Full throttle Electric Supercharger Build Thread

[ROFL it's Waffle]

Originally Posted by Lantanafrs2

You still have to power them. Not worth it when there are exhaust gases to do the work.

I was thinking about this exact thing this morning. Continuous use would require more reserve battery capacity (batteries are heavy!), unless the stock alternator is good enough to charge the unit, but I'm already having my doubts.

[churchx]

Exhaust gas energy otherwise is wasted at that.
I'm still waiting for someone to make in future also something like electric generator with turbine in exhaust. Should fit well electric supercharging. = less energy wasted; no construction/design/spacing limitations, as that generator can be anywhere in exhaust, as instead of mechanical linkage only electric wires, that can easily be routed however needed, connect with rest; no need to think of any wastegates and alike to prevent overboost, as again due no mechanical linkage generator can always keep spinning/generating current, what goes to ESC will go through battery/wiring/controller to give just the needed current for SC.

[86TOYO2k17]

Originally Posted by churchx

Exhaust gas energy otherwise is wasted at that.
I'm still waiting for someone to make in future also something like electric generator with turbine in exhaust. Should fit well electric supercharging. = less energy wasted; no construction/design/spacing limitations, as that generator can be anywhere in exhaust, as instead of mechanical linkage only electric wires, that can easily be routed however needed, connect with rest; no need to think of any wastegates and alike to prevent overboost, as again due no mechanical linkage generator can always keep spinning/generating current, what goes to ESC will go through battery/wiring/controller to give just the needed current for SC.

that would be a good idea, could have that generator routed to a large power pack in the trunk for better weight distribution and run that to twin ESC.

[ROFL it's Waffle]

Originally Posted by churchx

Exhaust gas energy otherwise is wasted at that.
I'm still waiting for someone to make in future also something like electric generator with turbine in exhaust.

I kind of know where you're going with this (I didn't at first). It'd be like adding a "water wheel" to the exhaust "flow" that could recharge electric capacity. I can't imagine this being nearly as efficient as an alternator, which generates electricity at any RPM. Would there be enough exhaust "flow" at idle to turn the "water wheel"?


A device in the exhaust I think could contribute to unwanted back-pressure (you can only spin a turbine so fast before the drag on the blades prevent it from spinning faster), further contributing to storing heat near the engine bay (heat = reduced efficiency).


So..... a turbocharger could be like an electric generator if you rigged it up to generate electricity... but... if you're going through all that work to plumb a turbocharger, to generate electricity for an electric turbo....

[churchx]

ROFL it's Waffle: water wheel .. just like in classic turbo. Yes, there might be more losses in first generating electricity, then using it to spin supercharger vs direct shaft connecting "snails", but you get all flexibility of fine-controlling SC, and it can spin all the time, instead of using blowoff.
As to - if there will be enough flow - but what happens to "classic" turbo with not enough flow? With it aswell, engine has to reach specific rpm-s and turbo to spin up for boost to build up, and even with that people these days seem to be ok with current FI engines as is, that of with no boost at idle rpms. If anything - due no direct linkage you got rid of another "classic" turbo flaw - lag. There is battery with prestored power that can give immediate spool up of electric super charger, unlike in turbo, milliseconds of pedal press away, no wait for exhaust pressure to build up.
* SC = immediate NA like response, but some energy/power wasting due driving from crankshaft. Also less flexibility to fine tune it.
* Turbo = best gains, due recuperated otherwise wasted exhaust energy to produce boost/extra power, relative simple, but at same time extra difficulty to find space for it in stuffed underbonet space of modern cars, requirement for specific header design, extra need to cool it. +Problems with throttle response lag, with different means to solve it, almost none ideal. Be it optimising turbo for specific rpm range, be it making it more complicated (and more costly/less reliable) via eg. multiple turbos/variable angle of attack/mixing with SC/added ESC and so on ..
* ESC = pros & cons of SC, + extra fine tuning capability via controller firmware, allowing for full boost even at very lowest idle rpm-s.
* ESC + ETG (thought up just now abbreviature of electric turbo generator ) = pros of SC in responsive engine, pros of Turbo on extra efficiency/most gains, pros of ESC of extra fine tunability .. and no cons of all of those (except extra cost ) - as no engine power loss to produce boost, wasted energy gets recuperated (also good for economy & emissions), simpler to mount, reduces requirements of exhaust design / space usage under bonnet, reduces cooling requirements (as ETG can put also further exhaust downstream with cooler gases (may reduce recuperated energy though)) .. maybe, just maybe, con of less efficiency due double energy conversion (have no data on losses in turbo vs potential losses in ESC+ETG). "Win-win" in marketing droid speach

So in galaxy far far away, there would be loads of aftermarket bolt-on ESC+ETG kits for anybody to enjoy for all those pros and almost no cons, while here we have only maker of just ESC stopping producing despite great demand.

[Aztec]

Just a quick question for anyone here. I picked up the ESC kit used from Fenton a few years and the controller box has stopped pushing the power from the battery array to the ESC itself. Voltages all look fine and the signal to push power is working as the voltage dips for a second when under load, but immediately goes back to 28.1 and no boost is actually pushed to the ESC.

