Downforce/Drag/Aero

[humfrz]

Originally Posted by Spuds

Don't get me started on wing vs spoiler...

Also, nice license plate.

Thanks for the comment about the plate. mrs humfrz got me that so I could remember my plate number when checking into motels ...... without having to come back out and look ......

My bad on my reference to a "wing", I reckon I should have said "spoiler".

I just learnt this off the interweb ......is it about right .... ??

I quote: "To summarize:

• Both wings and spoilers reduce up-lift at the tail of the vehicle, but use different mechanisms.

• Wings are airfoils designed to directly deflect air upwards and thus push the rear of the vehicle down. They generally add quite a bit of drag.

• Spoilers are barricades to undesirable flows, and thus are able to reshape airflow streams around the vehicle. This can help keep the rear of the vehicle down and decrease drag by changing the effective vehicle shape."

Is that about right ... ??


humfrz

[guybo]

-you can add a lip and sideskirts and lower the car to reduce drag and go full flat underbody and add a diffuser too. This will add weight, but reduce drag in other areas. Not having a wind tunnel at your disposal (going out on a limb and assuming you don't!) you'll have to do trial and error to get them set up right.

-trim out the wing. Reduce the angle of attack, but not too much because if the wing stalls out, you'll have all the drag and none of the DF.

-vortex generators are supposed to channel the air over the rear of the car and make the wing more efficient.

-a gurney flap is supposed to reduce drag some too- IF it is set up right for this. If not, it can add DF and increase drag.

[Slammillionaire]

Larger side panels on the wing may reduce drag as well

[dattran86]

Get rid of the wing,

spend money on thing that actually make you faster...like track day/autocross and TIRES.

the worst thing is to show up to a track day with a car that has huge aeros, overly modded as a mediocre driver and you're slower than the next guy in a completely stock 86

[Spuds]

Originally Posted by humfrz

Thanks for the comment about the plate. mrs humfrz got me that so I could remember my plate number when checking into motels ...... without having to come back out and look ......

My bad on my reference to a "wing", I reckon I should have said "spoiler".

I just learnt this off the interweb ......is it about right .... ??

I quote: "To summarize:

• Both wings and spoilers reduce up-lift at the tail of the vehicle, but use different mechanisms.

• Wings are airfoils designed to directly deflect air upwards and thus push the rear of the vehicle down. They generally add quite a bit of drag.

• Spoilers are barricades to undesirable flows, and thus are able to reshape airflow streams around the vehicle. This can help keep the rear of the vehicle down and decrease drag by changing the effective vehicle shape."

Is that about right ... ??


humfrz

When you are talking specifically about cars it's pretty close. The important demarcation is the effect of the object rather than the shape.

In general wings create force independent of other bodies they may be attached to.

Spoilers are used to separate (spoil) the flow from a body for any number of reasons. Most of the time the end goal is to reduce lift.

[JPRodney]

Well looking at the answers here and from other forums, I'm kinda upset this forum gave me the least of usable answers. Thank you to everyone that responded with some sort of help and not went off topic about FI, track days, NA, etc.

The issue was my angle of attack, it was slightly too aggressive and providing too much drag. I've fixed the angle and reduced the amount of drag due to some professional help. Thanks to everyone that gave similar answers or tried to help despite my difficult goals.

Also I will be tracking the car but I wanted it to be a daily as well. I'm challenging myself to create a balance without too much compromise. For long trips I will just take the wing off since it has brackets.

Pictures for interest.

[IMG][/IMG]
http://imgur.com/dVqOJVi

[JPRodney]

Originally Posted by TommyW

Further depleting the power is just stupid. There cars are not GT3's.

They're not? You dont say.

[Slammillionaire]

Originally Posted by JPRodney

Well looking at the answers here and from other forums, I'm kinda upset this forum gave me the least of usable answers.

You got a lot of very good answers here tho, including the ones that advise to remove the wing.

[JPRodney]

Originally Posted by Slammillionaire

You got a lot of very good answers here tho, including the ones that advise to remove the wing.

Which I thanked correctly, I think you know what posts I'm talking about. Anyways I got what I was looking for and thank you for the advice Slamm.

[JD001]

Originally Posted by Slammillionaire

Larger side panels on the wing may reduce drag as well

Need to look at the aero industry for inspiration...

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by JPRodney

Well looking at the answers here and from other forums, I'm kinda upset this forum gave me the least of usable answers.

We weren't the ones that slapped a BFW on the back of our street car without doing the research first.

[JPRodney]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

We weren't the ones that slapped a BFW on the back of our street car without doing the research first.

I did do my research and it fits my needs for what it will be used in the future. I was looking for alternative ways of reducing the drag coefficient of the wing without having to remove it.

Which the answer was the AoA - which I fixed last night, which reduced the drag and helped my gas milage to where I am happy.

The simple answer is to yes sell it, but I was looking for reasons on how to fix it or why that simple fix wouldn't work. Which some people here provided.

I never said I was an expert - I was just looking for advice. Did I jump the gun a little yes? But i also got the wing for 1/5th the price.

Thanks anyways!

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by JPRodney

I did do my research and it fits my needs for what it will be used in the future. I was looking for alternative ways of reducing the drag coefficient of the wing without having to remove it.

Which the answer was the AoA - which I fixed last night, which reduced the drag and helped my gas milage to where I am happy.

The simple answer is to yes sell it, but I was looking for reasons on how to fix it or why that simple fix wouldn't work. Which some people here provided.

I never said I was an expert - I was just looking for advice. Did I jump the gun a little yes? But i also got the wing for 1/5th the price.

Thanks anyways!

So lesson learned was make sure a mod will do what you want before you buy and install it?
I know you are new to this but modding for the sake of modding can really mess up a car.


Also, for future reference, you will find that if you ask a question such as this in the appropriate technical sub you will get far fewer jokes or banter answers. Asking a tech question in the general section will get you those responses.

[JPRodney]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

So lesson learned was make sure a mod will do what you want before you buy and install it?
I know you are new to this but modding for the sake of modding can really mess up a car.

That is a little bit of a stretch, and I'm also keeping future plans secret so I'll just have to agree here.

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Also, for future reference, you will find that if you ask a question such as this in the appropriate technical sub you will get far fewer jokes or banter answers. Asking a tech question in the general section will get you those responses.

This was useful, and I'll try and post in the correct section. I tried looking for an aero section with no avail. I also think it should be its own section since it's an import aspect. I'll just stick to the track section of the forum. Thanks!