Report: Toyota 86 / FR-S Sedan still coming (with 100mm longer wheelbase)

[Noble713]

Originally Posted by alan.chalkley

The market is already full of performance sedans and hatchbacks.

Please list the non-luxury, RWD, lightweight sedans under $40k. In the words of Katt Williams "Don't worry...I'll wait."

So with 4 or 5 people in any car it won't be driven to it's limits , so who cares if sedans/hatchbacks are fwd/rwd/awd.

How about people who like to drift, but also need a practical people-mover and yet don't have the space/money for multiple cars? Or who are trying to avoid the wrong kind of attention by driving a tricked out coupe?

The 86/frs/brz coupe is a unique sports car built for enthusiasts by enthusiasts.
Please keep it in it's state of purity , without added doors and missing roof.
I have a camry for the boring shopping centre stuff.

The 86 is successful because the Japanese got back to doing what they do best: designing cars that are quintessentially Japanese. I don't know about the mainland but the average enthusiast household down here in Okinawa can't afford both a big sedan and a modern sports coupe. The most popular drift cars here are used JZX90/JZX100 Chasers and Mark II's. Probably the most popular drag car is the R32 GT-R. Touge....I'm not familiar with that crowd but I've seen plenty of upgraded Miata's and Cappuccino's driven by middle-aged local guys. Young enthusiasts are predominantly street drifters though.

The only two things I hate about my Chaser are it's mediocre, flexible chassis and it's age. The 86 has a phenomenal chassis, so if they stretched it a bit, added two doors, and kept the weight under 3,000 lbs. I'd seriously consider it as a long-term replacement or stablemate. As a point of comparison, the base model JZX100 Chaser Tourer L came with a 2.0 inline-6 that only put out 140hp in a ~3,200lb car.

Slap a turbo on an 86 sedan, or better yet a turbo and stroker kit, and 300whp is a realistic possibility, which is probably more than my Chaser is making now (untuned Power FC and a stock turbo).

I'm not that enthused about the fan-made concept art or the hybrid rumors though.

Originally Posted by fr-sTony

thought this was a forum for sports car lovers. Get a WRX or Camry or some other kind of ugly 4 door thing for the family drive if you have to tote the kids or your loser car-less friends around. Did you also love the 4 door Porsche? Why not a 4 door Lambo or Corvette? Oh Yeah! The wife might let you buy one of those.

Not everyone driving a sedan is a family man. I like sedans because I can drive my wingman to the club (I don't drink alcohol so I'm the permanent DD among my friends, all but 1 of them owns a car) and have enough space to still put 2 chicks comfortably in the back seats. If need be, it's also way easier to have sex in the back of a sedan than a coupe (love hotel prices start to add up if you go out regularly).

Sedans make it easier to be stealthy and stay off people's radars too; a clean and subtle sedan is the perfect classy ride for the distinguished gentleman. No one expects it to crush their souls en route to the next stop light with it's 500whp (perfectly feasible with a 1JZ, 2JZ, or V8 sedan)

If I was on baller status I *absolutely* would buy the Lamborghini Estoque sedan concept. I love Lambo's and hope to own a twin-turbo Gallardo some day.

As for a Corvette 4-door.....I've actually collected images of the C6 and C7 chassis so I can analyze the feasibility of designing a sedan off of the same chassis. I've got the software to do it (Autodesk Inventor) and Herb Adam's book [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Chassis-Engineering-Building-Performance-Handling/dp/1557880557/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1381580604&sr=8-1&keywords=chassis+engineering"]Chassis Engineering[/ame] for a reason. The only thing that gives me pause is it might be easier to put a Holden Commodore (FR sedan, lightweight V8 pushrod engine) on a diet via carbon fiber instead. Or figure out the legalities of registering an LS-swapped E36 BMW here in Japan.

[thill]

Originally Posted by Lonewolf

So Toyota claims to take issue with a convertible gt86 because of the added weight, but they are going to make a bigger sedan version with a hybrid (read; heavy) powertrain...okay, that makes sense...

Yeah, that is why this is a rumor with renders.... I don't see it happening. The hybrid technology alone would drive the cost way up...

The whole appeal to the FT86 was supposed to be a cheap, and light sports car. As you said, this invalidates that.

[mwjcyber]

Originally Posted by fr-sTony

Why not a 4 door Lambo or Corvette?

Your wish is my command...





Thought I'd finish with this...


