2017 Civic Type R at Nurburgring

[brianhj]

Originally Posted by Alex0827a

Wouldn't drop ~30k on a Civic when I could get something that looks so much better for the same money or less.

Fucking this

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[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Alex0827a

Wouldn't drop ~30k on a Civic when I could get something that looks so much better for the same money or less.

Similar to the STI or Evo, I don't think anyone is buying a CTR for its looks.

Check out this CTR vs. M3 vs. RS3 track battle. I've seen first-hand what F80 M3's can do on the track, and for the CTR to top that is very impressive. This is the appeal of these cars (although whether or not owners actually track them I have no idea).

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3n7zhb7aN8"]Honda Civic Type R vs BMW M3 vs Audi RS3: track battle - YouTube[/ame]

[Alex0827a]

I actually really like Evos, especially the 8 and 9. That said, I might be committing heresy by saying I wouldn't buy a new M3, and would probably dismiss the Audi there in favor of a Porsche or a Vette. I dunno, I just love low-slung coupes and would never buy a car I thought was ugly, regardless of its capabilities. To each their own though.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by Alex0827a

I actually really like Evos, especially the 8 and 9. That said, I might be committing heresy by saying I wouldn't buy a new M3, and would probably dismiss the Audi there in favor of a Porsche or a Vette. I dunno, I just love low-slung coupes and would never buy a car I thought was ugly, regardless of its capabilities. To each their own though.

Yeah the CTR is pretty hideous to me and I can't see myself ever buying one, but impressive that it can beat a $25,000 GBP more expensive F80 M3 on a track. I can respect that even if I'd never buy one - different strokes for different folks and all

I actually remember when Evos and STIs were known for pulling off the same trick, but sadly no longer.

[EAGLE5]

Given the right engine, aero, brakes, springs, struts, bushings, tires, setup, and driver, a wide variety of cars can be made to track extremely quickly. What is impressive is when the same car can provide comfort and reliability off the track at the same time and at a reasonable price. I've seen many old Civics putting down fantastic times. They are not exactly comfortable cars, though.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

Given the right engine, aero, brakes, springs, struts, bushings, tires, setup, and driver, a wide variety of cars can be made to track extremely quickly. What is impressive is when the same car can provide comfort and reliability off the track at the same time and at a reasonable price. I've seen many old Civics putting down fantastic times. They are not exactly comfortable cars, though.

I agree. You should see the comparison between the STI and CTR where they find the CTR is not only quicker, but has the nicer interior and more refinement.

I dont even like the CTR that much, but i think its underappreciated on this site for some reason. Again not my cup of tea, but hugely impressive for the price.

[EAGLE5]

The short track makes this unconvincing. Show me what the car can do at Laguna Seca or some other world class track, not a tiny track.

[RandomDeception]

I know that the 10th generation Civic will finally share a chassis and frame globally, but whatever happened to this?



I thought that this was going to be the design for 2017.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

The short track makes this unconvincing. Show me what the car can do at Laguna Seca or some other world class track, not a tiny track.

Well there is this track called the Nurburgring...

[WolfpackS2k]

^^thats a concept car. So that's what happened to that.


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[EAGLE5]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

Well there is this track called the Nurburgring...

Wasn't a production car.

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

Wasn't a production car.

I heard it was pretty much a production car with a roll cage and no A/C. Seems reasonable to me. Given the CTR is now in production and has thus far:

- set a faster laptime than an F80 M3 at Llandlow Circuit
- about equaled the laptime of an E92 M3 at Killarney Circuit
- beat the laptimes of the AR 4C, Evora, and M235i at Killarney Circuit

I don't think there's any reason to doubt the CTR's track credibility.

Out of curiosity, what's your reason for doubting it?

[EAGLE5]

I distrust mainly because I think manufacturers game the benchmarks. Because the short track is so short and he drives the F80 pretty tail-happy. Because Killarney and Llandlow are seriously odd choices. Because The Ring is such a crazily long track, I would expect significant variation from run to run. Mainly because I haven't seen somebody buy one and then track it and report these amazing times. I have nothing against Honda. We're comparing cars I don't own. The performance claims are just a bit awesome for the power and design.

And if I'm wrong, that's cool. We all win with an awesome performer!

[DarkSunrise]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

I distrust mainly because I think manufacturers game the benchmarks. Because the short track is so short and he drives the F80 pretty tail-happy. Because Killarney and Llandlow are seriously odd choices. Because The Ring is such a crazily long track, I would expect significant variation from run to run. Mainly because I haven't seen somebody buy one and then track it and report these amazing times. I have nothing against Honda. We're comparing cars I don't own. The performance claims are just a bit awesome for the power and design.

And if I'm wrong, that's cool. We all win with an awesome performer!

Yeah I can see where you're coming from with manufacturer's Nurburgring laptimes, a lot of shady business going on there. I do think we've got a fairly representative spread of tracks in the existing lap times for the CTR though. A long track in the Nurburgring, a short track in Llandow, and a short/medium track in Killarney - all done by pro or ex-pro racers.

It'll be a while before we see first-hand reports, since a lot of online forums tend to be US-based (where the CTR obviously hasn't been released). I'm optimistic about the CTR though, and it's been a long time since I've said that about any Honda product lol.