if you dont care about having a cat I 100% agree with you. as far as bang for your buck goes that combo is king IMO too.

For me i wanted to go Catted mainly for volume purposes.

Eh, Cali has the weather. You can surf, snowboard, see giant trees, and go to disney land all in the same day.

I am confused as to why I live here now.

Yeah I moved to the bay area about 3 months ago. 3 hours NE I can get to lake Tahoe. 3 hours S a good beach. San Fran 30 mins away. 1 hour from Napa/Sanoma wine country. 3 hours from yosemite. In the mean time the high temp yesterday was 75, it hasn't rained in like 3 weeks, I live in beautiful curvy rolling hills, and can eat any food imaginable within a 30 min drive. Liquor and wine way cheaper.

Imho it's worth the sucky gas, high taxes, and occasional nude bicyclist.

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I believe it's been proven not only is there a generous market demand but a well designed product does fit the bill:

Good power
Reasonably quiet
Runs clean and in most cases does not throw CEL
Can be optimized with a tune
Does not scream for extra scrutiny due to quiet, clean running design
Best option for those staying NA

This is why I plan on one. JDL should step up here, competition is a good thing. Design a better one, make better power ..... Creative engineering and reasonable costs reap rewards. I am sure everyone is noticing a second wave of innovative products for our cars that make power, look good and make sense. Copy cat filter on a stick (or in a box) designs are buh bye. Hats off to the guys making quality stuff like that.

What makes no sense, more power is made with an EL, yes it is top end......and aftermarket header with cat still makes more power than stock exhaust manifold with cat.......sure I could get more with no cat, but that is not what I wanted.....I still have to pass emissions testing (check if any codes are in ECU) in a few years and the visual check (cars five years or older in Maricopa county AZ).

What makes no sense is your argument, how is making more power than stock bad?

I make more power than stock, more power with the EL over an UEL, and I still pass the emissions testing when needed with the high flow cat............what the two or three HP I lost with the cat makes a difference.....maybe at a track, not on a street car.

But wait there's more......most of my modifications to the "street car" are done not for the power, but wait for it................Gas mileage, yes I get 35 MPG average now....the extra power is a cool benefit.

As well as some of the highest gas prices, highest taxes on everything, laws for everything, smog, very anti-business...

Sorry, I grew up in California and after college went back and lived there for 10 years and now that I'm finally out I would never go back. Some people think that California is a wonderland but those people haven't lived there as adults.

And yes, there is more to California than just the greater San Francisco Bay Area and the Greater Los Angeles Area, but those places don't matter in the scheme of things because they have no population by comparison. And for the 10 years I lived there after college, that was always the problem. Tyranny of the majority.

All valid points, but there is a reason for all of them. Not done just because.

IMO If you can afford it, California is the only place to live.

Just a pain when it comes to headers.

see notes above in red

My entire statement was questioning your statement of "My Catted header works just fine, but it is an equal length header as I want performance over sound." Mainly the portion of "I want performance" part I find this statement odd because 1) there are better header options for power. For example uncatted headers or JDL's catted EL Header. 2) there are UEL's that make better power in the more usable portion of the power band than EL headers.

I disagree

Any car running forced induction will benefit from breathing better...fi isnt just about boost levels, it is about flow. Your engine is an air pump, and the better it flows, the more power it makes.

so you wasted your money on a catted header?

Would you please go to the catted header thread and look at the dynos? Then you will see how beneficial this header is, without a tune. Then come back here and apologize for showing your ignorance.

QUOTE=husker741;1795662]Would you please go to the catted header thread and look at the dynos? Then you will see how beneficial this header is, without a tune. Then come back here and apologize for showing your ignorance.[/QUOTE]

Does a catted header equal the performance gains of a uncatted header?

Well this one has bested most of the uncatted headers out there... So yes. I'm telling you, you don't know what you are talking about until you do the research.

What's the matter with everyone here? It's not that serious, buy what the hell you want. I don't understand why people get butt hurt over what someone else bought.

tuned vs tuned or untuned vs untuned?

My last experience with the 350z of my friend, when we have removed the 2 high flow cat to replace them with by tests pipes, one of the cat was completely destroyed and the other one had an big hole into it...
Then since this time, I will not thrust any aftermarket high flow cat...

I bet if you thrust a cat it would become high flow.

In many states, installing a aftermarket catted header is just as illegal as a cattless header. As here in a California. A speedfactory catted header here in California will get you in just as much trouble as a cattless header. And at $949, one could have a OFH with a OFT for $1014. WIth more power and tuning abilities.

Fixed that for you

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because racecar state... no emissions testing or vehicle inspections. i've literally seen a nextel cup car drive down the road lol

@nelsmar should have this on the dyno soon

http://jdlautodesign.net/wp-content/...UEL-Catted.jpg

are you gonna connect it to the OP first? :P

Can't wait to see it.

This is 100% YOUR opinion. I've lived in this state my entire life (44 now), none of it in any of the big cities. I love it to this day and wouldn't live permanently anywhere else. We've got our warts, but so many benefits.

