Wrecked FR-S Crash Already - Not Mine

[Deslock]

COTD at Jalopnik:

Originally Posted by Tohru Rokuno, B-Body Aficionado

Man, for that kind of money, he could've crashed a V6 Mustang.

[R8]

Originally Posted by ZDan

The few times I have experienced stability controls or traction control in other cars, I felt it was overly/unnecessarily intrusive.

You found stability control intrusive while driving on public roads?

[blur]

I get the feeling a recall is coming...

[ashtray]

Originally Posted by R8

You found stability control intrusive while driving on public roads?

In my BMW, if you wanted to accelerate quickly from a stop, you needed to turn off traction control. If you didn't, it would detect wheel slip and reduce engine power making your acceleration slower than your normal acceleration. (ie, it over compensated and hitting the gas harder just made you accelerate slower). In that car, turning off the system was needed on the streets in certain circumstances.

I still find the FRS' system allows enough slip as to not interfere with normal street driving when left full on.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by R8

You found stability control intrusive while driving on public roads?

Entering a corner in my mom's DTS at 7/10ths on a rural road, the system tried its best to straighten the car out and point it straight off the road. Not a huge deal, but it definitely cost me a few tenths...

[Max Schnell]

Originally Posted by ashtray

In my BMW, if you wanted to accelerate quickly from a stop, you needed to turn off traction control. If you didn't, it would detect wheel slip and reduce engine power making your acceleration slower than your normal acceleration. (ie, it over compensated and hitting the gas harder just made you accelerate slower). In that car, turning off the system was needed on the streets in certain circumstances.

because you know, as a BMW driver you must not lose at the merging lane drags!
No BMW ever lose at anything!

[Frost]

I'm kinda shocked at home many people replying to this post keep insisting traction control systems make them worse drivers. If you are on public roads, I don't see any single CONCRETE counterpoint as to how traction control doesn't help you. I've seen:

1- TRAC doesn't let you accelerate heavily off the line. Why are you doing this on public roads? This ain't no drag strip.

2- TRAC doesn't straighten out the car properly on a fishtail. Why were you fishtailing in the first place? Probably because you were driving too fast? I'd really like to know. I've fishtailed in FWD, RWD and AWDs before and all were because I misjudged the situation. All 100% driver fault or at least majority driver fault and I'm a better driver now because I know it as opposed to say "well, it was the CPU error".

That's a load of crap guys / gals. If you don't admit a mistake, you'll never learn.

On the track however, TRAC is annoying since you ARE trying to go to 10/10ths of the limit and that's about the only time I would even think let alone suggest turning it off. People are in such a hurry to prove they are good drivers they forget to drive in the first place.

The racing motto: "To finish first you must first finish" always applies.

[Turbowned]

I don't like electronic nannies controlling my driving inputs but to be honest I'm too lazy to shut them off every time I get in the car. Only when I go to the track or auto-x course would I bother to shut them off.

[JohnnyR]

First, glad the driver's ok. So much for being able to enjoy the car's capabilities at "legal speeds" thus why I don't want a more powerful car arguments from here on out. j/k.

Secondly, that is a significant amount of damage for ~20mph.

I don't buy the traction control statements on a 200hp, 151ftlb car at 20mph. I doubt TC/SC would have really mattered as to somehow lose control at that speed, it would have happened anyways, unless the 86s system is incredibly inhibiting.

That looks to be some significant damage. Either the car is that structurally weak (considering the half-wells with the exposed liner in front of the towers in this car) or it was going faster.

Please anyone who buys this car, learn it's dynamics, each car is different. Go to a closed track, a safe area, and explore the behaviors of it. Especially one who hasn't driven a RWD car ever. Despite the car's anemic powerplant, it can apparently still get you into trouble.

So go to a nice safe place, put a cup of water in the holder being careful not to spill it, and learn how to drive it.

[AshWilliams]

Originally Posted by Frost

I'm kinda shocked at home many people replying to this post keep insisting traction control systems make them worse drivers. If you are on public roads, I don't see any single CONCRETE counterpoint as to how traction control doesn't help you. I've seen:

1- TRAC doesn't let you accelerate heavily off the line. Why are you doing this on public roads? This ain't no drag strip.

2- TRAC doesn't straighten out the car properly on a fishtail. Why were you fishtailing in the first place? Probably because you were driving too fast? I'd really like to know. I've fishtailed in FWD, RWD and AWDs before and all were because I misjudged the situation. All 100% driver fault or at least majority driver fault and I'm a better driver now because I know it as opposed to say "well, it was the CPU error".

That's a load of crap guys / gals. If you don't admit a mistake, you'll never learn.

On the track however, TRAC is annoying since you ARE trying to go to 10/10ths of the limit and that's about the only time I would even think let alone suggest turning it off. People are in such a hurry to prove they are good drivers they forget to drive in the first place.

The racing motto: "To finish first you must first finish" always applies.

I know that primitive VSC systems in older cars had a lag time that you could get ahead of and cause MORE problems than an inexperienced driver who would just freeze up.

I had an 01 4Runner that would kick in VSC a second or so AFTER you had corrected a skid and sent you skidding in the opposite direction. Which was really frightening because the VSC-induced pants crapping would happen when you thought you alread had already regained control of the truck.

Good times.

[R8]

Originally Posted by JohnnyR

Please anyone who buys this car, learn it's dynamics, each car is different. Go to a closed track, a safe area, and explore the behaviors of it.

If FR-S buyers need track experience in order to control this car on public roads, either the car is inherently unstable and dangerous... or drivers are doing things they shouldn't be doing on those roads... or both.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by Frost

1- TRAC doesn't let you accelerate heavily off the line. Why are you doing this on public roads? This ain't no drag strip.

Plenty of cars where traction control is overly intrusive and kills power even under "normal" acceleration.

2- TRAC doesn't straighten out the car properly on a fishtail. Why were you fishtailing in the first place? Probably because you were driving too fast? I'd really like to know.

Some stability systems will kick in way before you're *really* hanging the back end out.

Traction control, stability control, ABS, they're all a crutch for the weak.
(^^^intentionally inflammatory statement :P ^^^)
I don't have any of these on my AP1 S2000 (ABS failed a few years back), never any issues driving it over 100k miles through new England winters. Does the back end ever get out a bit in traction-challenged conditions? Yes, but honestly it's never any problem to deal with.

Years of experience on the street and track in the no-computer 250rwhp 240Z. Never wanted or needed traction or stability controls.

The 500hp RX-7 does have functioning ABS, but no traction or stability control.


My preference remains to not have these systems at all, or to at least be able to fully turn them off.

[sho220]

Originally Posted by DantKR

People bitching about insurance: If you're clean and haven't done anything and you have a insurance company worth anything more than the dirt in my yard you'll be fine. Quit fucking complaining.

X2...I had an SRT-4 when they first came out and they were being crashed left and right and my insurance never went up...I'd like to hear from anyone actually in the car insurance game if this practice even goes on...I would be a little peeved if my insurance rates went up because of someone else's asshattery...

[AshWilliams]

Originally Posted by sho220

X2...I had an SRT-4 when they first came out and they were being crashed left and right and my insurance never went up...I'd like to hear from anyone actually in the car insurance game if this practice even goes on...I would be a little peeved if my insurance rates went up because of someone else's asshattery...

Read your statements. They will adjust your premiums up or down depending on the repair costs of the car and if people are wrecking them.

My premiums on my Sierra went up 75 bucks a year because they are damn expensive to fix (and they even itemized it in my statement).

And this is Sate Farm, not some discount crap you get from watching Comedy Central at 3 AM.