Twin vs BMW m240i

[chaoskaze]

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

A. I was buying the tS because it had every mod I would do on my own with the exception of the supercharger.

B. I disagree with you on the tS modifications and their value.

ts has:
Tires and wheels
Body kit
Wing
Interior and head unit upgrades
Tuned suspension
Bracing and stiffners

Some of those things you cannot buy.
And furthermore if you bought all of these things yourself on top of a premium BRZ you would likely spend just as much or more money.

That is true, tS is a bargain if you want STI goodies to come with your car especially when that wing retail @ 2000 alone; Bodykit is around 1.2k; wheel 1.2k; flex strut is 500; suspension is just Sachs with STI spring thou. So if you get PP that’s about 400. Interior upgrade is gonna cost around 600 with only the inserts. Not counting the special odometer or chairs. All prices without tax and installation.

*underbody panel is about 200 for full set, not sure if the newer cars come with them or not.

Hey but if you are getting FI... those wheel won’t be staying on your car for long. So ....


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[ajcarson11]

Originally Posted by deejaylew

I also felt this way in my ownership with both BMW's.

It really feels like they are built to maximize the joy of ownership in the first 3-4 years. There are too many failure points for long term ownership.. There are sensors to make sure your sensors are working, and they probably have a sensor to tell you if your having a problem with that sensor. I just couldn't really follow what the techs were talking about when I took it in for service and overall didn't enjoy that aspect of ownership. If you must have one, do what I did and get rid of them before your warranty expires.

Edit: Oh yeah back on point, Unless you get an M2 nobody in the BMW community will care much. Its a fickle group, you will buy the car for performance reasons and most of the other owners you meet just keep it in the garage for their wife to drive on the weekend. I wish there was more passion for any of the cars under 50k but its severely lacking. Just thought I'd share that, If you enjoy this community you will be let down when you cross over to BMW world.

I also agree with this. I have a friend who designs electronics as a vendor for BMW. On multiple occasions he has caught their engineers making requests for parts 'that can just last a few years'. Long term ownership is not factored into new BMWs.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by deejaylew

I see your point, but I hate when threads devolve into this. 99.9% of people with that kind of money aren't going to buy a brz and add 30k in mods, they are just going to buy the m2. More realistically a person would buy a BRZ and invest 3-4k in mods if they were inclined to mod it in the first place, In this more realistic scenario I know which car I would rather have.

If you spend 30k in mods you really should have just considered building a race car from scrap metal, how much work does the car really need to be "acceptable" in your mind?? (not you personally, rhetorical)

I'll have less than 2K in mine and it will be better than an M2.

It's all about whether you can fab and tune yourself or not...

Sure if someone is asking, should I buy x car or a twin and mod it, the first question should be.. Are you modding it yourself, or paying someone to mod it for you?

If the answer is paying someone, then I totally agree, buy the other car...

Jaden

[TorontoNat]

Originally Posted by Jaden

I'll have less than 2K in mine and it will be better than an M2.

Jaden

This is the funniest thing I have read on the forums all day. Thank you sir.

[switchlanez]

Can't comment on the BMW but I have an E-Force BRZ. Not as refined by a longshot (tricky 3-puck clutch/lightweight flywheel chatter and stiffer suspension don't help) but upside to that is it's very visceral.

If I didn't already have a BRZ, I'd seriously consider a Porsche Certified Pre-Owned Cayman. I've gone through the motions of switching to one (ultimately prefer a 987 over a 981) but couldn't justify it as the E-Force BRZ feels about as fast but better viscerally.

Some of my thought process:
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=618
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=216

As far as E-Force BRZ tS vs 987/987S Cayman... I prefer the looks of a BRZ tS but MR layout is more elusive and factory build makes it more stout, however, it'll be used. Tough call. I'd also consider a base 718 (comparable to 981S).

But if you won't consider Porsche for whatever reason, disregard everything I said except an E-Force BRZ tS will not disappoint, especially if you liked your first 86. Best to test drive both configurations you're considering.

[r_rated]

As a luxury car house - get the BRZ. BMW has lost their way. If you care more about drag racing from stop lights, get a 240 or a mustang GT.... If you want to have fun driving get a twin.

If you want to have fun driving and something nicer get an older used Porsche Cayman, boxster or 996. the BRZ is in that league for fun. Don't believe the hyperbole around maintenance costs... It is more than a twin by only a meager ~10% overall.

