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[captain_jack]

Originally Posted by Cross

Looks like in between trying my hand at doing our taxes tonight I will be installing these bad boys! OFH arrived!



Sent from Spaceball 1

Wouldn't that be THIS bad boy technically....lol sweet lots of stuff going on this weekend then between you and I we are busy!

may the schwartz be with you....

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by Juggles

How about ride height...lowered at all? I'm looking at the same size but am lowered..would like 245s all around but really don't want any rub

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Me and keith are both lowered. Keith is lower than me. My rear coilovers are near maxed out. I have very little fender gap i want to say the edge of my rear tire is near even height wise with my fender.

[nelsmar]

Finally got a stock car on a dyno today HOORAY! I was doing a baseline tune before he installs a JDL EL header to see what kind of power we actually gain. I ran out of time on the dyno and even payed some out of my pocket to see what I could pull out... Hoping with a bit more time on the dyno I can get a tiny more power in the mid RPM area.



roughly +30WHP @ 7,000RPM gained. Baseline was 137WHP.

[Cross]

Where the baseline dyno or overlay? (This is a question you normally ask others)

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by Cross

Where the baseline dyno or overlay? (This is a question you normally ask others)

... there are two plots on that image I just posted look again. The baseline is the thin line. I forget the WTQ but WHP was 137WHP. I ran multiple passes on the final & base to verify it was consistent. I meant to hand write in the chart its self the baseline WHP/WTQ numbers but I was running almost an hour late to meet someone when we finished up.

[Cross]

Interesting normally they are different colored and part of the key or mentioned guess not here, sorry.
Interesting gains, HP mainly at 4k and above and Trq gains seem to mainly be in the same area.

I would be curious to see this overlay with an E85 tune done in the same manor given Delicious Tuning's results stock with E85.

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by Cross

Interesting normally they are different colored and part of the key or mentioned guess not here, sorry.
Interesting gains, HP mainly at 4k and above and Trq gains seem to mainly be in the same area.

I would be curious to see this overlay with an E85 tun done in the same manor given Delicious Tunings results stock with E85.

If you gain 4WTQ @ at a certain RPM you will se the same % gain in HP at hte same RPM... So yes. And the MAHA has a 4 overlay printout Thick, Thin, Dotted, dashed. I absolutely hate the print outs. Dyno jets are typically used for "bragging" rights to show power gains but are less preferred for actually tuning. Dynojets will color code the output unlike the MAHA. Mustang's iirc also do not altenrate colors and follow a similar style to MAHA dynos plot.

The best thign to do is take the % gain and view that vs the actual outputted numbers. The MAHA LPS 3000 is one of the lowest reading dynos afaik.

[Cross]

Originally Posted by nelsmar

... If you gain 4WTQ @ a certain RPM you will se the same % gain in HP at hte same RPM... So yes. And the MAHA has a 4 overlay printout Thick, Thin, Dotted, dashed. I absolutely hate the print outs. Dyno jets are typically used for "bragging" rights to show power gains but are less preferred for actually tuning. Dynojets will color code the output unlike the MAHA. Mustang's iirc also do not altenrate colors and follow a similar style to MAHA dynos plot.

The best thign to do is take the % gain and view that vs the actual outputted numbers. The MAHA LPS 3000 is one of the lowest reading dynos afaik.

Yes I am familiar with the Maha that's why I at first thought that might be the Flywheel vs Wheel comparison since it was not labeled as another Dyno Run in the Key.

Gains are not always so transparent to a % being the same as you generalized but nm it will go the wrong direction.

As for colors used and the old DynoJet vs Mustang vs Others Debate its very widely known Dynojet is friendlier. However its also known Mustang Dyno's can be setup to read like a Dynojet as well. Its pretty much a mute point, I was not saying the numbers were low, just I would like to see it compared to E85 in the manor that Delicious Tuning did.