I've swapped back to NA for the time being. Anyone have any experience working on the controller box, have schematics etc? @fenton
I've taken it apart and see nothing apparently wrong with any cable terminations or capacitors. It's kinda one of those things, once you fully take it all apart it's hard to put back together.

[BlOody_BoOger]

Originally Posted by Aztec

Just a quick question for anyone here. I picked up the ESC kit used from Fenton a few years and the controller box has stopped pushing the power from the battery array to the ESC itself. Voltages all look fine and the signal to push power is working as the voltage dips for a second when under load, but immediately goes back to 28.1 and no boost is actually pushed to the ESC.

I've swapped back to NA for the time being. Anyone have any experience working on the controller box, have schematics etc? @fenton
I've taken it apart and see nothing apparently wrong with any cable terminations or capacitors. It's kinda one of those things, once you fully take it all apart it's hard to put back together.

There is a fuse inside the controller box idk you think that might've blown?

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[Aztec]

Originally Posted by BlOody_BoOger

There is a fuse inside the controller box idk you think that might've blown?

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There is a fuse in the box and the top down visual check didn't appear to be blown. I think it was soldered slightly so I didn't take it out to check

[taiquach]

Originally Posted by Aztec

Just a quick question for anyone here. I picked up the ESC kit used from Fenton a few years and the controller box has stopped pushing the power from the battery array to the ESC itself. Voltages all look fine and the signal to push power is working as the voltage dips for a second when under load, but immediately goes back to 28.1 and no boost is actually pushed to the ESC.

I've swapped back to NA for the time being. Anyone have any experience working on the controller box, have schematics etc? @fenton
I've taken it apart and see nothing apparently wrong with any cable terminations or capacitors. It's kinda one of those things, once you fully take it all apart it's hard to put back together.

have you ever replace the dump pack batteries , mine did the same thing a couple year ago , got it fixed with a new set oddessy dump pack batteries.

[j_Zer0]

I agree. Next step is to replace your dump batteries. I had a similar issue. Everything checked out fine, but nothing fixed the issue until I got new dump batteries.

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[sato]

Although I don't have the ESC, I do use the Odyssey batteries on my FR-S. The Odyssey I just replaced a few months back just croaked, no previous warning or anything.

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[Aztec]

Originally Posted by taiquach

have you ever replace the dump pack batteries , mine did the same thing a couple year ago , got it fixed with a new set oddessy dump pack batteries.

The most hilarious thing to all of this happened this morning.
My car refused to start in around 30 degree F weather.
~
For context, I had removed the ESC+Controller, but left the 3 PC680 Array in.
After tearing all that apart at 6am in the cold I swapped in a single battery (far right in the array) Same result, barely turning over before clicking.
Swapped in a single PC680 that was in the middle of the array.
INSTANTLY STARTS THE CAR. Fucking facepalm

I honestly bet my controller actually works fine, and the right battery was shitting the bed and couldn't transfer the power to the ESC. But it was being masked because there were two other batteries that were fine haha.

[dtek]

Anyone still here with advice for troubleshooting?

I'm seeing the same problem Aztec had a while ago where the volt meter reads high when not activated (~29.2V)
Upon throttle, it dips a little to ~28.2 then jumps up to ~30.x and no boost is apparent.
Just put in a pair of brand new dump batteries couple weeks ago and all was working great until this happened....

Not sure where to begin with diagnosis since Aztec previously seemed to fix his issue just with fiddling with wire connections, Ive checked the connector that leads to the volt meter/procede and the main heavy duty 28v connector and all seems ok.

[Target70]

Originally Posted by dtek

Anyone still here with advice for troubleshooting?

I'm seeing the same problem Aztec had a while ago where the volt meter reads high when not activated (~29.2V)
Upon throttle, it dips a little to ~28.2 then jumps up to ~30.x and no boost is apparent.
Just put in a pair of brand new dump batteries couple weeks ago and all was working great until this happened....

Not sure where to begin with diagnosis since Aztec previously seemed to fix his issue just with fiddling with wire connections, Ive checked the connector that leads to the volt meter/procede and the main heavy duty 28v connector and all seems ok.

Check all the wiring: The bullet connectors to the motor, the battery terminal connections for corrosion, the cabling like the voltmeter/switch cable/fuse relay through the firewall, to make sure it isn't scraped/melted/grounding etc.. cause it's the easiest thing to do.

If you have your old dump batteries or even some spare car batteries you can hook them up and test with the engine off to ensure your new dump batteries aren't defective.

I don't know much about the procede, you could rule out the procede by removing it from the system, and testing with the throttle switch(unlikely the cause as you said the Volt Meter is reading high)

The only other thing I can think of is to completely isolate the phantom from the car. Hook it up to known good batteries for the dump pack, no procede, alternate power source/battery for the fuse/relay(depending on version). If the compressor doesn't kick on like this, you may have to dig into the control box or the volt display box looking for bad solder/crimp connections.

Good luck with it. Hopefully it's something simple. Unless someone reverse engineers it, or tears it apart and writes up a schematic/parts list, it's going to be near impossible to bring an actual dead phantom back to life.