Your welcome

[fr-sTony]

Originally Posted by Noble713

How about people who like to drift, but also need a practical people-mover and yet don't have the space/money for multiple cars? Or who are trying to avoid the wrong kind of attention by driving a tricked out coupe?

Probably the most popular drag car is the R32 GT-R. Touge....I'm not familiar with that crowd but I've seen plenty of upgraded Miata's and Cappuccino's driven by middle-aged local guys. Young enthusiasts are predominantly street drifters though.


I'm not that enthused about the fan-made concept art or the hybrid rumors though. Yay! Me either.



Not everyone driving a sedan is a family man. I like sedans because I can drive my wingman to the club (I don't drink alcohol so I'm the permanent DD among my friends, all but 1 of them owns a car) and have enough space to still put 2 chicks comfortably in the back seats. If need be, it's also way easier to have sex in the back of a sedan than a coupe (love hotel prices start to add up if you go out regularly).

Sedans make it easier to be stealthy and stay off people's radars too; a clean and subtle sedan is the perfect classy ride for the distinguished gentleman. No one expects it to crush their souls en route to the next stop light with it's 500whp (perfectly feasible with a 1JZ, 2JZ, or V8 sedan)

If I was on baller status I *absolutely* would buy the Lamborghini Estoque sedan concept. I love Lambo's and hope to own a twin-turbo Gallardo some day.

As for a Corvette 4-door.....I've actually collected images of the C6 and C7 chassis so I can analyze the feasibility of designing a sedan off of the same chassis. I've got the software to do it (Autodesk Inventor) and Herb Adam's book Chassis Engineering for a reason. The only thing that gives me pause is it might be easier to put a Holden Commodore (FR sedan, lightweight V8 pushrod engine) on a diet via carbon fiber instead. Or figure out the legalities of registering an LS-swapped E36 BMW here in Japan.

I don't care about those people(just kidding :^). If you are those people you will sooner or later have an accident that costs almost as much as buying another car anyway. Drifting is a bunch of fun though. I admit that I'm torn between safety and fun.
Well don't act a fool or have a loud car that gets the wrong attention then. Cops should judge the behavior, not the car.
So if illegal street drifting is your thing then it doesn't matter if you drive a dorky looking 4 door?
An R32 is a cool looking car to me. I wish we could buy them here.
Drag racing doesn't prove anything but how reckless you are toward your car, your life, and other peoples lives. If it must be done; try to do it in a secluded place or the local drag strip.
I don't want a stealthy 500 horsepower land yacht for the distinguished gentleman.
It doesn't crush my soul to get beat in a drag race because to me it's just for fun. Maneuverability, agility, and fun are more important to me than comfort or power. I'd like to own a Miata or Cappuccino(can't get those here either) too.
It's easier to have sex on a blanket or at home than in the back seat of most any car.
I sometimes feel like I'm over the hill(I'm only 48) because I'm over the drag racing urge and think this car has plenty of power for tougeing around. And it looks cool after the driving fun is over for the day.
This car and I seem to be about contradictions. It looks fast but it is only fast in the corners, and I like excitement but don't want to be stupid about it. But nothing is more contradictory than a 4 door sports car or a hot hatch. They just don't look right to my old school eyes.
Yeah ok- A four door Lambo or Corvette would be kinda nice though. <--contradicting my self again..oh well no one is perfect.

[fr-sTony]

Originally Posted by mwjcyber

Your wish is my command...





Thought I'd finish with this...


Your welcome

lol
Awesome! That Monster Corvette looks totally impractical.

[fr-sTony]

Originally Posted by thill

Yeah, that is why this is a rumor with renders.... I don't see it happening. The hybrid technology alone would drive the cost way up...

The whole appeal to the FT86 was supposed to be a cheap, and light sports car. As you said, this invalidates that.

Yeah, Same thing with the 4 door Lambo or Corvettes.
But how cool are those pics?
By the way, What is that fine young lady in your sig saying?

[Lonewolf]

Originally Posted by AsianStyle

I was under the impression the convertible was scrapped due to price.

Price and added weight were contributing factors...

[Jayde]

This is interesting. Depending on how much longer it is and how the styling is, I might look into it! I love my BRZ, but having two extra doors is always a perk I wish I had.