As for coloring, shouldn't be to hard to change colors and I would have to go look at some of my Mustang Dyno runs but I have never heard of a tuner feeling any dyno was less capable for tuning when 70% or more is done before hitting the dyno... They use the dyno for fine tuning. As an example NicD doesn't care the brand of Dyno nor does he recommend one over the other. Considering he has tuned more 900+ HP cars right here in AZ I think his lack of preference says a lot.

Either way good to see some further information out there, should do a comparison with all the other tunes for similar setups or even Stage 1 claimed tunes as a few members with mainly just drop in filters here in the AZ section are running. Would be interesting to see that as well.

[nelsmar]

Youll have to explain a bit more what you mean on the last paragraph. And could you link me to what you are talking about with delicious?

And almost every tuner I know prefers dynos other than dynojet for actual tuning. Once they finish their tunes they typically go to a dynojet just for final numbers.

On the Maha it will list engine power. I didn't plot that as it confuses a lot of people. And there is no way in the Maha software to change hte colors. I absolutely hate the maha software, the dyno its self on the other hand? Love it! It seems more consitent between pulls than the mustang I use and easier to read. But I am okay with using pretty much whatever. The maha is just my personal preference I just hate what it cost to rent it

[Cross]

Originally Posted by captain_jack

Wouldn't that be THIS bad boy technically....lol sweet lots of stuff going on this weekend then between you and I we are busy!

may the schwartz be with you....

LOL Yes it would be, I have been working on the Vette and now RX7 to much, to many V8's. But I do have to remove one header to install the other so...

But either way after playing with taxes and reading more than I ever wanted to on taxes... I am just going to pay someone else to do this lol. Now I know why I am not an accountant.

[Cross]

Originally Posted by nelsmar

Youll have to explain a bit more what you mean on the last paragraph. And could you link me to what you are talking about with delicious?

And almost every tuner I know prefers dynos other than dynojet for actual tuning. Once they finish their tunes they typically go to a dynojet just for final numbers.

On the Maha it will list engine power. I didn't plot that as it confuses a lot of people. And there is no way in the Maha software to change hte colors. I absolutely hate the maha software, the dyno its self on the other hand? Love it! It seems more consitent between pulls than the mustang I use and easier to read. But I am okay with using pretty much whatever. The maha is just my personal preference I just hate what it cost to rent it

You have mentioned Delicious's 200WHP E85 Stock Car before unless I am mistaken, but here is the link either way.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55591

[Ninjin]

Sometimes I wish dyno plots didn't show HP, it's not a particularly useful metric. Most good dynos (that use load measuring) measure the torque output and calculate the horsepower for the graph. This is great because torque is a better measurement of what's going on in the engine, and the ability to accurately measure and control engine load is an invaluable tool for tuning.

Inertia-type dynos like dynojets measure the rotation of a fixed load for a horsepower number and do a calculation for torque. They're nice for bragging numbers because 1. they read high and 2. They read consistently due to fewer variables to calibrate. Definitely not as nice for tuning though.

In short, it's probably best to use a dyno that directly measures torque and only look at that.

As for this particular graph, it's rare to see dyno pulls start at 1500 RPM, and that really shows how bad the stock torque dip is. I'd say an intake might help, but my dyno with stock headers and a TRD intake looked a lot like this one. (except slightly *less* power!)

[nelsmar]

Originally Posted by Cross

You have mentioned Delicious's 200WHP E85 Stock Car before unless I am mistaken, but here is the link either way.
http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55591

Nope never mentioned it. Are you saying post it publicly in a review fashion? If so I plan to once I get the final dyno done. JDL should have Colton's header done tomorrow and I will be street tuning it this week and getting it on the dyno ASAP.

[Cross]

Originally Posted by nelsmar

Nope never mentioned it. Are you saying post it publicly in a review fashion? If so I plan to once I get the final dyno done. JDL should have Colton's header done tomorrow and I will be street tuning it this week and getting it on the dyno ASAP.

No I mean since they are on a different dyno and location obviously I would like to see a Stock E85 vs Stock 91 tune in AZ on the same dyno. But since at this point thats not possible I was curious about the Trq dip and gains vs E85 but knew the point of it not being fair would come up so I threw it up more as a conversational piece.