P0018 - what a disappointment this car has become

[Semicolon]

Being a brand new member and having just bought a 2012 86 I am now seriously worried about my purchase.

Took it for a service at Toyota and they replaced the ECU under warranty (TSB i guess?) even though the car is outside of warranty by 6months.

So when the vvt mechanism fails and the car is running on 4psi oil pressure, even low rpm will destroy then engine? :/

I have got a CEL twice now, P0351, so luckily a bad coil or sparkplug.

This makes me worried as an engine rebuild is not something you bargain on a car with just 30k miles.

ps. sorry for the off topic post.

[Boofneenee]

Originally Posted by Semicolon

Being a brand new member and having just bought a 2012 86 I am now seriously worried about my purchase.

Took it for a service at Toyota and they replaced the ECU under warranty (TSB i guess?) even though the car is outside of warranty by 6months.

So when the vvt mechanism fails and the car is running on 4psi oil pressure, even low rpm will destroy then engine? :/

I have got a CEL twice now, P0351, so luckily a bad coil or sparkplug.

This makes me worried as an engine rebuild is not something you bargain on a car with just 30k miles.

ps. sorry for the off topic post.

I don't know what to think anymore man. You really shouldn't go on worried about failure just like you shouldn't worry about flying because of terrorists.

Yet, you read these forums and you hAve your own personal mishaps making it difficult to ignore the warning signs.

Boosting your cat significantly increases the risks. I wouldn't do that with earlier generation models.

[Boofneenee]

Originally Posted by mav1178

I stand by my previous statement, that you have a poor understanding of how TSBs work.

Whatever man, I get the vibe your upset I got my car repaired under warranty and that's just shitty. We are all in this together on the forums supporting and like each other's cars.

Should you ever pop one of these common codes like p0018 and it be a big issue I hope the dealer does you right.

[mav1178]

Originally Posted by Boofneenee

Whatever man, I get the vibe your upset I got my car repaired under warranty and that's just shitty. We are all in this together on the forums supporting and like each other's cars.

Should you ever pop one of these common codes like p0018 and it be a big issue I hope the dealer does you right.

I'm upset? I think you need to go back and re-read what I wrote.

I've been dealing with various forums for 20 years now... if there's one common thread I've seen across all the different enthusiast forums, it's that car owners have a general poor understanding of how warranty and TSBs work, and how to have their problems fixed in a manner that benefits everyone involved.

TSBs are issued to fix specific issues that the manufacturer has pinpointed. It may or may not apply to warranty issues, so you can't just take a TSB and say "it covers my warranty claim"

But you can think whatever you want about this. I'm just pointing out the fact that your situation is not covered under the powertrain warranty.

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Semicolon

Being a brand new member and having just bought a 2012 86 I am now seriously worried about my purchase.

Took it for a service at Toyota and they replaced the ECU under warranty (TSB i guess?) even though the car is outside of warranty by 6months.

So when the vvt mechanism fails and the car is running on 4psi oil pressure, even low rpm will destroy then engine? :/

I have got a CEL twice now, P0351, so luckily a bad coil or sparkplug.

This makes me worried as an engine rebuild is not something you bargain on a car with just 30k miles.

ps. sorry for the off topic post.

Hello Semicolon and welcome to our group .......

If your car is running OK, I'd suggest you just perform the scheduled maintenance and drive it.

One can get paranoid when reading about all of the problems other people seem to be having with their cars.

If your car gets sick ...... it will show you light on the dashboard and that will lead you to a code which explains the problem.

Meanwhile, I suggest you just drive and enjoy your machine .....


humfrz

[Semicolon]

Hello, thank you!

Yeah this morning to work it was pure bliss running it through the revs.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Semicolon

Hello, thank you!

Yeah this morning to work it was pure bliss running it through the revs.

Exactly. Just have fun and don't give too much importance on the "experts" over here. If something goes wrong, the dealer will fix it for you. Not the internet, not the forums.

[guybo]

Reading the forums will get you paranoid in a hurry. Intern's disease...

Remember, most people never mess with their car or tune it and most people never have a lick of problems with this car. Check out https://www.truedelta.com/Scion-FR-S/reliability-1096 and see how good the FRS reliability is (the BRZ numbers are very similar) and for a TUNER car, these numbers are astoundingly good for reliability. On here are a lot of amateur mechanics and DIY tuners and guys who push the envelope. On here, there are enthusiasts and that's why you hear about problems. There's one thread for posting about how you have not had a prob with your car today, thousands for problems you have had. People don't come to internet forums to discuss how well thier car is doing, they come online to diagnose problems.

Relax.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

Exactly. Just have fun and don't give too much importance on the "experts" over here. If something goes wrong, the dealer will fix it for you. Not the internet, not the forums.

Except when they won't because your warranty ran out, you fucked with the car or you drove the living crap out of it until it broke. why should they fix it under those conditions? Do people think warranty repairs are free? We all pay for those repairs in some manner.

Originally Posted by guybo

Reading the forums will get you paranoid in a hurry. Intern's disease...

Remember, most people never mess with their car or tune it and most people never have a lick of problems with this car. Check out https://www.truedelta.com/Scion-FR-S/reliability-1096 and see how good the FRS reliability is (the BRZ numbers are very similar) and for a TUNER car, these numbers are astoundingly good for reliability. On here are a lot of amateur mechanics and DIY tuners and guys who push the envelope. On here, there are enthusiasts and that's why you hear about problems. There's one thread for posting about how you have not had a prob with your car today, thousands for problems you have had. People don't come to internet forums to discuss how well thier car is doing, they come online to diagnose problems.

