SCCA Solo C Street Discussion

[SeanRTR]

Originally Posted by TMF

Out of curiosity on a related note...of FRS's in the trophies at nats, who was on OTS Konis? I believe Sean is...any others?

50k Mile OTS Koni inserts still....
Run 2 from Day 2 (not my fastest, but only one I got uploaded apparently)
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSkDU_xM09E"]2015 Scca Solo Nationls CS Sean Grogan Day 2 East Run 2 - YouTube[/ame]

[chucky12012]

Originally Posted by Biggins

I've been on the Konis for a couple years now, but what are my other choices right now?

I could switch to the full-replacement front Konis, MCS, Bilstein... I know there's been mention of Cusco shocks and the different re-valving options with each of the companies. I'm adding the TRD stuff next year and want to get closer to the pointy end at the big events instead of the last trophy spot or one out of the trophies...

I learned Nationals can be quite a head game after my first trip last year, but I tried to make realistic goals this year since I was in someone else's car and on BFGs instead of the RE71R I ran all year. The car was good and BFGs were fast but I had a bad first day which cost me. I hope the third time's a charm next year, and maybe in my own car!

For trophy FRS's at Nationals in response to this/the question below this one, I only know of Dave on MCS's and Ferchak/Grogan on Konis. For what it is worth, I ran the Cusco's and on the suspension intensive west course had the fifth fastest time. I know, I know, that doesn't mean anything, just trying to answer the shocks question.

[Briankbot]

Originally Posted by SeanRTR

CS was a lot of fun this year, great meeting everyone, and huge Thanks to Brian from HI and his friends for some good cold craft brews before hitting the road back to Detroit. The final runs with Fenter and Ogburn were pretty special. Great heroics by Dave to end up with the overall win. I think I was most impressed with Dave shifting to third gear four times on day one. I've said all year long that shit doesn't work, and he obviously proved me wrong. I changed tires on day two looking for some miracle speed and totally went the wrong way. Anyone else still going much slower on new RE71R's compared to 2/32nd tires?
Test N Tune was 39.1 on 30 run 225's, but the tires were very easy to drive on, and had good feedback, but I ran 38.7 on the 120 run 235's , and tires essentially made zero noise and felt vague (I saw two of Fenter's runs, 38.8,39.0). I went with the old tires for competition on day 1, and went for it with new tires on day 2. Day 1 the tires still felt vague, and the car was pushing, and again, no noise. usually zero noise from street tires means they're cycled out, and I did have 120+ runs and 8k of street miles, so I figured it was time to run the new tires on day 2, seeing as they're shorter and have better gearing. They weren't fast. Car felt fine, but the times were just slow. I don't get it. I tried the test at a local again last Sunday, and the old tires are still over half a second faster on a 40 second course. 35 run tires to essentially 135 run tires. Anyone else having these issues? I can't imagine my car is that much faster on 235's compared to 225's, but the tires don't even feel somewhat similar AT ALL.

You're welcome for the beers Sean. It was cool meeting you and chatting about CS FR-S stuff. I've been meaning to get some of my post Nats thoughts written down so I'm going to combine that here with a response to your post:

I can't say too much about what you experienced with the tires, but I swear they are faster when worn in quite a bit....on the other hand I have had two different people from different regions tell me that about 30 runs is optimal...

As for the test course, I found it to be misleading (as someone told me it would be). As I tried to tune my car out there my times got slower three days in a row and the last day before competition a couple RX8s were spanking me. At that point I thought I had screwed my setup, forgotten how to drive, and I would be lucky to finish midpack. In the end I beat both of them...Could the gearing have been the difference for you while testing? There was definitely a shift or two on that course w/225s.

I will say I was not happy with my car on day 2 and I feel like the drop in ambient temps had something to do with it. When it was time for run three and my right side tires were warm enough to have sand and grit stuck all over them (sunny side) and the left side tires (shadow side) were cool to the touch I was eyeballing Manfred's tire covers with much envy! I have also been doing a bit of thinking about how temps effect the behavior of a damper, how different dampers might be more consistent especially with two way adjustment, and how tire carcass stiffness/tire pressures/temperatures relate to one another.

As for shifting strategies I know I mentioned there are calculators to determine the optimal shift point for each gear given a specific torque curve, hp peak, gear ratios, etc. They have been out of my mind for a while and I don't think I've looked at one in maybe a decade but it's definitely on my to do list now. For a serious approach to winning that kind of info balanced with a clear strategy of when the course will permit shifting seems to be essential to me now. No doubt there will be a DAS in my future!

Either way I learned a ton about strategy for Nats (don't hang out for three days before hand and get sunstroke haha) and was lucky enough to take home a trophy my first time in attendance with my first attempt at prepping a car for serious competition. I feel really lucky just to be participating in a class as awesome as CS is right now. The first guy to ever win Nationals in an MX-5('94) just showed up in his new Club package ND at yesterday's local event. It's going to be fun to see how this develops...

[Briankbot]

Originally Posted by TMF

Out of curiosity on a related note...of FRS's in the trophies at nats, who was on OTS Konis? I believe Sean is...any others?

