Car Won't Start - Please help!

[SkiRideDrive]

I don't think the 86nanny caused the non-start issue. I just think me removing the kick panel and the switches in order to install the nanny is what caused the issue, possibly related to the alarm that was installed by the dealer. I had tested the nanny before removing the panel by plugging it into the obd and going through the pedal dance procedure it does by pressing the button. All worked flawlessly. I was able to engage and disengage pedal dance. The car ran fine. It was only after removing the kick panel that the car no longer started.

[steve99]

Originally Posted by Beastronix

@steve99 I'm well aware of the CAN bus and how it works. The nanny isn't even powered on until the button is pressed. When the button is pressed it gets power and sends a single message over the network. When the button is released power is back off. There isn't even a slight chance of it causing error frames on the bus. Even if it's purposely programmed to spam the bus you would simply get a check engine light for the next 10 miles... It can't alter the ECU with how it's flashed.

It sends the exact data the manual pedal dance does, no different.

The only harm the nanny could possibly do is blow the OBD fuse if a high powered device is plugged in the OBD pass-thru while the 86Nanny is enabled (which is why the ACC harness exists).

totally understand but
What if activation button is faulty ie permanently active , sending rubbish data constantly
fault within box grounding or shorting can bus lines ect

i chase faults for a living (not in cars though), really weird unpredictable stuff can happen , best to totally eliminate the possibility than assume it not an issue ie disconnect it :-)

agree its highly unlikely and the fault is probably elsewhere in alarm or immobilizer area but i have learnt from experience to totally eliminate possible causes and don't assume or overlook anything.

[steve99]

Originally Posted by SkiRideDrive

I don't think the 86nanny caused the non-start issue. I just think me removing the kick panel and the switches in order to install the nanny is what caused the issue, possibly related to the alarm that was installed by the dealer. I had tested the nanny before removing the panel by plugging it into the obd and going through the pedal dance procedure it does by pressing the button. All worked flawlessly. I was able to engage and disengage pedal dance. The car ran fine. It was only after removing the kick panel that the car no longer started.

do you have an obd code reader/scanner or techstream software.

may be worth checking for obd codes, running can buss diagnostic with techstream ect, not all obd codes will illuminate check engine light. and a code may give you a clue as to where to look.
techstream also allows you to see if ecu is getting park switch or clutch switch signal ect.

[SkiRideDrive]

Originally Posted by steve99

do you have an obd code reader/scanner or techstream software.

may be worth checking for obd codes, running can buss diagnostic with techstream ect, not all obd codes will illuminate check engine light. and a code may give you a clue as to where to look.
techstream also allows you to see if ecu is getting park switch or clutch switch signal ect.

Don't have nor am I familiar with techstream. I used torque/bluetooth obd2 to check for codes, nothing showed up.

[steve99]

Originally Posted by SkiRideDrive

Don't have nor am I familiar with techstream. I used torque/bluetooth obd2 to check for codes, nothing showed up.

thats fine torque will read same codes as techstream or scanner.

techstream is the toyota dealer software allows much more diagnostics.

your fault is looking pretty difficult so may need dealer or auto electrician, or subaru specialist shop.

[Beastronix]

Originally Posted by steve99

totally understand but
What if activation button is faulty ie permanently active , sending rubbish data constantly
fault within box grounding or shorting can bus lines ect

i chase faults for a living (not in cars though), really weird unpredictable stuff can happen , best to totally eliminate the possibility than assume it not an issue ie disconnect it :-)

agree its highly unlikely and the fault is probably elsewhere in alarm or immobilizer area but i have learnt from experience to totally eliminate possible causes and don't assume or overlook anything.

@steve99 Yes, I agree it is wise to eliminate possible causes and that test was already done. Troubleshooting to the 10th degree as you suggest is wise, but obviously I'm going to defend the product since I know exactly how it works

Trust me. Every possible fault ie switch stuck active cannot cause any harm. It doesn't blindly send data and isn't a cheaply made product by any means. It's using a full CAN interface with actual i/o logic, not a generic flashed chip such as an ELM327.