Relax.

This is exactly the type of thread that spreads the paranoia.

[nikitopo]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Except when they won't because your warranty ran out, you fucked with the car or you drove the living crap out of it until it broke. why should they fix it under those conditions? Do people think warranty repairs are free? We all pay for those repairs in some manner.


This is exactly the type of thread that spreads the paranoia.

Oh no, I didn't mean about fixes within guarantee. It was a general statement.

For me paranoia is to not follow the advise of your dealer and follow someone on the internet that you don't know anything about him. Then if something goes wrong, to go back to the dealer pretending that you didn't change anything (because you feel guilty or you want to cheat) and then request for a fix (within or outside guarantee). Even if someone thinks that the change was irrelevant with the problem, it is not his job to decide. It is the job of the dealer.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

Oh no, I didn't mean about fixes within guarantee. It was a general statement.

For me paranoia is to not follow the advise of your dealer and follow someone on the internet that you don't know anything about him. Then if something goes wrong, to go back to the dealer pretending that you didn't change anything (because you feel guilty or you want to cheat) and then request for a fix (within or outside guarantee). Even if someone thinks that the change was irrelevant with the problem, it is not his job to decide. It is the job of the dealer.

Exactly!

[Yardjass]

Originally Posted by nikitopo

Oh no, I didn't mean about fixes within guarantee. It was a general statement.

For me paranoia is to not follow the advise of your dealer and follow someone on the internet that you don't know anything about him. Then if something goes wrong, to go back to the dealer pretending that you didn't change anything (because you feel guilty or you want to cheat) and then request for a fix (within or outside guarantee). Even if someone thinks that the change was irrelevant with the problem, it is not his job to decide. It is the job of the dealer.

I mean, my dealer service advisor told me when challenged on the topic that the transmission fluid doesn't need to be changed at 22,5 or anywhere near that even though it says exactly that in the vendor literature that comes with the car. I'm sure it had more to do with them not wanting to do it since I bought it certified used at around 23,000 and it should have already been done. Still, I changed it myself not long after since they wouldn't and it cleared up most of my rough shifting into second. A "trust but verify" policy on these cars really is your best bet because a lot of dealers out there can't even follow their own factory recommendations.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Yardjass

I mean, my dealer service advisor told me when challenged on the topic that the transmission fluid doesn't need to be changed at 22,5 or anywhere near that even though it says exactly that in the vendor literature that comes with the car. I'm sure it had more to do with them not wanting to do it since I bought it certified used at around 23,000 and it should have already been done. Still, I changed it myself not long after since they wouldn't and it cleared up most of my rough shifting into second. A "trust but verify" policy on these cars really is your best bet because a lot of dealers out there can't even follow their own factory recommendations.

Where does it say the fluid needs to be changed at 22? I see an inspect at 22 not a change. In fact there is no "Change" required at any point for the MT all the services just show inspect and change if required.


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/attac...2&d=1449790739

[TrqlessWonder]

Originally Posted by Yardjass

I mean, my dealer service advisor told me when challenged on the topic that the transmission fluid doesn't need to be changed at 22,5 or anywhere near that even though it says exactly that in the vendor literature that comes with the car. I'm sure it had more to do with them not wanting to do it since I bought it certified used at around 23,000 and it should have already been done. Still, I changed it myself not long after since they wouldn't and it cleared up most of my rough shifting into second. A "trust but verify" policy on these cars really is your best bet because a lot of dealers out there can't even follow their own factory recommendations.

This plays into a lot of why dealers declare that the warranty doesn't apply, and why it's a dealer-specific issue. I mean sure, manufacturers don't like paying claims, but it takes a special regional rep douchebag to go around checking autocross entry lists.

First, it wasn't 6 grand. Dealer is trying to make you think they did you a solid. So you come back.

Why would a dealer want to deny coverage without even submitting a mfr claim? Money. Pure and simple. They're a business, and you're a mark...er...sales lead.

As a private customer without warranty coverage, doing all manner of diagnostic work, they get paid by you, at $hop rate, and the meter just keeps running. Oh, and any parts they replace? Guess who pays for those? Did I mention there's a (hefty) markup? Not in warranty, you're a gold mine.

Mfr claim? Agreed-upon rates. Flat rate work, usually an amount of billable time that most mechanics can't pull off (at least, not without cutting corners). So, mechanics don't make money on it. They really don't like doing that work. Lots of places doing takata airbags that are only getting paid for 12 minutes. Parts get paid at lower-than-retail. The service advisor's pay is at least partially dependent on commission. They can't make margin on parts, labor hours, or labor rate against what the mfr will agree to pay. So, they have incentive to make it the consumer's problem. If that's not enough, the service or general manager will push for that too. I mean, you don't think the poor guy doing the work is actually getting $95/hr do you?

One of those scenarios makes the service advisor's and mechanic's week. The other makes them wonder why they got out of bed. It's not like they're unicef.

And that's why it's fairly pervasive, but generally dealer-specific. Not every last one of them is run in a dishonest fashion. Find a cooperative dealer. Keep sending them your business.