[daiheadjai]

Originally Posted by fr-sTony

Thank you!
I totally agree with only this one person on here? I thought this was a forum for sports car lovers. Get a WRX or Camry or some other kind of ugly 4 door thing for the family drive if you have to tote the kids or your loser car-less friends around. Did you also love the 4 door Porsche? Why not a 4 door Lambo or Corvette? Oh Yeah! The wife might let you buy one of those.
By the way there is nothing cool or sleek about the looks of the VW Bug-looking WRX.
These 86s were made for 2 people only(and maybe a few groceries in the trunk). It's not a tour bus or a minivan. I can tote one brave friend at a time as long as they don't say my car is cute. Impractical? You bet ya! I wouldn't have any other way.
They better not call that 4 door 100mm longer egg an fr-s! That would be the icing on the cake to go with all the other stupid stuff I see and hear people doing every day.

Not all of us are made of money.
Some of us have lives that involve more than 1 other person, but would still like to enjoy the drive (how that makes us "less of an enthusiast" is beyond me).

Just sayin'

[rcm47]

Why are you people crying "no!!!" over a sedan. It's not like their going to stop making the coupe. One day you forever alones will understand how cool a performance sedan is. I wouldn't mind having one parked next to my coupe in my garage.

[gzpermadi]

Oh Toyota, squeezing the 86 brand while it still popular.
Reminds me of Samsung and all their Galaxy phones...

[guysmyley]

this rendering makes the front look awful. just simply terrible, and not in a good way. keep the fr-s front nose the same as it is now. don't change it.

Originally Posted by Hachiroku

via: motoring.com.au

It’s no exaggeration to say the 86, Australia’s top-selling sports car, has single-handedly succeeded in injecting some sparkle into Toyota’s lacklustre line-up.

And, according to a source close to Toyota, there’s plenty more where that came from.

That’s right folks, the 86 family is about to grow -- and in a big way. When the 86 landed in showrooms last year, we were told of other iterations including a soft-top, a sedan and a shooting brake (sports wagon). Chief engineer Tetsuya Tada even mentioned as much in his blog.

Well, although the 86 convertible concept has apparently stalled, our insider now tells us the green light has been given for an 86-based sedan.

The soft-top 86 roadster concept was unveiled at the Geneva motor show in March, but there is still no word from Toyota -- or our insider, for that matter -- as to when we might see that car on the road.

What we can tell you is that an 86-based sedan, similar to the one rendered here by Japan’s Holiday Auto magazine, is on the way and may even beat the soft-top into showrooms.

According to our source, the new sports sedan will target 40-something buyers who honed their driving skills in cars like the rear-wheel drive Corolla AE86, Nissan Silvia (180SX and 200SX), Mazda RX-8 or Honda S2000.

Employing a wheelbase that’s 100mm longer than that of the current 86, the new sedan will feature what Toyota calls a “keen-look” grille design that appears to replicate the shape of a Japanese ‘katana’ Samurai sword.

In addition to the base model’s Subaru-sourced 147kW 2.0-litre boxer powertrain, the as-yet-unnamed 86 sedan will also offer a next-generation hybrid system.

Strategically differentiated from the Toyota’s current Hybrid Synergy Drive system, the new ‘Hybrid R’ sports hybrid system will incorporate a one-motor parallel drive set-up that generates up to 200kW while achieving 10-15 per cent better fuel economy.

While Hybrid R details are still sketchy, our insider suggests the new system – as revealed in the 300kW Yaris Hybrid-R concept at Frankfurt -- will employ F1-style KERS (Kinetic Energy Recovery System) technology that can recover the car’s kinetic energy under braking.

While we will not see this concept at next month’s Tokyo motor show, we hear strong rumours that it will make an appearance at next year’s Geneva show.

Expect to see Toyota’s all-new rear-drive compact sports sedan hit showrooms from late 2015 through to early 2016, priced not far from the sub-$30K 86.

Unfortunately, our sources tell us we won’t get a look at the jointly developed Toyota-BMW sports car at the Tokyo show either, with the Geneva show in March 2014 now looking more likely.


* Imaginative/speculative render only *

Attachment 53876

[Quentin]

I'd love to see it happen. There simply aren't any RWD sedans available in the US that are at or under 3k lbs and don't have a luxury badge on the hood, though. BMW 320i, Cadillac CTS 2.5L, and IS250 are the closest to fit, but they are all 3300+ lbs, cost $33k, and all seem to have pretty dismal powertrains.

[P@ul]

Sounds like more of what I actually wanted. E30ish... Or with a considerably more useful rear seat like the, gasp, AE86 Corolla.