My AP Exhaust Problems!

[Sportsguy83]

I think the, (horse has been beaten), it is what it is. Majority of forum members know what they are all about. We all just need to put our money where our mouth is. As you all can see in the other thread, there will always be someone who doesn't care how crappy they are and are still going to support them.

As more problems start to surface, they will probably get the same accolades from the other forums (Ban)

[track_warrior]

Originally Posted by vividracing

I could back up how warranties work with any product on the planet when misused, abused, dropped, drug, over-tightened, under-tightened, etc.

I could use this fancy hyperlink feature to post threads of the OP happy with the system, happy with how this system held up after FALLING OFF THE CAR due.

Sean if i remember correctly in your email you even mentioned that even if it was over tightened this should not happen. I over tightened it because it was popping off the way i had it before. And yes at first i gave you the benefit of the doubt on the quality of the system when the mid pipe popped off where it connects to the y pipe. I thought to my self hmm maybe i did not tighten the clamp strongly enough and since i was a loyal customer and had not had any issues with you guys i gave you the benefit of the doubt and tried to support you as much as i could and you are taking advantage of this. The clamp was not damaged only the pipe was bent and this was no where near the junction of the mid pipe and Y pipe, i had the track mechanic inspect it after i tightened it again and he approved it and said it was good to go, so this was my mechanic skills plus a tech at the track, and the pipe still popped off and leaks you can see the snoot coming out of the pipe joint. Then i noticed the right canister was leaking but i checked it and it was tight, to my surprise the next track section it was popping off as well then i tightened it as much as i can and noticed it was not getting tighter because it un welded. Between the mid pipe connection to the y pipe and the right canister popping off and burning my diffuser i had one hell of a time at the track.

Here is the email transcript:

Originally Posted by vividracing

I could offer yet another blow-out deal on the product to another forum member to show how to install it, how to tighten it, how to align tips, etc.

I'm not going to do these things, I'm not going to add anymore to this to be "quoted" a thousand times to hear a hundred different reasons on why the customer is always right and the OP should get a free item no matter what it has been through. I am not going to confirm that these parts cannot be used on the track or enter into an engineering debate on what clamp is the best to use for this system.

I know how to work on a car and i did not over tighten the exhaust, my local shop took a look at the exhaust and the flaw is in the amount of pipe the clamps grab onto plus the clamps are not strong enough. You have changed the design of this exhaust multiple times and mine was a shitty version, i even had one tip with a logo and one without. What pisses me off more about you as a company is that i have spent a ton of money and have been a loyal customer since back in the day. I have even spoken up when people speak badly about vivid and said i had never had a bad experience.

This was probably because i had never had any single issue with something you have sold me until now, and it sucks to know i have no support from you guys when something you sold me fails. And for you to even doubt that i was probably trying to get a free exhaust because i could have hit it while loading it on the trailer is just plain rude. It doesnt work that way Sean, thankfully i am well off and honest and dont have the necessity to do that, if you take a look at my order history you would know that. Im not going to tell Rob and Dan how to run their company but if they approve of the way you warranty your products and treat your loyal customers they need a lesson in Customer Service, i really hope this is not the case because i have some respect for them. Im really hoping this was just your personal opinions and way of conducting business.

Im not asking for a free exhaust i am asking what is fair, how would you have fixed a bent, scratched, un welded exhaust. Making your costumer pay close to 200 on shipping when that is almost your cost in your exhaust it is ridiculous. And yes im sure your cost on it is around the 200-250 dollar range since whole sale is around 500 as greedy as you seem im sure you are making at least 250 on it or even more like 600 since vivid owns AP, i just checked my invoice and paid 845 Green ones for the exhaust. It baffles me to know you would rather loose a loyal costumer than to just suck it up with a defective product that you made a ton of money selling it to me anyways. I posted the example of how boomba and tomei responded to their defective products in comparison to Vivid & AP.

I just found a message on my phone from a rep from AP i will get in touch with him tomorrow and explain what is wrong and see what he says.


Here is an example of a case with Megan Racing, a company that has been bashed for being cheap. Even they have great Customer service and offer replacement when their products fail!!

http://forums.evolutionm.net/vendor-...cked-pipe.html

Originally Posted by WithNolock

I’d like to add a little balance to the conversation if I may. I have owned the AP exhaust for some time now and I’m quite happy with it. It’s a great looking exhaust, has a good sound, is quite light and provides a hp bump comparable to the other exhausts out there. The fit and finish is perfect and I’ve had no problems to date. As for the longevity of the exhaust, only time will tell.

