Random Thoughts - Part Deux [NO POLITICS]

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

Really they could just start switching over on new equipment and phase out imperial over the next couple decades. All our lasers already use metric and have no option for inches. We have to convert all measurements to imperial

Sure, they could. Why should they, though? It's a lot of money out for no gain. Once it's all swapped to metric, it'll still be a Ford Taurus that they were going to sell anyways, so they made no money for their expenditure.

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

We never will switch everything to metric though. Imperial is too engrained in too much manufacturing to make such a switch a viable option. Take Ford Motor Co, for example. They would have to redesign all their vehicles to use metric, halt production, take a few months to retool all of their factories, negotiate new supply contracts, begin new production completely from scratch, and still continue to make parts in imperial for their legacy vehicles still under warranty. How much money would they lose in that process, and for what? Just to line up with other countries' standards? Why bother?

Chances are if we were building the entire country from scratch and had to pick one or the other with no previous experience, we'd go with metric and Celsius. But at this point, it's too engrained in society and there's no pressing reason to switch. Imperial and Fahrenheit work just fine.

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

Really they could just start switching over on new equipment and phase out imperial over the next couple decades. All our lasers already use metric and have no option for inches. We have to convert all measurements to imperial

We still use imperial for many things in all our factories to this very day. There are loads of metric parts already included in the Ford products actually and to convert the rest over would be a piece of cake logistically speaking. Pretty much just consumer products, distances, speeds and temperatures that are 100% metric here though.


My statement on temperature was more that there is no need to convert or use decimals and that the closest Celsius number gets the job done just fine

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

Sure, they could. Why should they, though? It's a lot of money out for no gain. Once it's all swapped to metric, it'll still be a Ford Taurus that they were going to sell anyways, so they made no money for their expenditure.

This is likely true. But it worked out ok for John Deere. I'm not saying Ford will do it, in fact, I'll bet they spent a bunch of money to figure out if they should bother or not. I'm saying it would be more convenient for most people to switch. The transition would be difficult but eventually everyone would get used to it. If we start by pushing it in school then the younger generation will grow up to implement it more completely. With more and more manufacturing going to metric using nations it makes even more sense to switch so you don't have to train your new workforce a brand new measuring system. And any parts that are "imperial" can be converted to metric without changing the part. In fact, drafting software will do this for you.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

We still use imperial for many things in all our factories to this very day. There are loads of metric parts already included in the Ford products actually and to convert the rest over would be a piece of cake logistically speaking. Pretty much just consumer products, distances, speeds and temperatures that are 100% metric here though.

My statement on temperature was more that there is no need to convert or use decimals and that the closest Celsius number gets the job done just fine

It would be very easy logistically. It would be a disaster economically. Time that they're not producing merchandise is money they're not making, plus the expense of the conversion itself. That's all loss, with no offsetting gain. If the expected benefit was worth it then they would have already done so, because their goal is to make money, not to stick to a measurement system.

Mileage signs are another thing. There are probably hundreds of thousands of miles of roads in the US with milemarker signs, not including exit signs in states that number their exits by the mile and random other road signs. They would ALL need to be changed out, and for what? What benefit justifies that expense? All it would cause is confusion and anger at wasted tax dollars.

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

I'm saying it would be more convenient for most people to switch.

And that's the point I'm debating. Why would it be more convenient? What benefit would the average person see in setting the dial to 23C vs 75F like their existing equipment does? Or knowing that their exit is in 3.2 kilometers instead of 2 miles like the current signs tell them? All they see is everything getting switched out and having to buy new parts when the old system worked just fine.

[Ashikabi]

I wouldn't mind my tax dollars being spent on that. At least it's something useful instead of spending it on military contract corruption/welfare abuse/ useless drug war etc

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

It would be very easy logistically. It would be a disaster economically. Time that they're not producing merchandise is money they're not making, plus the expense of the conversion itself. That's all loss, with no offsetting gain. If the expected benefit was worth it then they would have already done so, because their goal is to make money, not to stick to a measurement system.


