My review of the FRS (RW Steer discussion)

[AaronCompNetSys]

TL;DR Underpowered with good handling but artificially enhanced.

Started my trip off right talking with the sales guy, turns out he is a collector to, 7 under his belt. I didn't give much hint about what I knew besides when he asked what I owned. I asked what rev limit to keep it under, he said he didn't think I would hurt it if I maxed it a couple times. He mentioned sport buttons and whatever shift times, which I ignored as I turned everything off. I noticed the steering wheel was way to thick, and I have big hands.

Just leaving the lot, it was apparent that the low down torque was closer to the 2.5 than the 2 liter, and the ride quality was very smooth. The auto trans shifted smoothly and authoritatively. The first couple turns through the lot I noticed something extremely familiar, which I would soon find myself in a big argument with the sales guy about...

Heading to Realto, after I let it warm up, I flicked off the AC and told Lisa, Here we go. I pinned the throttle from a crawl, the trans dutifully jumped to first and as the revs climbed, I waited for that VTEC moment. When the first shift hit right at the redline, I looked at Lisa and she said, "Really, thats it?" Nuff said. This thing doesn't have enough power to rotate the rear, and barely enough to shift the weight around.

Back to the steering. The electric steering was quite apparent but same as what I was used to. Weight was fine, I'm just concerned with how the car handles itself with what grip it has. The trait this car shares with its donor as fault of the suspension is the passive rear wheel steer. This trait is noticeable more in some cars (Impulse RS) and not as much in others, but its a trait Subaru builds into its suspension geometry. The magical reactive steering that you hear people talk about with this car, its because it has a high amount of rear wheel steer. In short: as the suspension compresses, the tire toe changes, inducing a bit of extra yaw. This effect helps make the car feel like its pivoting around its center, but has its limits. Its great for AWD because it helps relieve some of the strain put on the fronts under power. In the FRS, the effect is so strong you feel it on the smallest of inputs.

Here is why it is bad: the limits of passive rear steer. The rears only give you so much free yaw, and as you load and unload the rears it gives and taketh away. This makes for very unpredictable for-aft swapping of grip, keeping you about even understeer and oversteer.

Of course you can learn to deal with it, but I personally don't like it. I prefer to manage yaw myself with for-aft balance and the throttle. Its a trait of a RWD car that I think makes it unique. Taking it from the AWD Subie land and forcing it upon a RWD platform doesn't fit in my opinion.

On the flip side, I think this would be a great car for the beginner to RWD. You can have a bit of yaw inducing fun without actually having to do it yourself.

For an experienced driver, this car would need several mods out the door to provide the complete sports car experience you can get from other brands.

Good try Subaru engineers. I'll stop by again with high hopes next revision. After stepping out of the FRS, I stepped into my S and had a properly fun 2 hour drive with less tire grip (all four tires balding). After Lisa listened to the sales guy blab on about how great the FRS handled, she said I should offer him a ride in mine to see what he's missing.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUJXtk1CPps"]FRS on Rialto - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtMTDg4RkwE"]Rialto Road, West Chester Ohio - YouTube[/ame]

[Thunderchicken]

You say that you can't get the rear to rotate, did you have have traction control on? The way Toyota and Subaru programmed the rear doesn't want to step out, but with it off it will rotate with ease.

[Lonewolf]

People drive the automatic on granny mode and complain there isn't any power...nothing to see here, move along folks...

In other news, the grass is green and the sky is blue

[cgrey]

The S2000 has passive rear steering. In fact, almost every car has passive rear steering. It's not just a Subaru feature, or for AWD cars.

Good try though. I'll stop by again with high hopes next revision.


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ET2hsLLnibI"]amazing car crash - YouTube[/ame]

[Oriental Life]

Originally Posted by AaronCompNetSys

He mentioned sport buttons and whatever shift times, which I ignored as I turned everything off.

End of story, you've waisted your's and our's time.

You turned off traction control but left AT in city-driving mode. Once in a while, listen to others: AT in SPORT and shifter to MANUAL. Then come back here and tell us something new, collector.

[eifer]

Seems like everyone that posts "slow" was driving the AT...

[Lonewolf]

I saw that OP had an s2000 and when he mentioned waiting for VTEC to kick in all I could think about was that Johnny Tran picture from the Fast and the Furious

Found it...

[Oriental Life]

Originally Posted by eifer

Seems like everyone that posts "slow" was driving the AT...

Seems that everyone who posted 'slow' were either coming from far more capable cars or don't know how to read the manual.

[digital_assassin]

Summertime drop top!

[cgrey]

Originally Posted by digital_assassin

Summertime drop top!

I was just thinking about that.

In fact, let's borrow that video:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMf729n5avk"]Asian 350Z Bashing my FR-S/86 - YouTube[/ame]

[eifer]

Originally Posted by Oriental Life

Seems that everyone who posted 'slow' were either coming from far more capable cars or don't know how to read the manual.

True. But I still say it is not that slow. A brand new Audi A4 does 0-60 only slightly faster, and that car starts at 32k. People just need to keep their expectations in line. It's a 25,000 dollar car, not the second coming of Jesus.

[mattles]

lol passive rear steer, thats some good armchair suspension engineering you've got going on there OP. As a professional driver and master suspension engineer yourself, Im sure you can coach Subaru and Toyota in redesigning the suspension to your specifications.

[Snoopyalien24]

Its fine. Let's not bash another's opinion because it doesn't match ours

Everyone is different in various ways. That's why people have DIFFERENT cars rather than a monospec version. Only true review is the one YOU DO on your own and think, how does this feel to ME?

Plenty of happy FRS/BRZ members tearing tracks/AutoX up. Also the most demanded car in Japan right now, so get what ya'll want!

Thanks for your review! Weird the Twins weigh less and they have solid roofs (was just looking around)

[cgrey]

Originally Posted by mattles

lol passive rear steer, thats some good armchair suspension engineering you've got going on there OP. As a professional driver and master suspension engineer yourself, Im sure you can coach Subaru and Toyota in redesigning the suspension to your specifications.

Didn't you see the videos he posted? His evidence is irrefutable. I'm trying to find an S2000 right now because it doesn't have artificially enhanced handling.