Drift-Office : Jackson Racing Supercharger Installed! (Tune Tommorow!)

[smbstyle]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

That's what the "factory tuned" version of the Jackson Racing kit is designed for, and that's exactly how we're testing our kit up front.

Maybe I missed it somewhere; but what made you choose the JR kit over the KW kit?

[ramiram1984]

Originally Posted by shaunsweeney

I guess the question is would it be worth changing the header, it is obviously a terrible design, and replace with the catted UEL and get a tune.

I don't want a torque dip at all and I still see a slight one with this kit. Then again, I don't want to spend this much money and have another $500+ in tunes to take care of on top of it.

I guess the real question is how much the FT86 SpeedFactory catted UEL changes the VE of this engine.

Now go look at KW digital assassin's greater torque dip...

[digital_assassin]

I think the key here is that if you really want to tackle the very minor differences a header will make when going S/C you can expect to see very small gains for a fairly large sum of money.

I will likely get a EL header at some point and the front runner is the HKS at this point due to it's proven performance but Kraftwerks is releasing a EL too and it will work with their kit (some EL's won't due to pulley clearance issues) so I'm waiting to see. Sam's TQ is looking better without the dip and I'm fairly certain the dip would go away on mine if I went with any of the headers as even the RevWorks header has been proven to eliminate the dip.

$1,200 for a good header gets you another 6.3TQ and 1.8TQ at the top end of the spectrum and will kill the TQ dip and that's only speculation because we don't have the same exhaust setup either. I have a catted over/front pipe combo so 2 cats in my system vs Sam with no cats. People looking at UEL will likely not do as good as the EL seems to be what this engine likes when S/C

[shaunsweeney]

This is why I am intrigued by the possibility of the FT86 SpeedFactory Catted UEL. It knocks out that dip and is going to be priced much better than the other options currently available.

Thanks for showing me the KW kit, because now I have to decided which one I like better. The KW has some great pluses like the separate belt drive. Hmmmmm

[OjiGeorge]

I'm a newb to engines. I understand the very basics. Can someone point me to a direction where I can learn why increasing the exhaust flow in the header would not improve SC performance? If we look at the engine as a fancy air pump, anything reducing resistance will make life easier on the engine.

Maybe the picture will change once we begin to push more power out of a supercharged motor?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by smbstyle

Maybe I missed it somewhere; but what made you choose the JR kit over the KW kit?

They essentially make the same power, but the Jackson Racing kit does it utilizing 87% of the rated capacity, while the Kraftwerks kit does it utilizing 99% of the rated capacity. Kraftwerks touts larger piping and larger intercoolers, but yet the kit is less efficient? Hmmm. The expandability to a C38 means nothing to us, because it's more power than the stock driveline can handle (Transmission, axles). See math here: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=549

The Jackson Racing kit also has less points for failure (less pulleys added, less complicated belt system, etc.).

As far as we have observed, we have not seen the Kraftwerks car at the track, except for the Import Tuner FR shootout. This doesn't mean that they're not getting private track time, but we're at the track nearly every weekend. It's difficult to NOT run into us. We've observed the Jackson Racing cars at a multitude of events.

Additionally, when we ask Jackson Racing a question, they give us an answer. Kraftwerks, not so much. See: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=541

[shaunsweeney]

Originally Posted by OjiGeorge

I'm a newb to engines. I understand the very basics. Can someone point me to a direction where I can learn why increasing the exhaust flow in the header would not improve SC performance? If we look at the engine as a fancy air pump, anything reducing resistance will make life easier on the engine.

Maybe the picture will change once we begin to push more power out of a supercharged motor?

If you alter the flow characteristics of the exhaust the volumetric effeciency changes. When a kit is supplied with a tune designed for a specific volumetric effeciency (i.e. stock exhaust), any changes which effect that require additional tuning to account for the change.

In some instances the changes are so minimal that a tune is not absoultely necessary for safe operation, but may be wanted for optimal performance and reliability.

[Drift-Office]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Whats this I don't even...

I thought your best NA numbers came out the rear of a JDL UEL? =P

My best numbers was 198 out of a prototype T1R Header out of Canada. The next best as 195 out of a HKS EL

Ref : http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41525

I don't recall saying that the JDL UELs were the best performing ones, only that they're probably the best out of the UEL selection that we've tuned here.

