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[Ninjin]

Originally Posted by SMOKETREES

Do you see a lot of tire wear or pretty reasonable?

I just checked my street tires (OE). They're pretty even, within 0.5/32nds between inside and outside of the tread (overall they're around 7.5/32nds after 10k miles). My autocross tires are another story, they wear much more on the outside, which is a sign of not enough negative camber (wearing on the inside of the tread would mean the opposite).

Setting camber for performance driving is a matter of the tires' lateral grip capacity and the roll resistance of the suspension setup (spring rates + anti-roll bar rate). Soft setups like mine (stock springs with a modest 20mm FSB) will require more static negative camber to counteract the effects of body roll on the tires' contact patch. Stickier tires will put more force in the suspension, causing more body roll.

Rear negative camber tends to be a compromise, since static camber in the rear will detract from the ability to accelerate (In our RWD cars) and brake in a straight line (front camber affects braking too). Lowering the twins will cause a negative camber gain in the rear, and it's not always even between sides. Without aftermarket parts, it's kind of a crapshoot as to what any particular car will get.

When setting camber for street driving, driving style is probably a much bigger influence, since you won't always be driving 10/10ths (hopefully). If the car is driven in straight lines all day on the freeway the camber wear will show up much more than a car that sees a lot of aggressive cornering.

I hope this helps give you an idea of how to proceed with your setup. A controlled environment can be great for fine-tuning a setup.

P.S. To really get into this, a discussion of dynamic camber is probably warranted. That's a whole big can of worms. Ugh.

[jeffsides]

Originally Posted by redsuns03

is there any group rides being planned any time soon? I'm excited to meet up with fellow ft86 drivers

There is a BBQ at my place on Sunday the 12th at noon

[SMOKETREES]

Originally Posted by nelsmar

Dont wory about wear at 1-2 degree's. S2000 UK spec was -2 in the rear from the factory which should shed some perspective.

And KSports allow 2 degree in each direction from the center point of mount. This doesn't mean 2 degree's from 0 degree's camber. If you lower the car your wheel tilts in. Which is why the camber plates allow you to camber out 2 degree's as well. All the way in will depend on your ride height for angle. I just had to adjust mine as somehow i managed to push them in at one point and the camber was visually pretty noticeable, and after 1k or so miles i have noticeable inner wear. Its not that much wear but you can see it.

Yeah I went all the way towards the engine so I'm guessing that's - right? And going towards the wheel would be +? But my front have about 5 threads left and the rears have about 41/2 but will be a little lower when I can get to it. I'll just reset one of the mileage things and go 500 miles and take wheel off and check. I mean I have some stretched tires so I bet I'll be okay, we will see tho. I was also looking very carefully on comparing the rear natural camber and the front and it looks pretty much the same nos and never seen tire wear on the rears.

[SMOKETREES]

Gonna go test run in a few minutes and see how much responsive it is

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by SMOKETREES

Yeah I went all the way towards the engine so I'm guessing that's - right? And going towards the wheel would be +? But my front have about 5 threads left and the rears have about 41/2 but will be a little lower when I can get to it. I'll just reset one of the mileage things and go 500 miles and take wheel off and check. I mean I have some stretched tires so I bet I'll be okay, we will see tho. I was also looking very carefully on comparing the rear natural camber and the front and it looks pretty much the same nos and never seen tire wear on the rears.

You only have 5 threads on the coillover before the cup touches the spring perch? Thats fairly low hah. I am only about 1/3 the way down on mine, i just measured the height to an evenlevel and aimed for 1-2" lower (though a tad higher to compensate for spring sag). The will sag fairly quick 100-500 miles and you should be g2g. Now that mine has leveled out i am going to go get an alignment reading and adjust the rear until im somewhere in the ballpark i want, then adjust the ride height in the front to match & send it off to get the front aligned.

And yes in towards the engine = negative camber.

it also depends on how you adjusted the bolt on the lower side for camber. i pushed mine all the way in and then pulled my camber plates out. It sounds like you pushed it out. I went with the mindset that if it wasn't completely tight (although i used a torque wrench) that it would likely push more in (towards negative camber). I need to hit up Kos and get me some new bolts.

[SMOKETREES]

Originally Posted by nelsmar

You only have 5 threads on the coillover before the cup touches the spring perch? Thats fairly low hah. I am only about 1/3 the way down on mine, i just measured the height to an evenlevel and aimed for 1-2" lower (though a tad higher to compensate for spring sag). The will sag fairly quick 100-500 miles and you should be g2g. Now that mine has leveled out i am going to go get an alignment reading and adjust the rear until im somewhere in the ballpark i want, then adjust the ride height in the front to match & send it off to get the front aligned.

