Edelbrock supercharger potential
 

Ok, so here is the question.

I'm currently running an Edelbrock supercharger kit, (which I am extremely happy with) in the as supplied configuration.

I would like to know how much more power I can make with this kit on the stock engine. is there a bunch more power waiting for me, or should I leave it alone?

Are you looking for how much power the blower can make, or how much power the engine can hold?

Delicious made 420 whp on E85. It was a built engine, but it had the same compression ratio as stock.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112955

They recommend building the engine around 350 whp. People have made 5-600 on the OEM block, but I don't know how long that'll last.

Some people are running 350+ on the stock motor with no headaches, some aren't so lucky. You could pick up some power buy running ethanol and that should be relatively safe. Unfortunately, there is only one way to find out how much power YOUR motor can handle.

Answer: There's a bunch more power waiting for you, and you should probably leave it alone :D

You're in California, stick with the emissions legal setup you'll need in ~2 years when you get your first smog check. I don't know how available E85 is down South, up here it's more trouble than it's worth imo for a car that's daily driven.

I'd call up Delicious and see what they can get out of it with just a tune, iirc it's a noticeable step up, but keep it easy to revert back to CARB legal in an afternoon imo.

https://www.delicioustuning.com/node/483

Looking at this, 20hp from the tune, another 10+hp from downsizing the pulley, swap pulley back and reflash for smog, swap back for funsies. If you can put e85 in it you're up a total of 90hp from the regular CARB tune, but I don't know what it'll take to do it safely (injectors, flex fuel rig, heat management now that you're double stock power), how that'll fly during an emissions test, and I wouldn't push any more out of a stock block.

@whataboutbob is probably your best resource if you're still autocrossing it, seems nice enough, but I don't actually know the guy.

Yea, what I'm looking for is the reliable power limit on 91 octane, with the stock engine internals. I do need to keep smog in mind, so I would like to avoid doing anything that is too hard to undo once every 2 years or so.

Interesting to see that folks are getting 400 plus from this supercharger unit, though. right now i am trying to build a company, so not too many spare $$ laying around, but its nice to see that the blower will be ready to make some pretty big power as soon as I can afford to build an engine for it.

is Bob running an Edelbrock? did he get rid of the Sprintex?

Ah, I might be totally mistaken then, idk why :bonk:

But yeah, sounds like a slightly smaller pulley and tune is what you're looking for, nice ~30-ish bump over CARB trim according to them. Maybe I misread and the smaller pulley is no bueno on 91, idk.

Good luck, nice to see someone thinking modestly and not another 'yo I NEEEED 300 whp, how do I get it'

Bob runs an Ace A/350 header now. NA.

You might be giving me too much credit. 300 to the wheels does have a nice ring to it.

Correct. I do have the Delicious FF kit so E85 does make a noticeable difference in power, even NA.

I sold my Sprintex (Innovate) kit. I'm not totally sure what the next boost solution will be but I'm shooting for 400WHP on a mustang on E85.

I'd leave the boost level the same and just get a Delicious Flex Fuel kit if you want to make a bit more power safely.

How was the FF kit to install?

I assume pump and injectors?

Man I really want to pick up another engine to build a little bit.

Do you have any thoughts on compression ratio, if I'm looking to go "big" , power wise?

What do you call big and how much you want to spend????

One thing to watch with a twin screw blower is how the tune works down low if you start cranking up the boost. A turbo or centrifugal blower will build boost linearly and not try to load up the engine too much at lower rpm. A twin screw blower can be much trickier to tune down low and can blow an engine easier even if the peak hp is the same.

The kit is very easy to install. I'd contact Delicious Tuning directly and discuss. They can provide guidance on what is needed to support the FF kit at your desired power level.

How big? :)

:lol: Turbos being known for building boost linearly, great joke.

Although it makes sense to suggest that mid range torque from the twin screws should blow more engines, is that actually what has been demonstrated on our platform? Since I've been paying attention (not that long admittedly) I've seen no blown cosworth/harrop/edelbrock set ups and only a couple of sprintex ones (which are known to run hot).

I anecdotally hear of far more turbo and centrifugal SC set ups going bang than the twin screw.

Talk to any tuners that have tuned the bigger sprintex blower...

Have not heard of any JRSC casusing any catastofic engine failure. Correct me if I am wrong.

I have a buddy that had a JRSC C30 on a stock motor that shoved #3 rod all around making swiss cheese.

Welp then there is that.