As for Vivid as a company, I have had no problems with them either. I’m local so I have actually met Dan and their sales manager Sean so it’s a little bit difficult for me to stand by and watch people throw out these very personal attacks. Are they out to make money? Of course they are! No one in their right mind would start a business without having profit as one of their goals. Where you get into trouble is when you put profit in front of customer service. Believe me, I have seen the complaints against Vivid Racing and many have solid reasons why they feel wronged. I just want people on the forum to know that they do have customers that are happy with their products and service.

Was I happy with the debacle that was the original dyno thread? No.
Do I think Vivid/AP is a perfect company? Of course not!
But I did want share my experiences so everyone out there has all the positive and negative information to make their own decisions.

I met a guy one, great guy he was a friend of a friend. Invited me to his awesome house a couple of times we chilled had a bbq and some beers. Then i found out he got arrested and was a big time drug cartel money launderer. You cant judge a book by its cover man, he said he was a banker.

[JoeBoxer]

Going back and charging a restocking fee after it had already been waived just because you aren't buying more from them? Nice gesture.

[track_warrior]

Originally Posted by JoeBoxer

Going back and charging a restocking fee after it had already been waived just because you aren't buying more from them? Nice gesture.

Worse thing was that it is a status seat belt harness!! They own Status, its in the same building!!

At the end Sean waived the fee thats why i did not bother posting it here but yeah it did piss me off a bit when i saw that, and also when over the phone he said that calling their exhaust a pile of junk was not helping my situation. Thats why i said earlier in my reply to vivid that i really hope Dan and Rob dont approve of this type of Customer Service because i still have some sort of respect for them, ive talked to Rob over the phone and he seems like a good guy. Ill be speaking to the rep from AP tomorrow and ill let you guys know how it goes.

[JoeBoxer]

That's good they didn't go back on that, Sean seems like he means well but management may have his hands tied. I will still not support them and hope people can get their problems resolved if they do have them.

[Supermassive]

Now I'm curious how many companies that you are not local to, would they have met your expectations in the manner you demand? When you escalate things on forums you will always end up with two sides to the story, and the general population on forums are consumers, not suppliers, so the views are automatically skewed to be against the supplier, because we are all somehow ingrained with this belief that the customer is always right.

Pcasso, your situation sucks, but as an early adopter of a product (I think you were one of the very first to have the AP system) you had to know there might be hiccups in the design, especially since the first exhausts were actually hand assembled in their garage not in some factory because back then it was still technically "prototype". The other part of your situation that sucks is that almost any exhaust manufacturer is going to need you to send the broken part in so they can determine for themselves what the cause of the damage was. In this case you can scream up and down the block AP sucks because their design was faulty, but if you don't send them the broken part they cant assess it for themselves and see if it is a warranty item or at worst offer to replace it at a discount. Every small company will ask you to ship the part, and yes it will be at your expense. Now if it is found to be their fault alot of times a reputable company will reimburse the cost of shipping.

I just feel like somehow the OP is blowing this way out of proportion, knowing that this forum is already trending towards hating VR/AP and citing issues from old forums as reason enough to just jump on the bandwagon. No good conversations will ever result from this and the point is moot. I constantly hear people bashing VR/AP and I find it to be so contrary from my own experiences that it seems unbelievable at times. I guess I must be the silent minortiy or something since I have spent an absurd amount of money with VR and have always gotten good customer service and discounting.

Sadly my response will be gunned down in a hail of e-bullets from hundreds of dissatisfied customers who have never even dealt with VR and base their opinions entirely on the inflammatory reviews of a select few with extraordinary issues, instead of the hundreds of silent customers who have never had a problem so they have no reason to post. Forums are a naturally hostile environment because people post more about problems than how good something is, just the nature of the beast I guess.

That said if you don't like it don't buy it. Hell I'm running an exhaust that very few people on this board have even heard about, but I'm sure someone on this board will find something wrong with my choice of P&L Motorsports...

[track_warrior]

Originally Posted by Supermassive

Now I'm curious how many companies that you are not local to, would they have met your expectations in the manner you demand? When you escalate things on forums you will always end up with two sides to the story, and the general population on forums are consumers, not suppliers, so the views are automatically skewed to be against the supplier, because we are all somehow ingrained with this belief that the customer is always right.

