Who says we need more horsepower?

[carbonBLUE]

Originally Posted by ayau

I think we can reasonably conclude that they used a stock 458 for this comparison.

Here's the breakdown.

Ferrari 458: msrp $240,000
Lap time: 1:02.24
Power: 570PS / 562HP
Weight: 3042lbs
Front Tire: 235/35 ZR20
Rear Tire: 295/35 ZR20

Griffin 86: $50,000
Lap time: 1:01.872
Power: 200HP (stock)
Weight: ~2276lbs (500lbs weight reduction)
Front/Rear Tire: 250/640R18 Yokohama racing slicks

fixed that for ya

im going to assume its using a TRD supercharger and crazy slicks to bring that down 6 seconds off the hks , seems legit...

[B L U E S L A T E]

My goodness... I want that underbody aero...

[cf6mech]

Somebody is dreaming!

[bunny86]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

I would still take a 458 over it

That depends where TRD intend to take this project. If this is the only one of it's kind then it's already worth more than an 458 Italia.

[DarkSunrise]

OK I'm impressed. Consider:

1:01.87 -- Griffon 86 -- 2276 lbs / 200 hp = 11.38 lbs/hp
1:03.54 -- KTM X-Bow -- 1916 lbs / 241 hp = 7.95 lbs/hp
1:04.24 -- Lotus 2-Eleven -- 1707 lbs / 256 hp = 6.67 lbs/hp
1:05.88 -- Lotus Exige Cup 260 -- 1958 lbs / 260 hp = 7.53 lbs/hp

Obviously tires and aero play a role, but that is a large weight/hp disadvantage to overcome. The Griffon is not only making less power, but it's also heavier than the other cars listed.

That is quite a feat. Now throw some FI on it.

[Ryephile]

Tires make an enormous difference. Street tire vs. track tire is no contest even with a massive power deficit. Put all the cars on the same tires and you have a reasonably fair comparison.

That said, congrats to TRD for shaving big weight off the car and making a big media splash.

[ayau]

Originally Posted by DarkSunrise

OK I'm impressed. Consider:

1:01.87 -- Griffon 86 -- 2276 lbs / 200 hp = 11.38 lbs/hp
1:03.54 -- KTM X-Bow -- 1916 lbs / 241 hp = 7.95 lbs/hp
1:04.24 -- Lotus 2-Eleven -- 1707 lbs / 256 hp = 6.67 lbs/hp
1:05.88 -- Lotus Exige Cup 260 -- 1958 lbs / 260 hp = 7.53 lbs/hp

Obviously tires and aero play a role, but that is a large weight/hp disadvantage to overcome. The Griffon is not only making less power, but it's also heavier than the other cars listed.

That is quite a feat. Now throw some FI on it.

I don't think the comparison is fair. Put all those cars on race slicks and then we'll have a fair comparison.

[DarkSunrise]

Even accounting for the difference in tires, it's still an impressive feat given not only the large power deficit, but also the weight disadvantage.

Edit: To explain further, one former race engineer estimated that racing slicks made a 3.2% difference in lap times over DOT R-compounds (and 7.1% over a non-shaved street tire).

http://malcolmstrachan.wordpress.com...-racing-tires/

Applying that rough conversion:

1:01:51 -- KTM X-Bow -- 1916 lbs / 241 hp = 7.95 lbs/hp
1:01.87 -- Griffon 86 -- 2276 lbs / 200 hp = 11.38 lbs/hp
1:02.18 -- Lotus 2-Eleven -- 1707 lbs / 256 hp = 6.67 lbs/hp
1:03.77 -- Lotus Exige Cup 260 -- 1958 lbs / 260 hp = 7.53 lbs/hp


This is what I mean when I say that -- even accounting for tires -- it's still hugely impressive what the engineers have done with the Griffon 86.

[Dezoris]

Bring a Ferrari or Lotus with factory support and factory driver to the track then compare times. Its a small track in Japan. Most super cars would never use that as a bench mark ever.

Take the Griffin to Mugello or Silverstone. Its just not objective this post.