I'm not sure one broken engine is really evidence of anything. if it becomes a trend, that is another matter...

i know folks that could break an anvil, so no matter how good you make your stuff, someone is going to figure out how to wreck it.

Seems like these power threads pop up all the time, and the conversation is the same. Ugh.

thats because folks don't like the answer

If you're willing to divulge, was that an off the shelf setup or one that was pushing more power?

Keeping a close eye on the CARB legal FI kits, one is probably in my future when I'm satisfied with my autox adventure.

It wasn't an off the shelf kit. Stock boost but had a FF kit.

Not sure what you guys are getting at.

My OP was asking what I can expect reliably w the stock bottom end and fuel system, (sounds like about 300max) and what the blower would be capable of with a built bottom end and fuel mods (probably more than I need)

I don't want to spend a bunch of $$ on a tune, only to find that it either doesn't make much power, or is too aggressive and causes an engine failure.

Nor do I want to build a motor and fuel setup, if the blower is running out of headroom to take advantage of it.

I think everyone has been pretty informative, and all their answers seem pretty reasonable to me.

I'm putting down 266whp on my 6at with JDL UEL right now 93 octane. On 94 cnd I put down 260whp (much less hp/torque under curve tho) and lost to brothers cts-v1 by about a car length, would really love to get to the 300 number.

Im just venting. My bad. Just like a million posts n conversations on the power potential of individual kits and the different levels of built engines. Even on this forum page n the second one are multiple threads with "how much power if..." not to mention inside the individual charger threads n in the stickies. Sometimes its like beating a dead horse.

Before looking for more power I would suggest riding in the standard Edelbrock setup. I have the standard size pulley and make 323 at the wheels on e-85. More than enough to destroy my 255 tires. I live in Indio, your more than welcome to go for a ride if you want to come over here.

I'm running the factory Edelbrock pulley and tune, on regular 91 octane.

I am a somewhat enthusiastic autocrosser, and I am running a super sticky 265/35-18 tire, and power is OK now, but I am thinking a bit more might help me run with the Vette guys.

the reason I say that folks don't like the answer is that this isn't particularly robust engine, it was engineered for 200Bhp and it needs a reasonable level of work to get it to take boost reliably but when you have tuning house etc kits coming on and saying we make 400bhp on the stock bottom end then this confuses the 1st time poster / newbies

so the question keeps cropping up, mainly because the stock chassis is so good
after all the 1st thing you think when driving an '86 is this thing needs more poke

I understand and agree with basically everything you are saying, but I would love to hear your opinion on the original questions, not just about the nature of the internet.

As I imagine you are quite a bit more knowlegeable on the matter than the average forum poster, your input would be greatly appreciated.

1. Is it possible to get a meaningful increase in power, while maintaining reliability, with just a third party tune?

2. Is the Eaton 1320 unit and intercooler setup on the Edelbrock kit capable of making signifigant power, if I build an engine for it? or will I need to ditch the blower for something with more potential?

If you have already dealt with this, you can just post a link to the relevant thread.

Thanks,
Mitch

1. yes

2. yes.

answers to 1 & 2
1) If you mean using someone like Delicious tuning to change the settings over the Edelbrock CARB tune - then yes there should be a reasonable gain I'd imagine at least 10Bhp
2) I don't know the intercooler capacity on the Edelbrock setup, based on what I know about our setup then I'd estimate its about a 20Kw capacity (ours is 35Kw) so if you run the charger to maximum speed / pressure ratio ( 2.1 Bar manifold pressure) its likely to be putting out 120 degree C of air which if you have 20Kw to cool works out roughly at 80degrees C post intercooler - this will limit power
difficult to say by how much but it probably means about 330 to 340bhp or so.

please bear in mind these numbers are very much a 'finger in the air' figure and I'd love to see some real data (not on E85 mind, on 91 or 93 full gasoline)

Delicious tuning made 283hp to the wheel with the edelbrock on the smallest pulley (TJs car). This was on 91, and a built motor using stock compression ratio, the combination of which presumably produced too much heat for decent power numbers. The same motor made 420whp on e85.

Edit: I think that is also with a UEL manifold which may not be optimal.

I would hope that with 93 and a slight drop in compression that 320whp would be possible, but Matt you can let us know how the TVS900 goes on a built motor and greater cooling capacity in due course!

How much boost are they making on the smaller pulleys?

Also, if TJ is running 91 octane and a built motor, what was the motivation for keeping the stock CR? i would think dropping it a few points would give the tuner a little more room, as far as timing and fuel goes. do you guys just figure that the DI setup is good enough to overcome a detonation problem?