HPDE: Where, When and Who With?

[WORKS]

Hello FT86 Club!

WORKS will be at Sonoma Raceway for the NASA HPDE event on March 15th & 16th.

We will be performing free HPDE tech inspections at our shop located at the top of the hill by the go-kart track, or just stop by and hang out!

Happy driving and see you there!

[buzznasa]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Who is doing NorCal 86cup on mar 22?

Trying my best to make it happen! Also, does anyone know if you have to be qualified for Open group to complete in 86Cup?

[PMok]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Who is doing NorCal 86cup on mar 22?

I'll be there

Originally Posted by buzznasa

Trying my best to make it happen! Also, does anyone know if you have to be qualified for Open group to complete in 86Cup?

I believe NCRC wants 86Cup participants to run in either Point By or Open. Typically they suggest you have 7-8 events under your belt before they move someone from Solo to Point By, but it really can/should be looked at on an individual basis by NCRC, you could potentially move up much quicker.

[MyRx]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Who is doing NorCal 86cup on mar 22?

I'll be there as well.

Originally Posted by buzznasa

Trying my best to make it happen! Also, does anyone know if you have to be qualified for Open group to complete in 86Cup?

To qualify for open group, you can either have so many track days under your belt or contact NCRC and ask them to clear you, which may include a ride along by an instructor the next time you are at the track (with NCRC).

At the moment, March 22 looks to be full so any late sign-ups will be pooled onto the waiting list. April 12/13 and so on appears accommodating tho.

I'm planning on bunking near or around Buttonwillow on April 12/13. So if anyone wants to share a room Saturday night, let me know.

[orthojoe]

Originally Posted by buzznasa

Trying my best to make it happen! Also, does anyone know if you have to be qualified for Open group to complete in 86Cup?

Originally Posted by PMok

I believe NCRC wants 86Cup participants to run in either Point By or Open. Typically they suggest you have 7-8 events under your belt before they move someone from Solo to Point By, but it really can/should be looked at on an individual basis by NCRC, you could potentially move up much quicker.

Originally Posted by MyRx

To qualify for open group, you can either have so many track days under your belt or contact NCRC and ask them to clear you, which may include a ride along by an instructor the next time you are at the track (with NCRC).

In keeping with my reputation of being the 'wet blanket' around here:

I understand that you guys want as much participation as possible to make the event a success, but you should NOT be encouraging someone that only has ONE event under his belt to participate in this kind of activity. You're going to have people trying to move up run groups when they shouldn't be. You're going to have people trying to push their cars when they still don't know fundamentals, lines, or bail outs. You're going to cause an accident. This has to be the single worst sport I've seen where testosterone and ego drives people to do the dumbest things. I will tell you, if people start running this event that don't have the proper experience, the chances are MUCH greater that someone will lose their car into the wall at turn 15 than someone running a 2:04.

I'm sure this comes as a relief for some (because I'm such a cynic), but I will be specifically avoiding any 86cup events because of the mayhem I predict will be happening from people wanting to run in the event who should not be.

Safety and fundamentals first.

[EAGLE5]

From what I saw, NCRC isn't big on moving people up. There was one guy in my solo run group awhile ago who was fast, and I mean fast. I mean oh my goodness was he fast. That late 80s Integra defied physics. He was also inexperienced on the track, and after asking and getting a ride along, he wasn't allowed to move up.

NCRC appear pretty conservative so I would trust what they have to say.

Originally Posted by orthojoe

In keeping with my reputation of being the 'wet blanket' around here:

I understand that you guys want as much participation as possible to make the event a success, but you should NOT be encouraging someone that only has ONE event under his belt to participate in this kind of activity. You're going to have people trying to move up run groups when they shouldn't be. You're going to have people trying to push their cars when they still don't know fundamentals, lines, or bail outs. You're going to cause an accident. This has to be the single worst sport I've seen where testosterone and ego drives people to do the dumbest things. I will tell you, if people start running this event that don't have the proper experience, the chances are MUCH greater that someone will lose their car into the wall at turn 15 than someone running a 2:04.

I'm sure this comes as a relief for some (because I'm such a cynic), but I will be specifically avoiding any 86cup events because of the mayhem I predict will be happening from people wanting to run in the event who should not be.

Safety and fundamentals first.

[orthojoe]

Originally Posted by jsimon7777

From what I saw, NCRC isn't big on moving people up. There was one guy in my solo run group awhile ago who was fast, and I mean fast. I mean oh my goodness was he fast. That late 80s Integra defied physics. He was also inexperienced on the track, and after asking and getting a ride along, he wasn't allowed to move up.

NCRC appear pretty conservative so I would trust what they have to say.

NCRC did the RIGHT thing, not the conservative thing. That tells you A LOT if he was not allowed to be moved up and he was fast. He obviously didn't have good track awareness, nor should he be expected to if he is new. When I was checked off for open group, they didn't give a rats ass about how fast I was. They wanted to see how I moved through the track, and how I handled oncoming traffic up front AND behind. THAT is what is important, and what is being forgotten when people try to advance too quickly. I've seen people in point by that still don't even know what the FLAGS mean. That is messed up and should not happen! Moving up a run group does NOT mean you are fast. In fact, being fast is on the BOTTOM of the checklist for moving up a run group. I hope you understand why that is.

