Perrin lockdown vs Cusco rack stay??

[Yoshoobaroo]

Originally Posted by Cole

So, what you described is exactly NVH...

That was my point earlier too, you cannot improve steering feedback without increasing NVH.

-Josh

[Cole]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

That was my point earlier too, you cannot improve steering feedback without increasing NVH.

-Josh

Not disputing what you said, just not sure why/how someone could say "no increase in NVH, but I can feel more of the road through the steering wheel". Makes no sense

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Yoshoobaroo

Ok I'm confused now. Both of these were designed to transfer more vibrations (feedback). To the wheel. So are you saying there was no difference at all? NVH kinda goes hand in hand with feedback.

They're not designed to transfer more vibration, they're designed to stop the rack from moving independent of the subframe. Most of the vibration/feel is going to be transmitted through the tierods into the rack, then into the wheel. Since these lockdowns don't change anything in the tierod to rack connection or rack to steering column connection I'm not surprised there isn't a big difference in NVH.

What you might notice is the car is less wandery over bumps, since the rack can't move relative to the body the wheels can't move L/R without steering wheel input.

[Yoshoobaroo]

hah yea i was concurring

[stokeless]

I may have to invest in a front strut bar like the AEM or Grimmspeed and then go with the perrin lockdown, I will do more research. The Sti longer bolts.... not really sure how much these would help, I don't really understand how it could.

[Sleepless]

Originally Posted by Cole

Not disputing what you said, just not sure why/how someone could say "no increase in NVH, but I can feel more of the road through the steering wheel". Makes no sense

Because to me NVH is a bad thing and the lockdowns are intended to add a good thing (feel more). I'm pretty sure no one equates better steering feel with NVH.

[ryoma]

you also have to keep in mind that our cars aren't some $60K+ German-built luxury vehicle. NVH is always going to be a thing and if you want luxury and comfort, you have the wrong car.

[Cole]

Originally Posted by Sleepless

Because to me NVH is a bad thing and the lockdowns are intended to add a good thing (feel more). I'm pretty sure no one equates better steering feel with NVH.

I'd argue semantics, but it isn't worth it. You're entirely right in your bubble, but you did admit to it adding NVH. Whether positive or not, it's there.

[SPCorBUST]

Thanks @kuczynskika.

Hey @stokeless, I'm probably the closest you will get to directly translatable experience, both for your present and possibly future goals, if you are concerned about steering feel not coming at the expense of NVH.

I mean, you can read through a bunch of these comments but frankly, only a few are actually worth a damn. They are mostly from folks with ZERO experience with the product, much less with a setup similar to yours.

My setup is pretty close to what you have outlined. I am -2.3F, 0 toe, and -2.6R, 3/32 toe in on coilovers. I have the STI bolts, nuts, and spacers, as well as the STI bushings. (Side note, I see that you're averse to that, but you can get the Cusco tool which actually makes it fairly simple, and its actually very inexpensive, circa $20 when I bought it.)

Hm, is there an increase in NVH over stock?

Noise - no, not a damn bit. Not like when you add an intake. Or exhaust. Or aluminum drive shaft. Or bypass valve. Or short shifter. Or anything else where you may here some minute noise change in the cabin due to things rattling or vibrating or otherwise even remotely sounding like the car shouldn't have come that way.

Vibration - no, not a bit. I'll add that in the first six months I had this I was commuting 110+ miles daily over crummy freeways and streets as well as excellent freeways and streets. After that, I only drove on butter smooth roads with decently long stretches for roughly 15-20 miles a day. I never noticed a thing, and I listen intently for rattles, e.g. the annoying dashboard and speaker panel rattles other owners experience, the rattle you may sometimes get from a kartboy shifter, etc. I don't have any of that and yet I have the essentially the entire Cusco brace catalog installed.

Harshness - no, it is not adding any "harshness" to your steering.

I can tell you that I seem to feel it when changing directions in a quick succession, or when I give the car very sudden and strong steering inputs in either direction. It just feels more connected.

Other folks seem to have reported some feelings of NVH. I wonder if maybe they installed it wrong or something is wrong with their car. Go figure.

I don't know which is better between the Perrin and the Cusco. Although, I can tell you that I weighed both options, even after having already purchased and used the Perrin, and decided to stick with the Perrin set.

FYI I just looked them up on their site and found this:

"NOISE, VIBRATION, AND HARSHNESS
PERRIN Steering Rack Lockdowns provide the benefit of an increased driver feel at the cost of adding some noise, vibration, and harshness (NVH). The increase in NVH is minimal and nearly impossible to feel."

I would agree with that.

Or, you can speculate all day long with these folks. Up to you...

[stokeless]

Thanks SPCorBUST. So it appears you have both the sti bushing, bolts and the perrin loCo down. Interesting, I'll do more research.

[Panman]

As an alternative, I have the Whiteline rack bushings with the STI rack bolts, this is a noticable improvement in reducing the (admittedly minor) slop in the standard bushes. As has been said above, on a standard car the change is not that easy to feel - mine is fairly heavily modified as I am a track rat and I could feel the difference immediately.

[stokeless]

thinking about trying the ts bolts but with shipping, we are talking 75.00 for two bolts/nuts/spacer. Are there any alternatives???? any know the actual length of the bolts?

[SPCorBUST]

Originally Posted by stokeless

thinking about trying the ts bolts but with shipping, we are talking 75.00 for two bolts/nuts/spacer. Are there any alternatives???? any know the actual length of the bolts?

Almost, of not than, twice as long. You will use posted of your subframe you never have before. Seriously, lol.

Sent from my SM-G925T using Tapatalk

[continuecrushing]

@SPCorBUST you and I come from SRT's with solid motor mounts that shook like crazy...would we even know what NVH in a normal car was if it hit us in the face lol?