It smart enough to adapt and know what's going on. Your example of a permanently active fault is a good example... If the unit was actively on it will just sit idle. If the power was pulsing causing it to simulate a repetitive button press it still wouldn't try to send excess data. When something like this happens it listens to the skid control module and sees "oh, this is already done... no need to do anything. Thank you skid control ecu".

Another safety measure to avoid any chance of gibberish on the network is re-authentication and a line speed test every single time before sending any data.

Please understand I'm not knocking you. Your suggestion of ruling everything out is dead on and I agree 100%... I'm just saying we have the best person to rule this item out right here in this thread.

[SkiRideDrive]

Tried clutch dropping it... no luck.

Its at the dealer now.

[SkiRideDrive]

Update: The dealer found a loose wire in the alarm system and that is what caused the no-start issue.

Thank you for all of your help in this problem.

Also to note: the dealer (not the one I bought the car from) noted this was NOT a warranty issue, but that he would cover this one for free. Next time I would have to take it up with the dealer I purchased it from who installed it.

Finally, I asked him what brand the alarm was, he said Southwest Alarms, in case anyone is interested.

[Packofcrows]

haha I knew it! Toyota's in our fam have issues with dealer installed alarms*******.

[SkiRideDrive]

I do have one final question.

Would removing the alarm be the best move going forward? I was considering contacting the original dealer, letting them know how unhappy I am they modified the factory wiring system without my authorization, and asking them to remove the alarm system. Do you think they would put it back together properly or it would be just an likely to have problems as the current configuration with the alarm installed?

Thanks!

[Packofcrows]

Originally Posted by SkiRideDrive

I do have one final question.

Would removing the alarm be the best move going forward? I was considering contacting the original dealer, letting them know how unhappy I am they modified the factory wiring system without my authorization, and asking them to remove the alarm system. Do you think they would put it back together properly or it would be just an likely to have problems as the current configuration with the alarm installed?

Thanks!

First, I'd get dealer to take off all components.

2nd: either,

Get an official alarm installer (ie: Viper) to re-install it, if you wanna keep it. Dealers blow at stuff not from factory, besides 99% of 'em only know what the manual tells them.

...or

I'd get it off, buy a new alarm.... i know extra $$$, and get it professionally installed by a lifetime guarantee shop. IDK where you live if there's any but down here in central CA we have a few.

[SkiRideDrive]

Originally Posted by Packofcrows

First, I'd get dealer to take off all components.

2nd: either,

Get an official alarm installer (ie: Viper) to re-install it, if you wanna keep it. Dealers blow at stuff not from factory, besides 99% of 'em only know what the manual tells them.

...or

I'd get it off, buy a new alarm.... i know extra $$$, and get it professionally installed by a lifetime guarantee shop. IDK where you live if there's any but down here in central CA we have a few.

Thanks for the tips. The alarm is not even operational. I declined the alarm option when I bought the car. I hate alarms and don't want one. They installed it at the dealer before I even went to look at the car, and did not disclose that to me.

I am drafting an email to the salesman who sold me the car now expressing my dissatisfaction and my expectation for them to remove the alarm, properly, and without the haste at which the alarm was originally installed.

[Beastronix]

Good call... Race cars don't need alarms

[ToySub1946]

Hopefully you did not have to pay for the tow.

If so, I'd ask the selling Stealership to reimburse you for the expense...especially since you had no use of your vehicle for several days.

Happier Days Ahead.

Drive it like you stole it.

Personal note: I've had my 2015 for almost, not quite one year. Currently almost 22k on the odo. I initially intended to be quite anal about keeping it near perfect condition...yet I'm almost 69yo, and with way more miles than I'd normally drive for a geezer who does not work...due to having so much fun with this ride...just can't be anal using it on long trips (flying shit on freeways)...and winding dirt roads around here meant for a vehicle with more ground clearance or 4wd vehicle. Currently gotta jack it up and bend some sheet metal underneath it back in place to stop vibrations in exhaust system...LOL...so have fun, don't worry...just enjoy...is my current motto.


For the past: Sorry I led you astray, telling you to try and pop start it. Must be that alarm does more than simply interrupting the crank circuit.