In for the long haul Ultimate NA build thread.

[Aztec]

Originally Posted by Dr Speed

Interesting. I'll be surprised to see if you crack much over 210whp. Ill be watching for SAE dyno sheets and the smoothing factor, none of these bs Dyno sheets with STD numbers.

Good luck tho.

205-210whp is easily attainable with the right bolt-ons and E85 on the stock FA20. with the 2.3ltr and the right tune this will be able to be TUNED for much higher whp IMO

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by Dr Speed

Interesting. I'll be surprised to see if you crack much over 210whp. Ill be watching for SAE dyno sheets and the smoothing factor, none of these bs Dyno sheets with STD numbers.

Good luck tho.

Lol people are hitting that with e85 and headers.

[celek]

Originally Posted by Aztec

I like how you slowly just ease a screwdriver into the hole and don't say anything :P

Yeah my day job is a public speaker but I can not stand the sound of my own voice.

[burdickjp]

Originally Posted by celek

Also interesting, I did not know our stock cams were hollow and the lobes pressed on.

That's becoming increasingly common. I interned at a company in Danville, IL which made camshafts like that for Ford, VW, Chrysler, Harley Davidson, and Honda. It's a very cool process.

Sent from my SM-G900M using Tapatalk

[Dr Speed]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Lol people are hitting that with e85 and headers.

Right but what do you think all this extra work will gain? Was the 205 on E85 Tune with Header measured in SAE with a smoothing Factor 5 or was it STD.


I have seen a few of these cars tuned, and while I don't own a BRZ/FRS personally I have seen claims for the car I own where people front manufacturer claims, or present dyno sheets in STD. That's just not accurate.


I'm sure OP will have fun, and I'm tuned in to see final numbers.. but to air on the negative side a bit, I think this will be a lot of work for not a lot of go vs FI vs tune only especially when you look at time, costs and reliability. I have been down this road with other platforms and learned hard lessons... like 7rwhp from a set of cams and $2000 in new parts and hours and hours of my time and trapping .4mph faster with an identical e.t


Honestly 300cc's extra, pistons and a set of cams and ported heads on this engine I would bet might add 10-12hp. Its already making 100hp per liter OEM or about 78-80whp per liter measured at the wheels


FI is getting guys into the 220-230 range conservatively SAE... you might hit that lower number with a full N/A build.

[swarb]

Originally Posted by Dr Speed

Right but what do you think all this extra work will gain? Was the 205 on E85 Tune with Header measured in SAE with a smoothing Factor 5 or was it STD.
If he didn't think it was worth it, he wouldn't be doing it

I have seen a few of these cars tuned, and while I don't own a BRZ/FRS personally I have seen claims for the car I own where people front manufacturer claims, or present dyno sheets in STD. That's just not accurate.


I'm sure OP will have fun, and I'm tuned in to see final numbers.. but to air on the negative side a bit, I think this will be a lot of work for not a lot of go vs FI vs tune only especially when you look at time, costs and reliability. I have been down this road with other platforms and learned hard lessons... like 7rwhp from a set of cams and $2000 in new parts and hours and hours of my time and trapping .4mph faster with an identical e.t

time? he is not in a rush, or it doesn't seem like it.
Cost? his money.
Reliability? should all be there depending on how high rev limit is.

Honestly 300cc's extra, pistons and a set of cams and ported heads on this engine I would bet might add 10-12hp. Its already making 100hp per liter OEM or about 78-80whp per liter measured at the wheels

By your math, 100hp per liter, .3 liter would be 30hp.
160whp stock. 24whp gain(by your math)
Car dynos 155-165 completely stock. header/e85/tune pulls 195-205 or so.
205+ that magical 24hp. 229hp
FI is getting guys into the 220-230 range conservatively SAE... you might hit that lower number with a full N/A build.
it is going to be a full build, so your math works out. I suggest you look at more dyno sheets

response in bold

[Dr Speed]

Originally Posted by swarb

response in bold

You are right my math does work out. I've looked at a lot of dyno sheets. I'm not discrediting the OP. I just finished a full build on another platform similar to what he is doing.


Just adding my two cents.

[200hp/tonne]

All that math didn't even account for the raised rev limit. Assuming he makes 200 Nm torque at crank from the 2.3L at 9000 RPM, we end up with 253 crank BHp, which is quite a lot. With porting and a proper tune, this number should be easy to hit at those revs, as the engine makes more or less 200 Nm stock.

[sato]

Isn't there a Mazda/Ford 2.3L engine (used in racing) that produced almost 300hp?

Sent using Tapatalk

[Snake]

http://www.cosworth.com/products/cra...ratec-engines/

280bhp for the top of the range 2.3ltr

Looks like they run dry sump, ITBs, 13:1 compression and 8500rpm limit.

[Aztec]

@celek What type of gearing are you planning on doing? Any sort of FD swap??

[celek]

Originally Posted by swarb

response in bold

Not to mention everything is exponential.
If all I did was increase displacement to 2.3 liters and left everything else stock you are looking at a 15% increase to a base 230 Crank HP All the other addons work with each other.

[celek]

Originally Posted by Aztec

@celek What type of gearing are you planning on doing? Any sort of FD swap??

Its been considered but I do not want to go too crazy as the increased TQ and Power may not be a good combination of a really high Final Drive like 5.7:1

[celek]

Originally Posted by 200hp/tonne

All that math didn't even account for the raised rev limit. Assuming he makes 200 Nm torque at crank from the 2.3L at 9000 RPM, we end up with 253 crank BHp, which is quite a lot. With porting and a proper tune, this number should be easy to hit at those revs, as the engine makes more or less 200 Nm stock.

Hopefully the meeting with Piper Cams at PRI proves successful. The current Cam profile stock falls flat at 7000 RPM. there is really no reason to go higher unless you have boost. In a NA platform its different you dont want to struggle with acceleration to 9000RPM not making power when you could have shifted to a new gear and be going faster.