Subaru BRZ Direct Test vs Nissan 370z and Mazda MX-5 Miata

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by jamsbong

"One that could be the best sports car to come out of Japan since the Honda NSX"

I like the FR-S/BRZ, but no way is it going to be a better *SPORTS* car than the S2000. Quite the opposite..

It will be a better all-around sportY car, and it might replace my S2000.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by OrbitalEllipses

The NSX broke people's understandings of supercars when it came out. It was also mild for a supercar at the time, despite having some radical elements never before seen in a production car.

How does the BRZ factor into that understanding of the NSX? Well it does have some never before seen elements (DI + boxer), but I think dsp4's correct in that this car is special in a way similar to how the NSX was special.

Originally Posted by fatoni

i really dont think that putting di on a boxer motor is "special." its not like there were any hurdles that needed to be overcome or anything that needed to be pioneered. if you count that as "special," you might as well count the rx8s doors "special" or the elises chassis "special." the only thing that really makes this car special is that it is a mediocore sports car in a time where there arent many sports cars.

the mustang gt broke peoples understandings of what an american muscle car can do and how much it costs to do it. why isnt that special? maybe the brz is the most special car since last years cars

direct and port injection is a break through, only 2 other cars have it, the brz isnt the fastest or the best handling car, but for the money it is, the nsx also wasnt the fastest supercar in its time either but it is an instant classic, if the 86 is successful, it will be an instant classic...

[Spaceywilly]

Originally Posted by ZDan

I like the FR-S/BRZ, but no way is it going to be a better *SPORTS* car than the S2000. Quite the opposite..

It will be a better all-around sportY car, and it might replace my S2000.

I think this is what the author meant. The NSX was the first supercar that was also easy to live with, and that is what it is most well known for even today. It wasn't the fastest, most powerful, or best looking car, but it gave you great handling and fun in a car that had Honda reliability and a comfortable interior. The BRZ is to the affordable RWD coupe market what the NSX was to the supercar market when it came out. It is focused on driver enjoyment rather than trying to one-up the competition.

[joe]

Originally Posted by Chronogps

What are the conditions for the measurment of the official weight of the brz?

Europe:
Weight of lowest spec available + 75kg (driver and baggage) + 90% fuel

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by joe

Europe:
Weight of lowest spec available + 75kg (driver and baggage) + 90% fuel

US is all fluids and 90% fuel.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by carbonBLUE

direct and port injection is a break through, only 2 other cars have it, the brz isnt the fastest or the best handling car, but for the money it is, the nsx also wasnt the fastest supercar in its time either but it is an instant classic, if the 86 is successful, it will be an instant classic...

being the third isnt a break through. im not knocking the brz but it isnt the fastest, best handling for the money by a significant margin. the brz is doing what the miata has been doing for decades. hardly game changing if you ask me

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by fatoni

being the third isnt a break through. im not knocking the brz but it isnt the fastest, best handling for the money by a significant margin. the brz is doing what the miata has been doing for decades. hardly game changing if you ask me

I'm pretty sure this comparo is just a fluke. The USDM MX-5 is several hundred pounds lighter than the Twins and has the better front end suspension design.

So the Twins are definately not the fastest anything(it's not even faster than an 8th gen Civic Si by the looks of it) but I think the balance is respectable. I'm thinking it'll be a better DD than the NC Miata but that's subjective.

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by Allch Chcar

I'm pretty sure this comparo is just a fluke. The USDM MX-5 is several hundred pounds lighter than the Twins and has the better front end suspension design.

So the Twins are definately not the fastest anything(it's not even faster than an 8th gen Civic Si by the looks of it) but I think the balance is respectable. I'm thinking it'll be a better DD than the NC Miata but that's subjective.

you are right. that kind of statement is one i can agree with. im really excited to see a car like this in todays age but calling it revolutionary or gamechanging or whatever is a bit extreme imo.

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by fatoni

being the third isnt a break through. im not knocking the brz but it isnt the fastest, best handling for the money by a significant margin. the brz is doing what the miata has been doing for decades. hardly game changing if you ask me

they need a comparison that has a fun level on a scale of 1-10, who cares if it isnt the fastest, but handling wise... the 86 has a lot of cars beat on handling

put the rest on the same type of tires and see how well they handle, i doubt any cars within 5k can measure up...

[KeepGuessing]

within 5k can measure up to what?

Stopping distances and slalom speeds?

Or actual track/lap times?

[MmmHamSandwich]

I am not sure what numbers they were pulling to think that the BRZ was lighter than the Miata. I doubt there has ever been a Miata made that is heavier than the BRZ. Based on USDM specs, the current Miata ranges (depending on trim and transmission) from 143 to 315 pounds lighter than the lightest USDM spec BRZ. Granted 143 pounds isn't too terrible a compromise for a larger car, bigger engine, two more seats, more storage, and a roof over your head that will at least put up a fight in a crash. As light as a Miata would be nice, but is just unrealistic.

[dori.]

No it is possible to be lighter than the magazines specific trim of Miata. Read carefully:

Originally Posted by Autocar

Our diminutive 2.0-litre MX-5 Coupé Cabriolet – a car held as the most convincing argument for lightness and simplicity in a mass-market sports car – is heavier than our test BRZ by around 10kg.

Coupe Cabriolet = Hardtop convertible, which would add weight vs the soft top, naturally.

Further, you can't directly compare USDM NC and ZN6 to their UK versions. You don't know what either Mazda or Subaru adds or subtracts from their cars unless you did your research (you didn't). Maybe the UK spec BRZ comes comparatively stripped vs the US version. Maybe the UK hardtop comes fully loaded compared to the US one.

So there is the possibility, even if it's hard to believe. And if it is true, the difference is just 10 kg, which is 20-something pounds.

[SUB-FT86]

A mazda mx5 fully loaded is around 2580 lbs with a hardtop convertible and the lightest brz is in Japan at 2608 lbs. The UK spec BRZ is only missing a nav system.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by MmmHamSandwich

..., bigger engine, ...

2.0 = 2.0