FR-S vs 1998 240SX, looking at the data

[regal]

Bottom line numbers:

1998 240SX 0-60 8 seconds
1998 240SX 1/4 mile 15.9 seconds
1998 240SX $18,369 base = $24,434 in 2010

2012 FR-S 0-60 6.2 seconds
2012 FR-S 1/4 mile 14.8 seconds
2012 FR-S $24,930

FR-S has a 6th gear.

Commentary:

One thing for sure the 86-87 Toyota AE86's held up better than the Nissans. The Nissans tended to turn into flexy rattle boxes after a lot of hard driving.

The FR-S doesn't really have much more acceleration than a stock 240sx. Only one second better in the 1/4 mile.

The MR2 spyder (especially with the 2zz) was much much closer to an Elise in overall design than the FR-S.


People say the FR-S doesn't have enough power, but really it just weighs too much. I do appreciate the stiff chassis, but the stupid regulations force the design to absorb energy in a crash. So to have a stiff chassis and pass the regs it ends up being a heavier car than it needs to be.

If the FR-S weighed the same as the MR2 Spyder, the whole sluggish lack of power "controversy" wouldn't even be a topic of discussion.

With the 240SX the lack of acceleration was fairly inexpensively solved with JDM junkyard engines shipped across the pacific. Basically a domestic 240sx could be turned into a 13 second high performance car for less than $4k. It just doesn't look like that will happen with the FR-S. Hopefully the future Subaru FI FA20 engines will have bellhousings that allow a swap but that is a bit of a hope and a prayer.


So unlike the 240SX the key to this becoming a good value for the buck sports car will be weight reduction tricks. The after market industry is focusing on turbo kits and bolt ons which are proving to be expensive.

You have to wonder how much weight could be shaved off this car with a good chasiss engineer, a grinder, and a plasma cutter.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by regal

Bottom line numbers:

1998 240SX 0-60 8 seconds
1998 240SX 1/4 mile 15.9 seconds
1998 240SX $18,369 base = $24,434 in 2010

2012 FR-S 0-60 6.2 seconds
2012 FR-S 1/4 mile 14.8 seconds
2012 FR-S $24,930

FR-S has a 6th gear.

Commentary:

One thing for sure the 86-87 Toyota AE86's held up better than the Nissans. The Nissans tended to turn into flexy rattle boxes after a lot of hard driving.

How will these Toyota/Subaru's will hold up as far as long term durability ?

im thinking you never owned an 86 corolla

[Floggin Tires]

Originally Posted by regal

With the 240SX the lack of acceleration was fairly inexpensively solved with JDM junkyard engines shipped across the pacific.
Basically a domestic 240sx could be turned into a 13 second high performance car for less than $4k.
It just doesn't look like that will happen with the FR-S.

Give the FR-S, BRZ, 15 years or so the same will be true.

[regal]

Originally Posted by fatoni

im thinking you never owned an 86 corolla

No but (years ago) I examined and drove many 12 yo AE86's that were in much better shape than 5 year old 240sx's (way before the drifting craze). Let me put it this way, It may not make lot of sense to invest $8k restoring a 20 year old Nissan 240sx, but it does make since to invest into a 20 yo MR2. Because of long term durability/quality.

Originally Posted by Floggin Tires

Give the FR-S, BRZ, 15 years or so the same will be true.

I was hoping someone would say that . If I had known in 1995 what the S14 was capable 10 years later I would have bought one new.

[Wolfking]

I'm not sure what point you're trying to drive to, but having owned both cars, I have an entirely different view. I purchased my new 1998 240SX SE in August of '98.($24k) I drove it for 11 years then sold it.

Minus the power, there was not a better car in its class. It was lowered 2", had an Enjen intake, front STB, custom catback exhaust, Hawk brake pads along with Brembo cross drilled rotors, steel braided lines, a Centerforce stg II clutch and Z32 hard bearing tie rods . On top of that it had a functional rear seat and I was able to get around in the snow on all season tires. I've no recollection of a "rattlebox."

I can only hope my FRS lives up to this.

LL-FRS!

[Floggin Tires]

Originally Posted by Wolfking

I can only hope my FRS lives up to this.

Give the FR-S, BRZ, 15 years or so the same will be true.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by regal

No but (years ago) I examined and drove many 12 yo AE86's that were in much better shape than 5 year old 240sx's (way before the drifting craze). Let me put it this way, It may not make lot of sense to invest $8k restoring a 20 year old Nissan 240sx, but it does make since to invest into a 20 yo MR2. Because of long term durability/quality.



I was hoping someone would say that . If I had known in 1995 what the S14 was capable 10 years later I would have bought one new.

that strikes me as a little odd especially since the mr2 isnt the ae86. even if you were talking about the ae86, i disagree. that doesnt mean i dont value the opinion. if it was my money it would be the ae86 but i acknowledge thats just preference

[xwd]

I'm still trying to figure out the point. Let me go put my four autocross tires and jack and tools in my MR-S. Also the FR-S has a better power to weight ratio than the MR-S, mainly due to a more advanced engine.

As for comparing to a 240 I for one won't be trashing the warranty in my brand new car with a turbo kit or engine swap.

I hope the BRZ/FR-S does hold up well.

[Tanuki]

My FRS feels like a dream compared to my kouki s14 pig.

[NotSoJDM]

lol at this thread.

[QFry]

O_o "only one second better in the 1/4 mile" ? do you drag race much? i would gladly take "one second " off my time in any car i race... but that may just be me.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Tanuki

My FRS feels like a dream compared to my kouki s14 pig.

i would imagine that there is less than 50lbs difference between the two cars how much do you think these cars weigh?

[Tanuki]

You are right, curb weight is almost the same, but the ka also produces roughly 25% less power and the s14 is Around 10 inches longer. If I could do it all again, I would definitely build an s13 before an s14.

[Wolfking]

Originally Posted by Tanuki

My FRS feels like a dream compared to my kouki s14 pig.

I liked you, up until now Tanuki san!