[AyJay]

Originally Posted by orthojoe

I understand that you guys want as much participation as possible to make the event a success, but you should NOT be encouraging someone that only has ONE event under his belt to participate in this kind of activity. Y

+1

[MyRx]

I'll give credit back to the people on doing the right thing, not easily manipulated by any kind of event where their behavior has to change. I think there's more people willing to go home in their car than to do harm at the track.

You're right about testosterone and egos. However, due to the nature of THIS sport, I've experienced more humbling personalities than I have of egotistical ones. That or I care not to share my space with those.

Give credit where credit is due, you're right. This event or anything like it should not be the influence of your own progress. But rather play blind on the track lap after lap after lap, what about having a tool to guide you on your way - that being endless opps to be instructor-led or simple honest criticism of what track gods would look for. Reading between the lines of your posts, I do appreciate your comments on what NCRC looks for regarding bump-ups. Those comments may not be published but by only those who's experienced it and I'm sure if I called NCRC, he can go and on and on about his criteria. I have spoken to NCRC and he sounds dead serious about bump-ups. I'd hate to say he'll put anyone in harms way for this event or any other event NCRC has hosted. However, I have heard horrible stories with other track venues, let alone experienced them myself. NCRC never seems to fall into those stories or I guess I haven't heard enough. I have 101% confidence that NCRC will do that right thing. And the drivers will do the right thing. The 86Cup was never intended to be a race-program. You are knocking on the wrong door if you think you've come to a race school.

[buzznasa]

It won't crush my hopes to not get into the 86Cup. I would still go just to get into point-by and get more track time under my belt. I won't go into my past driving/racing experience because it wasn't with NCRC so they wouldn't know me from someone else off the street. I can always participate in 86Cup next year and hopefully a few others in my position will do the same so that we have more drivers. I just want to get more time on the track because, in all honesty, I enjoy much more than AutoX (which I still do).

@orthojoe is absolutely correct in statements regarding this and it is always welcome to have a voice of reason to make sure that no one gets hurts. Good on ya, mate.

[PMok]

yeah, I don't think we're suggesting that any novices should be encouraged to move up into the point by group before they're ready just so they can participate. That is in the end up to NCRC, the organization we trust to enforce the rules and regs and ensure safety for all. In my experiences with them, they are far more safety-minded than other organizations I've run on track with, and that's why I choose to run with them and not others.

For what its worth, in SoCal they let novices and first-timers participate in 86CUP there and offer instruction for free. As far as I know, and correct me if I'm wrong, no one there has met with catastrophic consequences. I think for now the series is meant to be a light-hearted, hey let's go out and have fun and compare lap times with friends kind of thing, not a hard core knock-down-drag-out fight for trackday supremacy. Everyone wants to go home with their cars and egos intact.

What I would encourage is, for novices interested in joining us, to get out there and start doing track days, with instructors if needed, in order to get that experience, learn the fundamentals, and gain that situational awareness, to the point that they do feel confident to ask NCRC to do a ride along and clear them to move up to the appropriate level. If nothing else, perhaps the existence of this kind of series is motivation for people sitting on the fence, maybe this sounds like fun to them and it will get them to come out and do more track days.

[buzznasa]

Originally Posted by MyRx

I'll be there as well.



To qualify for open group, you can either have so many track days under your belt or contact NCRC and ask them to clear you, which may include a ride along by an instructor the next time you are at the track (with NCRC).

At the moment, March 22 looks to be full so any late sign-ups will be pooled onto the waiting list. April 12/13 and so on appears accommodating tho.

I'm planning on bunking near or around Buttonwillow on April 12/13. So if anyone wants to share a room Saturday night, let me know.

I would be down to split a room and save a few bucks.

[icemang17]

I will be there for the 86cup....in my bone stock FRS.....

Regarding NCRC rules and new drivers participating in it....I will be clear....no new driver to any track-DE event will "win" anything...its not possible....there is FAR too much to learn for your first several DE's before you can safely go fast...its just not possible...many drivers are self proclaimed experts...good drifters or autox guys...its not the same.....the big track is much different...drivers that let their ego of the fact that they have X-Y-Z mods and their car is SO much better than that guys..are destined to drive above their ability and that always ends badly...life lessons are rarely painless or cheap...I personally have seen 4 997 GT3's rolled and destroyed at Thunderhill...if the driver of a $130k car can ruin it...so can YOU

With that said...show up with an open mind willing to learn..listen to drivers with experience...listen to your instructors and take small steps towards the limit....there is NO mod you can buy that will help you for the 1st several days....the DRIVER is key...improving the driver is the best investment you will ever make...

I will be instructing in drivers school on Saturday, while we are running the 86cup. One thing I am 100% sure of after doing DE and racing with NCRC for YEARS....the rules are strict and straight forward....if you are driving beyond your limit or what instructors KNOW is your limit...your day will be short and you will be unhappy. LISTEN and learn....if you scare an instructor out of your passenger seat that is NOT a good thing...

I have ridden with-instructed our members before....I was impressed with sw20kosh's driving when I rode with him last year....his mods did work and made sense....given his ability on track... I am sure he is much better now....

I am available to ride with -instruct in solo or point by groups on Saturday...I am running Open in my racer & FRS... I will also run all day on Sunday as well... I am in Shop 17 up by the dyno.....look for my red FRS or my white #51 Porsche 928 racer.... I am willing to help anyone willing to learn.

[MyRx]

Originally Posted by buzznasa

I would be down to split a room and save a few bucks.

Cool. We'll talk.