Pcasso, your situation sucks, but as an early adopter of a product (I think you were one of the very first to have the AP system) you had to know there might be hiccups in the design, especially since the first exhausts were actually hand assembled in their garage not in some factory because back then it was still technically "prototype". The other part of your situation that sucks is that almost any exhaust manufacturer is going to need you to send the broken part in so they can determine for themselves what the cause of the damage was. In this case you can scream up and down the block AP sucks because their design was faulty, but if you don't send them the broken part they cant assess it for themselves and see if it is a warranty item or at worst offer to replace it at a discount. Every small company will ask you to ship the part, and yes it will be at your expense. Now if it is found to be their fault alot of times a reputable company will reimburse the cost of shipping.

I just feel like somehow the OP is blowing this way out of proportion, knowing that this forum is already trending towards hating VR/AP and citing issues from old forums as reason enough to just jump on the bandwagon. No good conversations will ever result from this and the point is moot. I constantly hear people bashing VR/AP and I find it to be so contrary from my own experiences that it seems unbelievable at times. I guess I must be the silent minortiy or something since I have spent an absurd amount of money with VR and have always gotten good customer service and discounting.

Sadly my response will be gunned down in a hail of e-bullets from hundreds of dissatisfied customers who have never even dealt with VR and base their opinions entirely on the inflammatory reviews of a select few with extraordinary issues, instead of the hundreds of silent customers who have never had a problem so they have no reason to post. Forums are a naturally hostile environment because people post more about problems than how good something is, just the nature of the beast I guess.

That said if you don't like it don't buy it. Hell I'm running an exhaust that very few people on this board have even heard about, but I'm sure someone on this board will find something wrong with my choice of P&L Motorsports...

Dude understand i have spent a huge amount of money on my cars and most of the parts came from vivid, they have made quite a bit of cash from me. My Evo X Track build 500whp , 240SX Fully built SR with Tomei parts, Nissan GT-R R35, E90 M3, C63 . These are all cars that i have had and modded with parts mostly bought from them. I have nothing against AP or Vivid, i just wanted to share my experience as a long time customer of them and what i have gone through. I was once blind and defended them just like you did until the shit hit the fan, Tomei is freaking in Japan and they sent me a replacement.

You say that every single company would ask me to send the exhaust back? Check the megan thread i posted, they were sending replacement outs because of a defect on their manifold. Tomei sent me a new turbo outlet pipe when the one i had cracked after two track days i only had to send them pictures and they asked what happened i explained and they sent me a new one, same thing with boomba i posted that link earlier in the thread.

Im not trying to be a douche but AP's cost on the exhaust is probably around $250 since they whole sale it for around $500, the profit margin is even bigger here since i purchased it from Vivid and they own AP. So on average when vivid sells an AP exhaust they are making around 500-600 bucks. I would have gladly cross shipped if they would have offered a replacement, but having to send it in and loose two track days that i had paid for + shipping both ways and being without a track car for a while was way more costly than just buying a new exhaust specially something that would not break down at the track and then have my warranty voided because i tracked the car lol, thats why i picked up one from Evasive.

[JoeBoxer]

Did you get the Evasive single exit?

[track_warrior]

Originally Posted by Supermassive

Pcasso, your situation sucks, but as an early adopter of a product (I think you were one of the very first to have the AP system) you had to know there might be hiccups in the design, especially since the first exhausts were actually hand assembled in their garage not in some factory because back then it was still technically "prototype".

So Toyota should void warranties on all 2013 FR-S's because its a first year and the car has all these issues because its a prototype? Really man?

Originally Posted by JoeBoxer

Did you get the Evasive single exit?

I got a really good deal on the Invidia so i jumped on it meanwhile, im really waiting for a single exit titanium.

[Freeman]

Originally Posted by clayrush

LOL
how many pages of do think we will have of back and forth this time.

I say 5 pages before the thread gets locked

[SubaSteve]

I'm a little disappointed in the way vivid responded. I expect vendors to respond in a respectable manner and not in a personal way. You are currently representing your company please do so in an appropriate way.

Also why is it okay that they all use the same account? I like how perrin has separate accounts for each person. I have to say I like John from vivid but noone else seems to measure up.

[track_warrior]

Ill be speaking to an AP rep tomorrow about the problem they called and left me a voice mail. Hopefully i can explain the situation and this works out in the best way.

[ttknf]

Originally Posted by pcasso87

Ill be speaking to an AP rep tomorrow about the problem they called and left me a voice mail. Hopefully i can explain the situation and this works out in the best way.

So raising a stink on the forums worked. It's sad that it took you going that far to get them to do anything proactive to assist you.

[track_warrior]

Originally Posted by ttknf

So raising a stink on the forums worked. It's sad that it took you going that far to get them to do anything proactive to assist you.

Sucks i have a Invidia on the way that i paid with my money because of a defective part. Sometimes help arrives a little to late, but we will see what happens......