Mileage signs are another thing. There are probably hundreds of thousands of miles of roads in the US with milemarker signs, not including exit signs in states that number their exits by the mile and random other road signs. They would ALL need to be changed out, and for what? What benefit justifies that expense? All it would cause is confusion and anger at wasted tax dollars.

Canada did it and we survived. I personally have zero passion one way or the other since I have lived through both systems and they are sort of blended in my brain anyway.


Disagree on the Ford thing though. I think you would find that the majority of the fasteners are already metric since it is a world market. Ask any mechanic and you will probably get a long story about having to keep two sets of tools even for "domestic" vehicles. The complete conversion could be done very easily over a face lift retool and they could actually save money by buying the same metric fasteners the rest of the world uses (to replace the few that they haven't already).

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

I wouldn't mind my tax dollars being spent on that. At least it's something useful instead of spending it on military contract corruption/welfare abuse/ useless drug war etc

Careful of the political line there Ashi!

[gramicci101]

I'd rather my tax dollars go into programs with clearly identified benefits to the majority of the people, like infrastructure repair and meaningful education reform. Large-scale conversion to metric solves no problems and creates new ones. The fields that need metric have already converted, driven by that need, not by regulation.

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Canada did it and we survived.

There's a problem of scale though. In 2012, Canada had a population that was 11% the size of the US*, and I'm willing to bet the manufacturing is on a similar scale. It would be a much less significant outlay to convert everything to metric, with proportionately less impact to their income. The same concept applies when people try to compare our systems to those of Nordic countries. What works for a population of 26M will not necessarily work for a population of 320M.


*http://dmc122011.delmar.edu/socsci/r...e/p-tab-02.htm

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by Tcoat

Careful of the political line there Ashi!

I'm not discussing politics. If someone wants to jump on me and claim the US govt spends every dime wisely then a discussion is starting. What's his face is taking about road signs that would have to be traded out by the feds. Therefore I feel my statement on alternative spending of a organisation(like Ford) is warranted assuming I don't engage anyone else specifically about said questionable spending.

Tl;dr, there is a whole thread about handguns in OT and no one cares cuz it's civil so unless someone gets butthurt it'll be ok

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

There's a problem of scale though. In 2012, Canada had a population that was 11% the size of the US*, and I'm willing to bet the manufacturing is on a similar scale.
*http://dmc122011.delmar.edu/socsci/r...e/p-tab-02.htm

With a correspondingly smaller tax base and revenue stream but a larger geographical area in which to place signs. Per capita it probably cost waaaaaay more to convert here then it would there.

[gramicci101]

Originally Posted by Ashikabi

I'm not discussing politics. If someone wants to jump on me and claim the US govt spends every dime wisely then a discussion is starting. What's his face is taking about road signs that would have to be traded out by the feds. Therefore I feel my statement on alternative spending of a organisation(like Ford) is warranted assuming I don't engage anyone else specifically about said questionable spending.

Tl;dr, there is a whole thread about handguns in OT and no one cares cuz it's civil so unless someone gets butthurt it'll be ok

I've got no problem with the discussion, but I think there are rules against outright politics.


It would be different pots of money and different reasons driving it. Ford either would or would not convert to metric because of what it would do to their profit margin. The gov't would designate billions of dollars to converting all the road signs purely because someone suggested that other countries are doing it and we want to be cool like they are, right?

[Ashikabi]

Originally Posted by gramicci101

I've got no problem with the discussion, but I think there are rules against outright politics.


It would be different pots of money and different reasons driving it. Ford either would or would not convert to metric because of what it would do to their profit margin. The gov't would designate billions of dollars to converting all the road signs purely because someone suggested that other countries are doing it and we want to be cool like they are, right?

Who knows. They'd try to fuck it up somehow. Some places have MPH and KPH on their road signs already but it's not common

[ScoobsMcGee]

Solution:



It doesn't matter if the answer is in KPH or MPH. Most drivers would get it wrong (or crash trying to figure it out) anyway.

[Tectoniic]

I like bringing up the Metric vs Imperial debate, it's almost as good as MT vs AT