I love the discussions here and friends' photos on FB of people with "winter". WTF is that? Snow tires?:lol:

I'm outdoors most of the year be it surfing, diving, fishing, cycling, backpacking, and so on and so forth. We often go to the beach on Christmas. My commute is 35 miles of looking at the ocean and islands.

And yes, it is federally illegal to remove a working cat.

Yes, it is my opinion, and what with 28 years of living in California I think I'm entitled to it. Just as you are entitled to yours. It's unfortunate though that you haven't ever lived anywhere else, as you don't have anything to provide a basis for comparison.

Also, I can counter your "WTF is [winter]?" with "WTF is: a drought? an earthquake? a sandstorm? expensive gasoline?"

805! Great beer.

And for @cycleboy to say that "In the grand scheme of things" cities with low populations do not matter. Thus those parts of California are somehow not California...

Well agree to disagree.

Just pointing out that you said anyone who loves this state hasn't lived here as an adult = incorrect.

Why would I need to live elsewhere when I'm totally happy? My commute is 30+ miles along the ocean into the sunrise or sunset, little traffic, good roads. The forecast for the next 7 days is sunny and 85, lows in the 50's.

As for the questions:

drought - a real concern for us right now, just as flooding in the midwest is for them. Global warming maybe, I dunno. Might get more extreme for everyone.

earthquake - why are people so freaked about them? They can happen from time to time everywhere, and most amount to nothing. Tornadoes happen annually through the midwest.

sandstorm - what? Never been remotely close to experiencing this.

expensive gas - well, how about expensive real estate too? But consider wages as well. Expensive is relative. Friends who have moved out of state can't afford to come back, yet we afford our lives just fine.

I really don't care what goes on in the big cities of Ca. as it mostly has nothing to do with me. But, they are close enough to visit if we feel a need to do big city stuff!

Dont know if you guys caught this in our exhaust thread

I am all in for these results, JDL does NOT make useless parts that do not work. Looking like auto jewelry is just a bonus. This UEL and their Catback are very high on my list!!

The lead time is there because the market is limited at best. Sure they may get 50 orders real quick but long term the demand will peter out. Can't go and order an asston of material and hire two or three fabricators then have no work for them after the initial rush. Smart business model though it may cost them a few sales in the short term.

This is only the case with FI where you have positive displacement before combustion. In N/A motors, scavenging is key to moving air in and out, not flow. Run open header on a N/A motor vs properly sized piping and see how much slower the open header runs.

As for Catted headers in general.
1. Defeats the purpose of a properly designed collector.
2. Reduces the overall potential gains, regardless of whether its "currently the best on the market", it still isn't as good as it could be.
3. A cat is not a muffler. it will only change the pitch of the resonance. Put in a resonator further down the piping somewhere if you want to cry about it.
4. By replacing a working cat with another cat is no different than running no cat at all in the eyes of the law if you are stopped, regardless of location. Not that they would take you to court over it, but that is about as ignorant an excuse for a cat as it gets.
5. For those that have inspections, stop being so damn lazy and swap stock back in for inspection if you are trying to "game the system". I'm not saying break the law, but you have obviously already made that decision for yourself when you are considering buying ANY aftermarket header or front pipe.
6. If you haven't gotten the point yet, #6 is here for me to tell you that its pointless, and all of your "but"s are not founded on anything. You can argue until your face is blue, but it won't make you right.

The only exception is if your motorsport class ALLOWS aftermarket headers but REQUIRES a cat to be in the factory location.

@Dephective
Some people want a little performance boost without getting a tune, which is a completely valid point you left out. It's not always about maximizing gains.

some of us hate the smell of an uncatted setup, if I have to sacrifice 2 WHP with a catted setup to avoid the putrid smell I will.

As someone else pointed out, a major reason for some of us to want a catted header is to minimize drone and loudness. In that context, I'd have to see a Dyno on an otherwise stock exhaust with a tune before I'd consider buying this.

Amen! Even though it may be technically illegal spewing out pollutants is not cool when you have a choice. If I had a catted header (and I don't yet), I would feel much better knowing my car would easily pass smog without the visual critique.

If you would have released both I would have bought the catted UEL even if it cost more. I wouldn't have had to sell my exhaust (Nameless) because it was way too loud with the catless headers (sounded great in spite of the loudness). Now I have the Q300, which seems to be one of the very few that sounds good and is quiet enough to go up the hills I drive on daily.

Leave stock front pipe or buy a catted front pipe. Cat further down stream AFTER the collector is better than directly on top of it, if you must have have one.

Still no argument for the catted header.

Provide me some real data trhat says the cat ruins the header. You're argument about it ruining the colector is wortless untill you give me a solid graph noting the difference

Never said it "ruins the header". I said it defeats the purpose of a proper collector.

Design a 4-1 merge collector that has angles at specific degrees optimized for exhaust gas velocity and CFM (that works in conjunction with one another) and then put layers of a mesh-work barrier directly in front of it.

Tell me why that makes sense? Regardless of how little difference it is on paper, it still doesn't make sense why you would do that, when you can have a cat later in the system that would have less of an effect on performance and you will have maintained the engineering of a proper collector (assuming your header has one).