[pkolanko]

I contemplated an m235 and test drove it. However, I went with a used 2015 series.blue with 1700 miles for $21k over an new m235 at $50k. Saving $29k puts a smile on my face every day as does driving my BRZ, which is practically brand new anyway. Is the M235 better? Maybe, but not $29k better.

[TommyW]

For the low 50's just get a lo mi '15 Cayman and be over it

[EAGLE5]

If I totaled my FR-S, I'm not sure what I'd get to replace it. A used twin is an option, maybe already modded. A 911 perhaps. RS3.

BMW 240i isn't even on the radar. I've had two BMWs, and they are now disposable cars. Have been for a long time, really.

A GTI is a fine car, but again, disposable. A budget BMW.

[tennisfreak]

Originally Posted by switchlanez

If I didn't already have a BRZ, I'd seriously consider a Porsche Certified Pre-Owned Cayman. I've gone through the motions of switching to one (ultimately prefer a 987 over a 981) but couldn't justify it as the E-Force BRZ feels about as fast but better viscerally.

Originally Posted by TommyW

For the low 50's just get a lo mi '15 Cayman and be over it

When I bought my FR-S back in '13 I had actually test drove and even worked a deal on a used Cayman S.
The sleazeball dealership sold it out from underneath me.
Pissed me off so bad I bought the FR-S instead.

The Cayman is absolutely great but there is ZERO storage space for anything.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

If I totaled my FR-S, I'm not sure what I'd get to replace it. A used twin is an option, maybe already modded. A 911 perhaps. RS3.

BMW 240i isn't even on the radar. I've had two BMWs, and they are now disposable cars. Have been for a long time, really.

A GTI is a fine car, but again, disposable. A budget BMW.

Before I found the FRS and was doing some research on what was out there I ended up reading through a BMW forum. This comment was made time and time again. There were whole threads dedicated to the subject. Since I usually treat cars as disposable it didn't bother me but was enough of an issue that it did catch my attention. If looking for something to hold onto for a while it would appear BMW is no longer a good choice.

[WolfpackS2k]

Originally Posted by TorontoNat

Open dif... Boooooo

However any M car is better than a brz in every way (Makes sense given the price point). Can't compare non-M bmws to M models and I don't mean the M they slap in front of any 240 340 440 ect.. M2 is the only car I've driven that feels tighter than a frs.

Also reliability not the greatest on non-M Bmws. They are lease cars for sure. M models different story altogether.

I'm not sure if you meant M models were more reliable or less. However, they're definitely NOT more reliable. There hasn't been an M model built in the last 15 years that hasn't had an expensive engine flaw (Can't include latest M cars into that category yet because they're not old enough).

Originally Posted by tennisfreak

The Cayman is absolutely great but there is ZERO storage space for anything.

Well that's absolutely false. Sure, you can't fold down a rear seat to double the size of your trunk (a la BRZ) but the Cayman comes with 2 rather large trunks of it's own. Between it's two trunks you've got around 15 cubic feet of cargo room. The BRZ has 7 in it's trunk (before you fold down the seats - I dunno the volume then). My 987 will swallow 2 softbag sets of golf clubs in it's rear trunk, and have room to spare in the frunk - plenty of space for luggage for 2.

Outside of a Corvette, no other 2 seat sports car has anywhere near as much cargo hauling capability.

[deejaylew]

Originally Posted by WolfpackS2k

I'm not sure if you meant M models were more reliable or less. However, they're definitely NOT more reliable. There hasn't been an M model built in the last 15 years that hasn't had an expensive engine flaw (Can't include latest M cars into that category yet because they're not old enough).



Well that's absolutely false. Sure, you can't fold down a rear seat to double the size of your trunk (a la BRZ) but the Cayman comes with 2 rather large trunks of it's own. Between it's two trunks you've got around 15 cubic feet of cargo room. The BRZ has 7 in it's trunk (before you fold down the seats - I dunno the volume then). My 987 will swallow 2 softbag sets of golf clubs in it's rear trunk, and have room to spare in the frunk - plenty of space for luggage for 2.

Outside of a Corvette, no other 2 seat sports car has anywhere near as much cargo hauling capability.

Your ability to haul anything large is greatly diminished I would assume because you can't connect both storage areas. Probably not on the same level as a BRZ for practicality although I have no experience with a Cayman so i could be (read: I am) speaking completely out of my

[WolfpackS2k]

I mean, yeah man...I mentioned that