And yes in towards the engine = negative camber.

it also depends on how you adjusted the bolt on the lower side for camber. i pushed mine all the way in and then pulled my camber plates out. It sounds like you pushed it out. I went with the mindset that if it wasn't completely tight (although i used a torque wrench) that it would likely push more in (towards negative camber). I need to hit up Kos and get me some new bolts.

Haha yeah and I wanna go lower but will wait until the sag has settled in. The rears def need to be lowered a tad more to complete the look I'm going for and then it'll be off to the alignment shop. Any recommendations?

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by SMOKETREES

Haha yeah and I wanna go lower but will wait until the sag has settled in. The rears def need to be lowered a tad more to complete the look I'm going for and then it'll be off to the alignment shop. Any recommendations?

Just remember you cant adjust the rear.... well anything. And things change the lower you go. If you aren't horribly concerned with performance low is fine. I Just wanted a subtle drop and the ability to adjust my damper & slight spring change my self. I really like how my rear looks right now but im going to guess that i wont win and ill have to raise it haha. I just hate the wheel offset!!

I was going to go to network alignment as they do free check & then i think its 10$ extra for lowered cars and its not terribly expensive. I was going to do this so i could get it checked and then go home and adjust my rear to get hopefully close to 1.5-2 degrees negative camber. (depending on the toe in).

But then i realized toyota near me has an alignment rack and my friend works there so I am going to just set an appointment there.

[nelsmar]

P.S. you mentioned stretched tires... if your on OEM wheels i wouldn't worry about rubbing on anything unless you dropped the car excessively. The offset is beyond conservative on this car. And our wells are fairly clean with good clearance.

[Ninjin]

Originally Posted by SMOKETREES

Yeah I went all the way towards the engine so I'm guessing that's - right? And going towards the wheel would be +? But my front have about 5 threads left and the rears have about 41/2 but will be a little lower when I can get to it. I'll just reset one of the mileage things and go 500 miles and take wheel off and check. I mean I have some stretched tires so I bet I'll be okay, we will see tho. I was also looking very carefully on comparing the rear natural camber and the front and it looks pretty much the same nos and never seen tire wear on the rears.

If you have a level you can get a pretty good idea of how much camber you have. Hold the level against the bottom lip of the wheel and use the bubble to make sure it's vertical. While holding it vertical, measure the distance between the top lip of the wheel and the edge of the level. Plug that distance into: arctan(distH/distV). distH is the horizontal distance between the level and the wheel at the top, and distV is the vertical distance between the point on the bottom of the wheel that touches the level and the top point that is measured to (essentially the diameter of the wheel as measured, not the spec diameter). If I take the values measured on my car I can plug them into google like so: arctan(-0.42/21) in degrees, I can see that I have about -1.15 degrees of camber.

It's not going to be as accurate as an alignment rack, but it's a lot cheaper if you already have the tools, and you can get pretty close with a steady hand and a keen eye.

[Accurate Race Shop]

So I was on the AZsolo forums and there is a bunch of new to us and very strict rules for road course autoX. I have asked for them so I can either post a link or email them. Spinning out and going off track will be an Extreme DNF from what I'm seeing.

Also this is what @thesleeper looks like giving directions

And this is what @Sivtec looks like when he is lost lol

[mattles]

alright, signed up for the AMP special event. DDDD


edit: yea typically the rules are much more strict during special events, and AMP is doubly so. Id assume 2 wheels off is an extreme DNF, maybe even asked to leave but 4 wheels off even once is your cue to go home.

Its really not that bad, but as a novice myself I will definitely be asking for an instructor for my first lap at the very least

[Evil86]

Originally Posted by Ninjin

1 deg is probably good for regular or slightly aggressive driving, 1.5 - 2 is better for spirited or track driving. I have about 1 degree now and it's not enough.

Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

I can get about 4 degrees, it looks purty.

[Ninjin]

Originally Posted by Evil86

I can get about 4 degrees, it looks purty.

Yeah your autocross tires are wearing great, but you may want to consider flipping your street tires

[Evil86]

Originally Posted by Ninjin

Yeah your autocross tires are wearing great, but you may want to consider flipping your street tires

I have the camber and toe set for street now, besides I will have an excuse to put on rivals for daily driving.