can be VERY costly in time and possibly money(See above)
Sudden lost of traction due to weather can cause lost of control



I did an autocross with the button push and had a blast. There is also and on ramp that I like to slow down to 20-30 km/h in 2nd and just kick the rear out. Very easy in dry, but be very careful in wet. I spun out once trying it :). I also tried in vsc mode and it really kicks in hard if you're over aggressive. On the track, it's probably much more gradual.

Depending how much experience you have, be very careful in off mode. Everyone has different skill levels, and I don't know you or anyone else on this forum nor have I seen anyone drive. Find an autocross race or an empty parking lot that would be ok with you having fun. You don't want to be having fun then having the cops show up and handing you a ticket. Do it in a safe environment. The on-ramp I have fun has great visibility, no signs, curbs or walls that can be hit, tight enough that not a lot of speed is carried and shallow ditch, so the risk is very low to cause damage to my car. I also do not do it when I see cars ahead or behind me.

I think of it more as graduating towards both a higher level of skill, fun, and less of a safety net.

Traction control off lets you get unstuck from mud or snow. On cuts throttle to prevent wheel spin and any chirping of tires and makes everyone think you are civilized.

VSC Sport on allows a little more slip angle, but, will reign you in when it thinks that you've lost control (which can be counterproductive if you know what you are doing because it cuts in just a little too early). This mode is semi-civilized and allows for some misbehaving.

Off is not actually completely off (for that you need the pedal dance or pull the ABS fuse). Nevertheless, as far as most people need, it is good enough. Once you realize that VSC Sport mode is interfering too much, then you have graduated to the fun level. Toss the car into a corner with full on opposite lock drifting. Word of caution is to not let your ego get bigger than your skill level. Wade into it unless you are in a safe environment. It can be risky thinking that you need to run before you can walk. Not that I am the Stig, but, unless it is absolutely horrible weather, part of starting my car is turning off all of the nannies. This mode is for the uncivilized lunatic, but, if you are, you already don't care.

As others have mentioned, a little bit of wheel spin achieves the best accelerations, but again, part of learning and graduating is not too much wheel spin.

Simple yes or no question:
Is there a difference between holding both buttons for 15 seconds and pressing only TRC for few seconds until TRC and VSC go off?

Super simplified version from track experience;

Everything on: won't let you rotate the car, will cut power immediately when it senses wheel slip, particularly bad trying to exit a turn under power
VSC Sport: car will rotate a small amount, but will still cut power very early, you can go faster but still too intrusive under power
All off: does not cut power at all which means you can rotate the car freely and put down power slides as you see fit. Used responsibly you can put down lots of power out of turns and/or drift (and/or spin)

See above for difference in cornering, but for launches i've found trac off button is sufficient, it will let you spin the wheels on launch. However, if you get torque steer and need to correct, the car may cut power because stability control kicks in if the angle gets too big

and you only need to hold it for around 3 seconds to get full off

Rather be a loser with a car than an idiot with a crashed one.

There was another thread someone had some pretty convincing info that the throttle map was changed in sport mode. I can't really tell the difference

If you don't know how to drive a RWD, that'll happen regardless.

It's not about the car or your skill, it's about the idiots around you, and unknown road conditions. I'm probably more experienced than most of the posters around here, and I leave it on for normal driving. What most people don't get is that when you are in a situation where you're consciously fooling around, you're alert and focused on driving, and likely you have both hands on the wheel. When you're cruising down the highway or around town, even if you're not distracted, your level of focus isn't the same as when you're driving with the intent of pushing any kind of limit. When someone swerves in your path or slams on the brakes, chances are your reaction will be to jerk the wheel to avoid a collision. Recovering from a skid in that situation is different from recovering when you know it might happen (aka driving spiritedly). Pride or overconfidence getting in the way of logic is a sign of lack of experience.

So, it's not about your ability to drive, but what kind of situations you'll be faced with on day-to-day driving.

link please?

This.

Ironically, the idiot that swerves into your path could be the same person with all his assists disabled failing horribly at driving "because racecar".

Everybody is different, I've driven 9 years without any sort of traction control and haven't had an accident where I hadn't deliberately put myself in the situation (purposely drifting my open diff 530i) Granted, I have mostly driven RWD cars all my life, ranging from 200hp (FR-S) all the way to 414hp (M3) so I my reactions have adapted to RWD setups.

While that is great, it's easy enough to disengage traction control when you purposely want to fool around. It makes no sense to go an extra step to disable a safety feature every time you get in the car unless it gets in the way of your driving, which for daily cruising, I doubt it does.

It's habit, has always been habit, and will remain a habit ever since I had my mustang which had the worst, most intrusive TC ever, and the FR-S doesn't fall short on that department. TC constantly intervenes going up hill to my house when it rains and I can't have that when I'm accelerating from an almost stand still after going over a speed bump.

Well, I guess that I can relate to. I used to drive on an uphill road with speedbumps getting to my house as well when I was in Trujillo Alto, lol.