how to tell if car was previously tuned for E85??
 

I bought a BRZ from an insurance auction a few weeks ago. Pretty excited about it. It did come with a few mods already - Tein coilovers, TRD exhaust, header, RPF1s...

A couple times when starting it in cooler weather it took a couple times cranking and sputtering before it would run, which made me wonder if the old owner had it tuned for and was running E85. It was a theft recovery and purchased from an auction - I have no idea who the previous owner was or how to find them. I've only driven it around the block a couple times at this point. Seems to run great when started and pulls harder than I remember my old FR-S but it's been a little while, so it could be wishful thinking.

Is there an easy way to tell if it was tuned for E85?

I have a VAGII tool for my wife's Audi, which also reads generic OBDII codes but not sure what else it could do on non-Audi.

I imagine you would need either a tactrix, ecutek or oft to read the ecu programming.

Or the Toyota computer, can't remember the name of it.

You have a header, so if it were me, I'd find a tuner to look at it.

If you live near the southern border of OH-IO, by WV and KY, I may be able to help you out.

Thanks guys.

I'm in Columbus but once it's road-ready I'd be willing to drive that way. Thanks man.

No problem. PM me if you need to set up a meeting. Maybe we can meet halfway. I've got another owner close by me that I've offered my EcuTek ProECU hardware and software if he decides he needs it.

Always willing to help.

If it has a header good chance it has a tune of some sort. E85 has a different smell to gasoline. Start it up and see how it smells? Otherwise some other indicators would be a flex fuel sensor in the engine bay or with the car running pull the cruise control stick back (with cruise turned off) and watch to see if the tacho jumps to 1k, 2k, 3k or 4k rpm. That is really only if it is an ecutek tune, OFT will be harder to determine.

Plug in any obd tool and read the outputs ie AFR trims etc

And compare to what? If asking the question he probably doesn't know what stock should be so just reading what is there will be of no help at all.

I agree with the smell test. You can smell the exhaust or just smell the fuel filler hole. If it smells like a bar, it's E85.

Another vote for the smell test. On a cold start you can smell the unburnt fuel in the exhaust. With e85 it has a sweet aroma that’s easy to detect. I’d start it up in the morning and take a few whiffs of the exhaust.

There are also cheap ethanol content test kits available but you need to find a way to siphon some fuel out of the tank or fuel lines.

AFR will be higher for gas. 14.7ish vs E85's 8.7ish at idle (warmed up) depending on the tune.

Thanks for the tips everyone. Some good ideas. I’ll check everything when I get back to it - it’s in our warehouse at work and I’m home this week working on finishing/framing our basement.

Still need to know what the base was to know if it is higher or lower.

unfortunatly it wont. The 02 sensor reads risidual oxygen so it doent know the afr or if its ethanol or petrol, lambda is still 1. Yes lambda 1 is achieved by 14.7 afr for petrol and 8.7 or so afr ethanol but the 02 sensor just reads lambda 1 then this is converted to 14.7 as most tune software or obd tools as they are set to petrol afr like all the tables in most tune software. like romraider or ecutek the target afr is all dispalyed in petrol afr regardles if you running petrol or e85

When I made the original comment I was thinking the car had been refueled with petrol and running an e85 tune

Stopped at work and checked out the car today. Nothing in the fuel system looks aftermarket (no E85 sensor). No RPM blip when I pulled back the cruise stalk. However, it did smell sweet to me and a buddy when I started it. I’m sure it would be obvious to someone who actually knows the smell but I don’t.

Thinking of buying an ethanol test kit. Another option would be fueling it up with E85 and see how it runs.

It seems like it’s much safer to fuel up a regular tuned vehicle with E85 than it would be to fuel up an E85 tuned vehicle with regular - correct?

Find a local with a e85 test tube, or a friend that's maybe a GM / Ford Tech that may have access to a Ethanol Analyzer they can put in the fuel for you.

If the car has a e85 tune, and its cold, it may be hard to start.

If its a e85 tune and has 91 in the tank it will be very rich.