Cheers!


Bob @ Drift-Office, LLC

[shaunsweeney]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They essentially make the same power, but the Jackson Racing kit does it utilizing 87% of the rated capacity, while the Kraftwerks kit does it utilizing 99% of the rated capacity. Kraftwerks touts larger piping and larger intercoolers, but yet the kit is less efficient? Hmmm. The expandability to a C38 means nothing to us, because it's more power than the stock driveline can handle (Transmission, axles). See math here: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=549

The Jackson Racing kit also has less points for failure (less pulleys added, less complicated belt system, etc.).

As far as we have observed, we have not seen the Kraftwerks car at the track, except for the Import Tuner FR shootout. This doesn't mean that they're not getting private track time, but we're at the track nearly every weekend. It's difficult to NOT run into us. We've observed the Jackson Racing cars at a multitude of events.

Additionally, when we ask Jackson Racing a question, they give us an answer. Kraftwerks, not so much. See: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=541

Thanks for that reply. It kind of helps me in my decision process. I am not familiar with SC setups as I am more of a turbo guy when it comes to FI knowledge.

I wasn't sure if the belt setup on the KW kit was a plus or minus. The plus to me was if the belt broke, I can still drive (this is my DD). The miuns is as stated, added complexity. I also didn't realize they have already pushed their SC to damn near 100%! If there is one thing I learned from the turbo world, you always want a little headroom.

I also don't plan on anything over what the stock transmission can handle. Upgrading axles isn't the end of the world, but I would also like to avoid that if possible.

[Victor Draken]

I'm getting every day more interested in the Jackson racing S/C.
To bad I have already a 3" Perrin exhaust with a 2.5" catted downpipe combo from
Nameless.

So will have to understand if it is still possible to etune the mods I have and the S/C, and run the JR safely.

[sw20kosh]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They essentially make the same power, but the Jackson Racing kit does it utilizing 87% of the rated capacity, while the Kraftwerks kit does it utilizing 99% of the rated capacity. Kraftwerks touts larger piping and larger intercoolers, but yet the kit is less efficient? Hmmm. The expandability to a C38 means nothing to us, because it's more power than the stock driveline can handle (Transmission, axles). See math here: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=549

The Jackson Racing kit also has less points for failure (less pulleys added, less complicated belt system, etc.).

As far as we have observed, we have not seen the Kraftwerks car at the track, except for the Import Tuner FR shootout. This doesn't mean that they're not getting private track time, but we're at the track nearly every weekend. It's difficult to NOT run into us. We've observed the Jackson Racing cars at a multitude of events.

Additionally, when we ask Jackson Racing a question, they give us an answer. Kraftwerks, not so much. See: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=541

Where is this whole "our trans and axles can only handle the power/trq of ~270 whp / 220 wtq" coming from? Is there hard evidence that I have missed? I haven't seen this happen to any high hp 86.

[gmsii]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

They essentially make the same power, but the Jackson Racing kit does it utilizing 87% of the rated capacity, while the Kraftwerks kit does it utilizing 99% of the rated capacity. Kraftwerks touts larger piping and larger intercoolers, but yet the kit is less efficient? Hmmm. The expandability to a C38 means nothing to us, because it's more power than the stock driveline can handle (Transmission, axles). See math here: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showp...&postcount=549

bro...ur math can't be correct

what is the size of the JR sc pulley that comes with the kit?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by gmsii

bro...ur math can't be correct

what is the size of the JR sc pulley that comes with the kit?

Then please correct my math so that I can amend my post/information.

The JR sc pulley is 110mm diameter.

[cobrabyte]

Originally Posted by sw20kosh

Where is this whole "our trans and axles can only handle the power/trq of ~270 whp / 220 wtq" coming from? Is there hard evidence that I have missed? I haven't seen this happen to any high hp 86.

I recall -- and I might be wrong -- Crawford breaking their axle(s). Obviously, they were pushing a lot more power than most of us but that's one case of broken axle(s).

600HP axles can be had from DSS for about $900ish... so, not too, too bad for peace of mind.