Question for BRZ and GT-87 hps?

[OrbitalEllipses]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

i have 140 lb-ft in my car and it pulls just as hard as my friends mustang and hes got 240 lb-ft , hes got 100 more lb-ft and more hp but is slower than me 0-60 and 0-120 60-120 doesnt matter

the weight difference between my car and his is 800lbs that does mean a lot, 151 should be more than enough to make the car fun,

And a Celica GTS should weight approximately 200-300lbs less than this car with just under 10% less peak torque. 151 lb-ft is laughable, admit it.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

And a Celica GTS should weight approximately 200-300lbs less than this car with just under 10% less peak torque. 151 lb-ft is laughable, admit it.

When my car was stock I still beat him, then I had 129lb-ft , gearing is about the same plus the 86 has a much broader powerband than my car...
It is low for a car but good for a 4 banger...

If you don't like the car, why are you here?

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

And a Celica GTS should weight approximately 200-300lbs less than this car with just under 10% less peak torque. 151 lb-ft is laughable, admit it.

Let's put some perspective on this:

The Honda S2000 made 153 and the SUPERCHARGED Lotus Elise made 157.

[serialk11r]

This talk of torque to weight ratio makes me sick, shut up already! :P

[cyde01]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

And a Celica GTS should weight approximately 200-300lbs less than this car with just under 10% less peak torque. 151 lb-ft is laughable, admit it.

if it's laughable why are you still here and why are you still a sucker for this car? what's truly laughable is subaru was just gonna stick the fb20 in there as is until tada insisted on something more powerful, which led to the fa20 being built from scratch.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by MrBonus

Why? Where do you "need" that additional horsepower?

Its funny you say that yet you own a 2012 Boss. I think 444hp is way too much for the streets and you could've gone with a 305 hp v6 with the sport package. To me your post seems like a contradiction.

[SUB-FT86]

I actually own a car with 140tq and I will be the first to say it's weak. The torque is rich in the torque band of my RSX base but it still feels weak when it's hauling 2790 lbs+.

[spin9k]

This car will be fine on track, regardless of the low torque number. The place where it will fall down is 4th gear and up acceleration and resultant top speed. It will be similar to my RX-8... superb on track, esp. tight tracks, or long tracks without much in the way of straights. But anywhere where higher HP cars can stretch their legs, they'll easily show their strength ... outright acceleration at speed ... and you'll be left in the dust. Power rules because drag increase as the cube of speed. 200HP just doesn't go that far countering drag forces. Take these two easy examples....

Say, for the FRS/BRZ if 3HP is needed at 30mph, then 24HP is required at 60mph, but 192HP is needed at 120mph. It's pretty much finished accelerating.

vs. let's take a 350HP Mustang

if 4HP is needed at 30mph, then 32HP is required at 60mph, but only 256HP is needed at 120mph. There's more HP left and it will contiune to accelerate just fine.

Long story short, this car will rock on the twisties, you'll be crying on the long straights.

[cyde01]

the problem with cars that have weak low and mid range is a matter of torque curve more than peak torque numbers. the peak number doesn't really tell the story. from the dynos we've seen, the new 86 has a very flat torque curve, a very good indication. at least drive it for yourself before you knock it.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by cyde01

the problem with cars that have weak low and mid range is a matter of torque curve more than peak torque numbers. the peak number doesn't really tell the story. from the dynos we've seen, the new 86 has a very flat torque curve, a very good indication. at least drive it for yourself before you knock it.

Its not that flat. It actually dips in one of the most important parts of the power band, the mid range. Between 3k-5k rpms there is a nasty dip in torque.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

Its not that flat. It actually dips in one of the most important parts of the power band, the mid range. Between 3k-5k rpms there is a nasty dip in torque.

For you, I'd think that the bigger problem would be the very fast drop off in torque below 3000rpm...it will probably feel slower than your RSX there if I remember how the RSX is geared correctly... the dip in the middle isn't that big.

That's the price of high revs, fixed cam profile. I'm happy about it, because the mpgs should be better :P

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by serialk11r

For you, I'd think that the bigger problem would be the very fast drop off in torque below 3000rpm...it will probably feel slower than your RSX there if I remember how the RSX is geared correctly... the dip in the middle isn't that big.

That's the price of high revs, fixed cam profile. I'm happy about it, because the mpgs should be better :P

I know what you mean Serial but I like mid range torque better than low range torque or high range torque. Most of the times when I drive I shift before 4500 rpms

[cyde01]

lol yeah i've seen the curve. the dip is not big. i doubt you'd even notice the dip when you're actually driving the car. 150 lb/ft at 3000rpm is pretty dang good if you ask me.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by spin9k

This car will be fine on track, regardless of the low torque number. The place where it will fall down is 4th gear and up acceleration and resultant top speed. It will be similar to my RX-8... superb on track, esp. tight tracks, or long tracks without much in the way of straights. But anywhere where higher HP cars can stretch their legs, they'll easily show their strength ... outright acceleration at speed ... and you'll be left in the dust. Power rules because drag increase as the cube of speed. 200HP just doesn't go that far countering drag forces. Take these two easy examples....

Say, for the FRS/BRZ if 3HP is needed at 30mph, then 24HP is required at 60mph, but 192HP is needed at 120mph. It's pretty much finished accelerating.

vs. let's take a 350HP Mustang

if 4HP is needed at 30mph, then 32HP is required at 60mph, but only 256HP is needed at 120mph. There's more HP left and it will contiune to accelerate just fine.

Long story short, this car will rock on the twisties, you'll be crying on the long straights.

lol you know you need about 9-15 hp to go 60mph depending on your drag ratio

EDIT: plus overcoming rolling resitance, forgot about that :P so its anywhere between 19-24 hp but not 32 hp and you dont need 192 hp at 120mph its about 120hp...

these are the calculations for a 6 series with a .29 CG, remember the 86 has a lower .27 CG weighs less and is a smaller car, has skinnier tires and less rolling resistance....

Speed/ Power at the wheels/ Power at the engine
35 mph 8 hp 9 hp
60 mph 20 hp 23 hp
80 mph 38 hp 44 hp
100 mph 64 hp 75 hp
120 mph 102 hp 119 hp
140 mph 152 hp 178 hp
160 mph 220 hp 257 hp
180 mph 304 hp 356 hp
200 mph 409 hp 479 hp
220 mph 537 hp 628 hp
250 mph 776 hp 908 hp