2016 Solo National Championship roll call - who's going?

[justinco]

Originally Posted by xwd

That seems like a lot of rear camber but I remember sitting behind one other twin and it also having a lot of rear camber. I'm at ~-1.9 in the rear.

I think -2.5 to -3.0 is pretty common for STX? (could be wrong). 1.9 seems really low to me

[Locust]

I had a semi-lengthy chat with Dave (Whitener?) about the CS/DS move and the future of the ND Miata in CS. It was a little disheartening to see that the ND Miata really is that much faster than a TRD FR-S and from the discussion I had with him it sounds like they're going to leave the Miata right there as a class killer and move the non TRD cars down to DS. I don't think the gap between the TRD and non-TRDs is anywhere near as large as people have been making it out to be though. The ND Miatas were matching/beating AS and BS times which is just crazy and even if I don't run against an ND locally I still run PAX and will have to play with their index. Next year is going to be tough sledding if you run a twin in CS it seems.

Unfortunately it also sounds like on paper I technically will not be able to drop my RS1.0 down to DS so I'm not sure what I'm going to be doing next year. There's a chance I end up in STX with some of you guys but possibly in a different car.

[justinco]

Originally Posted by Locust

....There's a chance I end up in STX with some of you guys but possibly in a different car.

Get a 2017 twin

[xwd]

Originally Posted by justinco

I think -2.5 to -3.0 is pretty common for STX? (could be wrong). 1.9 seems really low to me

I checked with Bart and he is running -2, I'm sure Mike is running the same. When the early folks like Scroggs, Pallotta, and others were figuring the cars out, -2 was about where everyone landed. I don't know that -2 vs. -3 is going to make a ton of difference in cornering, probably more in braking and acceleration.

[e1_griego]

I'm at -2 and 1/16" or so of toe-in.

Also real solidly mid-pack so it probably means fuckall haha.

[justinco]

Originally Posted by xwd

I checked with Bart and he is running -2, I'm sure Mike is running the same. When the early folks like Scroggs, Pallotta, and others were figuring the cars out, -2 was about where everyone landed. I don't know that -2 vs. -3 is going to make a ton of difference in cornering, probably more in braking and acceleration.

Originally Posted by e1_griego

I'm at -2 and 1/16" or so of toe-in.

Also real solidly mid-pack so it probably means fuckall haha.

Hmm interesting. I'll have to go over the rear setup again with Mayfield and see what we want to do.

I just know that the rear camber/toe change was the biggest change (only one really) I made since Spring Nats, where the car was working pretty good. I was talking to Bart about it too, and he thought maybe the tires, but I only had 35'ish more runs on them since then.

[e1_griego]

A few other people I talked to are at zero toe in back. I'm probably going to try that for the beginning of next year just to see.

[DaWorstPlaya]

Originally Posted by Locust

I had a semi-lengthy chat with Dave (Whitener?) about the CS/DS move and the future of the ND Miata in CS. It was a little disheartening to see that the ND Miata really is that much faster than a TRD FR-S and from the discussion I had with him it sounds like they're going to leave the Miata right there as a class killer and move the non TRD cars down to DS. I don't think the gap between the TRD and non-TRDs is anywhere near as large as people have been making it out to be though. The ND Miatas were matching/beating AS and BS times which is just crazy and even if I don't run against an ND locally I still run PAX and will have to play with their index. Next year is going to be tough sledding if you run a twin in CS it seems.

I think The ND did very well on both courses due to gearing. The East course, which is usually the faster course, was geared well for the ND and didn't really require a shift to 3rd. I'm disappointed that the course this year wasn't as fast as last year's east course because that could've skewed the results, maybe?

I spoke with a few ND competitors and they said after the showcase turn, they were able to flat foot it into the slight right just as they hit the rev limiter and held it there without having to shift to 3rd.

I knew the West course was always going to favor the ND.

I'm with you. I don't think there is that big of a difference between the non-TRD and TRD twins. Does anyone think, if they move the non-TRD twins to DS, it will drive away all the WRXs, Minis and Cobalt in that class? Or more importantly how many twin drivers would jump ship to DS?

BTW nice FR-S TRD RS1. I wanted to come say Hi but never got a chance.