12th place with OTS Konis purchased used. Maybe 30 or 40k miles on them now.

[renfield90]

Tire covers available from blackwatchracing.com

We didn't struggle with temps at all on day 2. They really help.

[ryan t]

Originally Posted by chucky12012

For trophy FRS's at Nationals in response to this/the question below this one, I only know of Dave on MCS's and Ferchak/Grogan on Konis. For what it is worth, I ran the Cusco's and on the suspension intensive west course had the fifth fastest time. I know, I know, that doesn't mean anything, just trying to answer the shocks question.

how are you liking the cuscos? are you able to get the over 2 degrees camber like the koni guys are? im leaning toward the cuscos but wonder about the camber.

[simpleisbest]

Originally Posted by ryan t

how are you liking the cuscos? are you able to get the over 2 degrees camber like the koni guys are? im leaning toward the cuscos but wonder about the camber.

Why would you choose the Cusco's over Koni? You can drive around a lot of crap, but I have never seen a shock out of Japan that was optimal for auto-x. Roads are too smooth there for what we see.

Unless you can revalve them locally, Koni > Cusco, imo.

[chucky12012]

Originally Posted by ryan t

how are you liking the cuscos? are you able to get the over 2 degrees camber like the koni guys are? im leaning toward the cuscos but wonder about the camber.

I'm not sure where I sit with camber to be honest right now, haven't taken it in to get checked. It's maxed out, so it's kind what it is, so I haven't taken the time to have it measured.

With regard to Koni versus Cusco, I would imagine they are pretty similar. Both are going to be the basic twin-tube design with rebound adjustment from a needle valve. The Cusco has a bit more adjustment capability out of the box, but probably not a game changing amount. It came to be on my side after some discussion with CounterSpace and the need to swap out my over-valved Bilsteins before Nationals. It was something different, so I figured I would give it a go and I have been pretty happy with it. So far they have worked well with the TRD springs without issue, but hopefully I'll collect some more feedback during the upcoming months.

[RandyP]

Originally Posted by chucky12012

For trophy FRS's at Nationals in response to this/the question below this one, I only know of Dave on MCS's and Ferchak/Grogan on Konis. For what it is worth, I ran the Cusco's and on the suspension intensive west course had the fifth fastest time. I know, I know, that doesn't mean anything, just trying to answer the shocks question.

The FRS in 6th was on Koni struts. Koni inserts were replaced under warranty because one insert leaked at the adjuster.

[SeanRTR]

Originally Posted by RandyP

The FRS in 6th was on Koni struts. Koni inserts were replaced under warranty because one insert leaked at the adjuster.

Tall tires both days Randy?


How many runs were on your tires prior to competition if you don't mind me asking?


Thinking of going out your way for an event in two weeks in Pittsburgh, and to catch a Penguins game on Saturday night, but ticket prices are deterring me currently. If you and Mike F are out there, that may help persuade me.


http://www.motorsportreg.com/events/...1#.Vg1hXGfbKDY

[ryan t]

Originally Posted by chucky12012

I'm not sure where I sit with camber to be honest right now, haven't taken it in to get checked. It's maxed out, so it's kind what it is, so I haven't taken the time to have it measured.

With regard to Koni versus Cusco, I would imagine they are pretty similar. Both are going to be the basic twin-tube design with rebound adjustment from a needle valve. The Cusco has a bit more adjustment capability out of the box, but probably not a game changing amount. It came to be on my side after some discussion with CounterSpace and the need to swap out my over-valved Bilsteins before Nationals. It was something different, so I figured I would give it a go and I have been pretty happy with it. So far they have worked well with the TRD springs without issue, but hopefully I'll collect some more feedback during the upcoming months.

im joining you on the Cusco's. hope to have them before the next event. where did you end up on clicks front and rear. maybe we can compare notes.

[RandyP]

Originally Posted by SeanRTR

Tall tires both days Randy?


How many runs were on your tires prior to competition if you don't mind me asking?


Thinking of going out your way for an event in two weeks in Pittsburgh, and to catch a Penguins game on Saturday night, but ticket prices are deterring me currently. If you and Mike F are out there, that may help persuade me.


http://www.motorsportreg.com/events/...1#.Vg1hXGfbKDY

The tall tires were pretty new and I ran the same both days. Just Wilmington tour, a couple events in Pittsburgh and Nationals. Mike F should be in CS but I may be in AS for a change of pace.

[chucky12012]

Originally Posted by ryan t

im joining you on the Cusco's. hope to have them before the next event. where did you end up on clicks front and rear. maybe we can compare notes.

I ran the fronts two clicks from full stiff and the rear around 5 clicks if I remember correctly. I could see running the rears even softer than that on a less grippy surface too. The car was a little loose for the practice course but felt spot on for the competition courses at nationals. Just be careful installing them as the adjustment knob shaft with the allen wrench connection is very narrow and delicate.

[bslate3]

Has anyone done any back to back testing with 225/45r17 vs 235/40r17 tires? Is the extra width worth the shorter gearing?