Agency Power Crank Pulley / Clutch Masters Flywheel

[fenton]

Originally Posted by AkaJabari

What I'm saying is that a 14% recuperation in drivetrain loss from a flywheel and a lightened pulley is not mechanically possible.

I agree and didnt say that it was. I was pointing out the other options of dyno calibration and many months between dyno's as a factor.

[whiteout fr-s]

Why is this thread so negative? What other companies are posting dyno runs for lightweight flywheels?

sent from my HTC one s

[SkAsphalt]

That is a huge issue right there in terms of consistency. at least 10hp could come out of the engine being broken in alone + temperature in the shop

Originally Posted by fenton

The runs are two months apart so that could be some of the issue.

[Bonburner]

I'm glad they haven't found issues with lightweight flywheel and pulley
While you guys are at it replace ALL pulleys!

[86drift]

Not sure if I've missed it, but what are the weights for the clutch, flywheel and pulley?

Thanks for dyno testing the flywheel/clutch/pulley combo. This will be one of my first mods.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by 86drift

Not sure if I've missed it, but what are the weights for the clutch, flywheel and pulley?

Thanks for dyno testing the flywheel/clutch/pulley combo. This will be one of my first mods.

Disregard, misunderstood @86drift question.

[86drift]

Originally Posted by sportsguy83

LMAO.... First post of this thread. Clutch is weighted with the flywheel, then flywheel by itself (subtract both and you get Clutch).

Pulley is 4.9 Lbs from a quick search on the site.

Um. Looks like the stock clutch and flywheel weighed. I want to know the weight of the replacements.

[Sportsguy83]

Originally Posted by 86drift

Um. Looks like the stock clutch and flywheel weighed. I want to know the weight of the replacements.

Opps... my bad.... You should have specified in your post.

Edit: you are correct, it was kind of obvious. I jumped the gun!

[86drift]

Originally Posted by sportsguy83

Opps... my bad.... You should have specified in your post.

Yeh, I could have. But thought it was obvious cos the stock weights are in the first post. No problems, I don't get offended easily.


I have access to a lightened flywheel and would like to see how it compares to this one. For what it's worth I think they're a good $/hp upgrade.

[Mr. Sociable]

I'll repost what I put in the AP exhaust thread as well, since it's relevant here:

Originally Posted by TwinscrollGT35R

Stop being a tool and read the threads.

All the info has been posted. You clearly have a bone to pick.

No, he's asking valid questions of a company. Lets look:



Run 1 (labeled 2800 Cal FRS Baseline Run 4) was done on 5/09 at 3:20pm.
Run 2 (labeled Stock everything 1) was done 7/20 at 7:18pm.
Run 3 (labeled AP Header back exhaust stock intake) was done 7/19 at 8:05pm.

This means header back exhaust run (which also apparently includes the pulley/flywheel despite it not being mentioned in the last thread) was done before the "stock everything" run, which would be just the crank pulley/flywheel. To do this, they would have had to dyno a baseline, then install all the parts, including flywheel and crank pulley, dyno it, then remove the headerback and put the stock exhaust back on and dyno again to get just the gains from the flywheel/crank pulley, then reinstall the AP exhaust. Doesn't make any sense to do it that way.

Disregarding that , we run into a few issues.

First, Vivid claims:

Originally Posted by vividracing

Run#2 Was with the Flywheel and Crank Pulley.

This would mean that either they're lying, or they've incorrectly labeled the runs in the dyno. I see no reason why someone would take the time to label all the runs and still manage to get them incorrect, but hey...not my shop. They make zero mention on the dyno graph that the car had a pulley/flywheel installed.

Second, let's look at this picture (since I can't quote from the other thread now that it's closed):


Here, you can clearly see the same dyno run name (AP Header back exhaust stock intake run 2) but they make NO claim or note of there being a pulley or flywheel installed. They're claiming the entire power gain from the exhaust alone. Now they're going to change their story and claim there were parts that weren't mentioned the first time? Misleading and unethical. They were asked multiple times in the first few pages of the other thread and they never mentioned the crank pully or flywheel.

Third, even if it was an honest mistake on their part (I have my doubts that it was), the times of the dyno runs are equally important. An all stock baseline run done at 3:00pm (aka the hottest part of the day) will have wildly different ambient temperatures than the other runs done during the evening. I don't care if the car sat for a month or a day, ambient temperature matters when dyno testing. Additionally, that's the 4th baseline run, meaning heatsoak begins to be a consideration. How was the car allowed to cool off? Compare this to the 1st or 2nd runs that the other ones are listed as and we have a discrepancy.


I don't even care about how much peak HP was made. Claim 150whp or claim 200whp, that will vary by dyno. What matters to me is the claims of +XXhp over the baseline runs, numbers which aren't believable and have too many discrepancies to have any valid sense of proof. Throw in the mismarketing of the steel type and every other problem that has been brought up and I see little reason to believe anything that's been claimed so far.


Someone feel free to prove me wrong. Do an independent dyno test and show similar gains. Until then, I await Vivid's response. I've tried to be tactful and would like explanations that make sense. Hell, send me the parts, I'll dyno them, post results, and ship them back.

Mods - I could care less about their previous history or anything else related to Vivid. Only trying to validate what I find to be difficult to believe numbers. They were given a clean slate, let them prove that it's still clean.

[Anorexic 86]

I just love a good drama/horror/action/adventure tread!

[2forme]

This, combined with the exhaust thread.....I don't see this ending well for Vivid....AP's reputation is being tarnished in the process as well.

[noAE86]

Originally Posted by AkaJabari

What I'm saying is that a 14% recuperation in drivetrain loss from a flywheel and a lightened pulley is not mechanically possible. Maybe if the pulley in question was physically smaller in diameter and underdriving accessories. Maybe if you removed the A/C unit and were running a Carbon Fiber driveshaft as well. None of these things are happening on the car tested.

What the OP is implying from his post is that the products he will sell you will indeed net a 15% gain in HP across the entire powerband. There are no disclaimers in the OPs post that these pulls were done months apart. The car was not rebaselined before the parts were installed to give you a legitament sense of what power gains you could expect for these parts, if any. What the OP is selling you is snake oil.

What the mods WILL do are the following:

A lightened flywheel reduces the rotational mass of the engine. Same as a lightened crankpulley. With these mods, the engine will rev up and down the RPM range quicker. The net result is the car behaving like it's ~200 lbs lighter in 1st gear. Each gear thereafter the weight loss is exponentially lessened. It may net you 1-2 HP. MAYBE.

This is all I have to say about these claims. There will be no more posts from me on this vendor.

first off let me say, i have never heard of vividracing before this thread, and have no bias. i don't even live any where close to the USA,

but what was posted by AkaJabari is the truth, this is just 101 physics at work, there is no making power or "freeing up power" its just less load on the engine when accelerating,

dumping that dead body in the trunk will have the same effect,

[whiteout fr-s]

I'll tell you what vivid, send me the same parts, ill dyno them here in mass on my own car, and then post results. Not being a jerk either, just offering a solution to all the negativity and it will help your rep

sent from my HTC one s