Get a fuel sample from your car. In a liquid measuring vessel pour in water (20%) near enough and mark the level now add fuel sample(80%). Shake it up let it settle.If the water amount has increased in volume it`s because it has absorbed ethanol from tour fuel. You Can`t go wrong. Even added a video.
https://youtu.be/GvO-mPADwC4

Thanks guys! Ordered a test kit and will update in a few days.

Don't even try to bother with siphoning the fuel from the tank via the filler tube, it won't work.

Your best bet is to remove the fuel pump fuse inside the engine bay fuse panel, start the vehicle and let it stall out, then disconnect the return line in the engine bay and use some 3/8 inch fuel hose purchased from an auto parts store to fit over the end of the return line and set the other end of that hose into a spare fuel tank. Reinstall your fuel pump fuse, then turn your key to the ON position without attempting to start the car and it will pump out about 3 oz. of fuel every time that you cycle the key on and off.

Have a fire extinguisher ready, keep any ignition sources away, and don't do it in a confined space.

You'll also need a fuel quick disconnect tool to release the connector before you can slip it off. Have some rags available as well to soak up any fuel spilled.

When you're done obtaining a sample, reconnect the return line and make sure to prime the fuel lines by cycling the key on and off a few times to get any air out of the lines.

Check for leaks.

[emoji106]

Thanks guys! Worked like a charm. As soon as I accessed the fuel I immediately smelled the alcohol. Ran it thru the test, and...

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...f86fa23ea6.jpg

80% ethanol. Thanks again for the help.

Your next steps is to monitor afr and fuel trims. If the car drives fine my guess it was tuned with ecutek or open flash tablet. If you fill with regular gas you stand a high chance of blowing the motor. If you do need more gas fill it with pure e85 till you figure out the tuning issue

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Sooooo, maybe he should take it to a tuner?

This was my main concern. I didn't want to put the wrong fuel in and risk damage. It did drive fine but I've only taken it around the block a couple times so far. It is slow to start after sitting a few days - sometimes taking a few cranks and sputtering before firing up. I've read that E85 tunes can be harder to start, specifically in colder weather but it's been in our warehouse that stays above 50 degrees. When I start it a day or two apart it usually fires right up.

That's the plan. I just needed to be able to fuel it up so I could drive it to the body shop, to the tuner, etc. A second/fun vehicle to keep has been a long time coming and I don't want to screw it up or blow the money I've saved buying a theft recovered vehicle.

Oh, btw, you said you pulled in the cruise stalk and nothing. Wanted to mention, with my ecutek, you have to hold it there for a few seconds before the tach reacts and points to current tune.

And that's ONLY if it were tuned with EcuTek, and ONLY if the tune was set up for multiple maps and ONLY if the map switching was assigned to the cruise control stalk. There are alternative map switching choices.

If there's no ethanol content sensor anywhere in the fuel lines, it's probably just a straight E-85 tune and not a flex-fuel tune. You should only fill with the fuel that is in the tank currently until you find out exactly what kind of tune you have, and you'll need to figure out what tuning program was used to flash the ECU to do that. Also, if the fuel station that you fill up at switches to a winter blend, which has less ethanol content than what's currently in your tank, you'll start running into rich AFR conditions.

The EcuTek ProECU software can tell you if there is an EcuTek license present, which will be the most obvious sign that it was tuned with that software suite. I'm not familiar with any of the other tuning suites but I'm pretty sure you would have to have that particular software to recognize that particular tune.

He needs a cable

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Well, of course......and a deskey dongle to get the EcuTek ProECU software suite to even run. By then he's about $350 Invested. He's relatively close to me so I've offered to let him use mine to find out if his tune was indeed EcuTek based.

Tried a longer cruise stalk pull and nothing.

I absolutely plan on taking you up on your offer once I get some other things sorted with the car - thanks again. A buddy of mine likes to take trips to Kentucky to buy bourbons that are hard to find in Ohio, so we’ll probably plan a day down south.

Right on. Let me know a few days ahead of time so I can plan accordingly. I do a lot of traveling in WV and KY for work but I set my own hours.

I was looking at the Carfax today and realized the car has only been driven about 500 miles in the past year.

Considering when the car was reported stolen and recovered, the gas is at least 8 months old. This may be why it sometimes sputters before firing up. From what I've read, Ethanol is "good" for 3 months. Luckily there's only a quarter tank in it.