[Locust]

Originally Posted by DaWorstPlaya

I think The ND did very well on both courses due to gearing. The East course, which is usually the faster course, was geared well for the ND and didn't really require a shift to 3rd. I'm disappointed that the course this year wasn't as fast as last year's east course because that could've skewed the results, maybe?

I spoke with a few ND competitors and they said after the showcase turn, they were able to flat foot it into the slight right just as they hit the rev limiter and held it there without having to shift to 3rd.

I knew the West course was always going to favor the ND.

I'm with you. I don't think there is that big of a difference between the non-TRD and TRD twins. Does anyone think, if they move the non-TRD twins to DS, it will drive away all the WRXs, Minis and Cobalt in that class? Or more importantly how many twin drivers would jump ship to DS?

BTW nice FR-S TRD RS1. I wanted to come say Hi but never got a chance.

Thanks, I really didn't get any time to socialize. =\

I think we'll see a bunch of people jump ship to DS because if you look at the performance of the vehicles we will have the advantage over the WRX on most courses. I'm going to be very sad if it goes that way because I think it would be harmful to the sport to chase away the WRX by classing it with the FR-S/BRZ. I absolutely expect all the current DS drivers to leave that class if the move does indeed happen. What we'll end up with is two "spec" classes where if you aren't running an ND Miata or an FR-S/BRZ you are constantly at a disadvantage.

[cjd]

Re: rear camber, I just changed from -2.8 to -2.2 (tire temps led me there) and the balance of the car changed to more rear grip everywhere it's obvious. I haven't gone over the data to see if acceleration improved but I need to keep an eye on balance as it seems to require a different approach. Definitely feels like I can get on throttle sooner but was overdriving entry consistently on some slow corners last event. I haven't run it in Milwaukee yet, where I've been fighting for grip. I'm still slow so YMMV. I may also be facing tires that are past their prime, I was driving to events expecting to have traded them in by now and they still have time (I'd guess 4-5k miles and 200 runs)

[xtremeyolks]

I ran -2.4 rear with 0 toe at nationals. Seemed to work well enough. Maybe play with your shock settings or tire pressures some more.

Karlton

[justinco]

Originally Posted by cjd

Re: rear camber, I just changed from -2.8 to -2.2 (tire temps led me there) and the balance of the car changed to more rear grip everywhere it's obvious. I haven't gone over the data to see if acceleration improved but I need to keep an eye on balance as it seems to require a different approach. Definitely feels like I can get on throttle sooner but was overdriving entry consistently on some slow corners last event. I haven't run it in Milwaukee yet, where I've been fighting for grip. I'm still slow so YMMV. I may also be facing tires that are past their prime, I was driving to events expecting to have traded them in by now and they still have time (I'd guess 4-5k miles and 200 runs)

Thanks for the info. What bar are you running in the rear and suspension settings?

I can't think of what else would cause my car to be so loose at Lincoln except for the rear camber/toe changes. I started with the same suspension settings that worked good at Springs Nats. Any gas at all mid-corner or exit would make the car want to spin out. Wait til you see my video hah.

[justinco]

Originally Posted by xtremeyolks

I ran -2.4 rear with 0 toe at nationals. Seemed to work well enough. Maybe play with your shock settings or tire pressures some more.

Karlton

If you are the 3rd place Karlton, then ya I would say it worked all right (nice driving!)

Thanks for the feedback. We tried a few things during TnT on Monday (softened compression in the rear and lower pressures). Still had problems with rear grip.

It wasn't until we lowered the car for day two and took out even more rear pressure that it worked ok. After reading what you all are running for rear camber, I am now even more confused on what the problem could have been...90 run RE71R's? Seems unlikely though...last year my e36 had 125 runs on the its stones, and it was fine at Nats.

[cjd]

Originally Posted by justinco

Thanks for the info. What bar are you running in the rear and suspension settings?

I can't think of what else would cause my car to be so loose at Lincoln except for the rear camber/toe changes. I started with the same suspension settings that worked good at Springs Nats. Any gas at all mid-corner or exit would make the car want to spin out. Wait til you see my video hah.

Stock rear bar, Strano front. 10k/12k F/R at the moment and I'm suspecting I'd also find some help in lower rates but one change at a time. -3.3 can amber up front, zero toe all around.